What can Bethesda realistically do to make FO3 not suck?

[Deacdo]

Lets say Tod was serious and they're not going to turn FO3 into a crappy console FPS. Now, I suspect a lot of people on this forum don't really think Bethesda could make a quality FO3 even if they heeded the cries of the fans...

...but what could they do to ensure a reasonable starting point for modders (I know, bit of a stretch to rely on modders to make a game great, but it has happened before)?

Givens: Turn-based combat (would be nearly impossible to mod in), isometric perspective, proper dialog trees, scripting that allows for multiple solutions to quests, open ended world (that, at least, they should be able to do...though hopefully they don't waste resources on making it Oblivion/Morrowind/Daggerfall - like), tools set etc.

What else?

(if this thread is turns out to be interesting I'll summarize and toss it on the official forums to see what, if anything, happens)

 

[Zomg]

I just anthropomorphized a Beth attempt at TB combat as the guy that got dunked in radioactive waste in Robocop.

 

[Rat Keeng]

No facegen. Quite simple really, I believe you can tell everything about a game if it incorporates facegen, and for Fallout, it would be time spent so criminally wasteful, they couldn't possibly have bothered to make a decent game around this avatar-building simulator, which just so happens to be set in a post-nuclear universe.

What I really want is a sign though, a sign from Bethesda that they're moving in, if not the right direction, then just not the wrong direction. Like, "we've just hired five science-fiction writers who have all played Fallout, and we're confident they'll help us write an epic immersive amazing genre-breaking and genre-merging RPG."

Not that they fucking hired Qui-gon to do voiceovers, who gives a shit?

 

[OccupatedVoid]

Nothing.

Making it not suck would mean less $$$.

 

[Jung]

They could give the project to another developer?

 

[jiujitsu]

I don't believe Bethesda has the ability to get Fallout 3 right.

However, I think if they did get one aspect right it would be the atmosphere. The setting. I'm not too hopeful that they will, but it has the best shot. I played Morrowind and I enjoyed the atmosphere they created in that game. Aside from the cities which were deserted. NPC interaction isn't taken into account either in my analysis.

NPC interaction is definately a weak point in their other games. I hope they try hard to get it right for Fallout 3. I really hope they cut away to the same Pipboy dialogue screen for conversations. I could let go of the clay talking heads, but that would bring a tear to my eye if they used those instead of 3d graphics.

I guess we'll find out all these things in due time.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

They could use FIFE.

 

[OccupatedVoid]

They could use FIFE.

FIFE doesn't support SpeedTree. Bethesda plans to use that SpeedTree license they bought.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

FIFE doesn't support SpeedTree.

Then FIFE is teh suxxorz. SpeedTree is my favorite game ever.

 

[FrancoTAU]

The only realistic chance I see them making a good game is if they totally rip off Deus Ex or System Shock 2 with some uber graphics thrown in. It'd be nothing like Fallout 1 or 2, but I could at least find some enjoyment out of that.

Anyone who doesn't think we're getting Oblivion with guns is delusional though.

 

[Section8]

Well, they could avoid spending about $7 million on the license, therefore negating the need for a "blockbuster".

Or they could have a back catalogue of strong RPGs and present themselves as the sort of developer the Fallout forefathers would willingly work for.

They could closely examine Oblivion and realise that even a piece of shit game can sell millions and therefore strive to make a quality game and sell five times as many.

They could trawl the positive design discussion that take place here every now and then, participate and nut out some progressive ideas that don't necessarily stray from what an RPG should be.

Wait, missed the "realistically" in the topic line. Nevermind.

 

[yipsl]

The only realistic chance I see them making a good game is if they totally rip off Deus Ex or System Shock 2 with some uber graphics thrown in. It'd be nothing like Fallout 1 or 2, but I could at least find some enjoyment out of that.

Anyone who doesn't think we're getting Oblivion with guns is delusional though.

I admit, I never played Fallout or Fallout 2, though I did play Wasteland on the C64. I've also missed Deus Ex and System Shock, so I guess I'm not the target audience for Fallout 3 as I prefer sword and sorcery to post apocalyptic. I do enjoy space opera, which is why I enjoy Star Wars movies and the KOTOR series.

I still agree that we'll see a hatchet job of Oblivion with guns, but they might make some improvements along the line of Shivering Isles. It would be better if they gave you guys a Daggerfall with guns, or at least a Morrowind with guns; but there's a total conversion for that, and it's post apocalyptic too (ashes of apocalypse), I wonder if Bethesda will "borrow" from it the way they "borrowed" ideas from Morrowind modders used in Oblivion?

 

[MessiahMan]

I'd SAY the only saving grace in my eyes would be good dialogue, because I know the game's gonna be a hackjob. But this is Bethesda. Unless they outsource it, their track record shows beyond a shadow of a doubt, that they can't write a decent dialogue worth a shit.

 

[SimpleComplexity]

They could give the project to another developer?

Jeah, there are two, which`d be good for Fallout compared to Bethesda:

Rockstar: Fallout 3: New Reno - Big town to explore, stealing horse`s from raiders or stealing rare cars from the people. A big variety of weapons, 20 to be accurate. Ingame cutscenes, where the given Vault Dweller character says nothing. Statistics like food/sex appeal/respect to define the new way of roleplaying. Gangfights, baby. 50`s setting radio music in your car or horse.

Addons: no, but a Fallout 4 on the same engine after one year.
Systems: Xbox360, PS3, PC, PSP.

Blizzard: Fallout III: Isometric view, yay. Concept art real to the Fallout universe, yay. Comiclook, yay. Roleplayingpart: Thousands over thousands of weapons, each have different random generated statistics, also included unique setitems, rare items and weaponsslots for your nuclear gems. Different endings, all of them are epic modelled 3d rendered high quality scenes. The intro begins with "War. War never changes" followed by a World of Warcraft ad.

Addons: yes, at least one.
Systems: PC only

 

[OverrideB1]

Realistically? Fire Howard the Muppet and Gobshite Hines, hire some decent SF writers, can Liam fucking Neeson's voice-overs, hire some ex Fallout developers, drop their plans for super-uber-fuck off graphical goodness, and -- for the first time in 10 years -- make a decent fucking game.

Really realistically? None of the above will happen and we'll get the much anticipated "Oblivion with guns" (TM) that they're planning now and that they're convinced FO fans everywhere are just dying to play. Because they are fuckwads who have lost touch with their fans and beleive their "vision" is the only thing that counts: not decent gameplay, not the RPG elements, not consistancy or remaining true to a franchise. Their "vision" is all that matters.

I honestly don't think that Bethesda -- as it currently exists -- could make a decent RPG if their lives depended on it. Certainly they won't make a decent FO3 -- Liam Neeson; the pretty, pretty images posted so far; and their recent track-record make that painfully obvious.

 

[denizsi]

Locate one of the suits, seduce him, form a relationship and then start a "oh I just saw my nephew play this game, Fallout, though I thought the game was still in the making at your company. Anyway, I don't know anything about games, but it was more fantastic than anything I've been seeing around lately, like that piece of trash my other nephew, who is a retard, adores. Kudos to you for making such a different and enjoyable game".

Yes ladies, step up for this epic historical quest.

 

[Monolith]

They could try to make an actual sequel, instead of their own game using the Fallout license just to break some nerds' hearts. They are so cruel.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

The only realistic chance I see them making a good game is if they totally rip off Deus Ex or System Shock 2 with some uber graphics thrown in.

I doubt they could even do that properly or with any integrity.

One things for sure, thjis will be the purdiest FO evar!!

 

[RK47]

if they can make a STALKER style of combat. i'm happy enough. then i'll download mods to enable every npc to be killed.

 

[Edward_R_Murrow]

They could start drinking.....heavily.

 

[Avu]

They could start drinking.....heavily.

I don't think drink can cut it in this particular instance. Something much more potent is probably required.

 

[JarlFrank]

They could start drinking.....heavily.

I don't think drink can cut it in this particular instance. Something much more potent is probably required.

Heck, then it would become the best game ever, in a very very freaky way.
I bet this would give them some quite amazing dialogue ideas.

Questgiver: "You must find... oooh... no no no you must not! You must... you need to... WAAAAGH" *shoots himself in the head*
Response option 1: "Hey, you spilled your brain on me!"
Response option 2: "I didn't get it, could you repeat yourself? Hey, hello? Do you hear me? Hellooooo?"
Response option 3: "Wow, I like your new hairstyle. Especially how it melts in with your brain and skull pieces. Can you tell me who your barber is?"

 

[SimpleComplexity]

Even Liam Neesons greatest voice acting won`t prevent Fallout 3 from sucking.

Seriously, which NextGenKiddie is interested in playing some 50s setting shit, with music, who reminds them on their singing grandmas or grandpas. Also vaults and all that, which doesn`t make sense to them. They`ll just skip the intro. The only thing, those kids understand is shooting some mutants, just like in Stalker. They will claim that Stalker was the better FPS, Fallout 3 is too complicated and the gameplay was too slow. They will also wonder, why the hell is it possible to have dialogues with people, i guess its not so cool to show it to their homies or friends. Choosing such words like "Shut up bitch" and other shit, just to get some fight. Intelligence 1 and Strength 9 will be recommended by some Fallout 3 action-walkthrough from some dumbed down game magazine, which gave Fallout 3 92% or 10/10 - Best RPG of the year whatever. And when they finally find a car in Fallout, they will try to search for the next auto pimping workshop to install some neonlights, which they`ll never find. Expect some shitty mod, which adds a Ferrari or a car pimp garage or something, made by a 14 year old boy. And all those critiques will be posted later on the official Fallout 4 forums, while Todd and his dev team already finished like 80 % of the game. Fallout 4 will be like the step from Morrowind(Fallout 3) to Oblivion(Fallout 4).

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Commit seppuku? I kid, I kid.


Commit mass seppuku.

 

[yipsl]

Really realistically? None of the above will happen and we'll get the much anticipated "Oblivion with guns" (TM) that they're planning now and that they're convinced FO fans everywhere are just dying to play. Because they are fuckwads who have lost touch with their fans and beleive their "vision" is the only thing that counts: not decent gameplay, not the RPG elements, not consistancy or remaining true to a franchise. Their "vision" is all that matters.

I don't blame Todd Howard, or Kathode for that matter. Even Pete's just their marketing guy, and that makes him a yes man. The people who are to blame are the owners of Zenimax. They're the ones who brought focus groups into this thing. Just look at what they did before they reinvented their company with money from Elder Scrolls fans. They were on to something when they bought Bethesda Softworks.

The thing I ask myself is would I prefer no Elder Scrolls to today's Elder Scrolls? I'd prefer better Elder Scrolls, but there's always the chance that the devs can convince the lawyers at Zenimax that the market is there for classic stuff instead of mainstreaming fluff. I'd rather think the devs have tried, but can only do so much, since they don't control the company.

As far as it goes, Oblivion might be the MacDonalds of RPGs, loaded with mainstreaming virtual transfat that makes the game taste good when it's hot but which loses it's taste when it gets cold. It won't have the staying power of Morrowind, that is my prediction. Zenimax won't care, because they'll have the next serving of virtual transfat filled mainstreaming goodness in Fallout 3 and TES 5.