Why buy the cow?

[Slaine]

fact number one:
>>developers ain't getting a damn shit from sales<<

fact number two:
>>you won't save your franchise nor are you going to make an incentive for game industry by buying a game to make good games<<
... the only thing you do is promoting status quo -> the reason why there is 12?! final fantasies 4 unreal tournaments (or is it 5?) and so on. Conclusion: >> by not buying games there comes a chance that we might see something new and original and hopefully good.

fact number three:
price of 3 newest games = price of newest Geforce

 

[Vault Dweller]

Kinsella is a fucking moron. Yes, if you take my car, I no longer have it, and if you copy my work, I still have my copy, but the roles of car and intellectual properties are very different. By taking intellectual property without paying, you are taking away someone's MONEY and if you do that, he/she would no longer have them, would he now? You are taking away the job, which is way, way more important than a car.

How is copying a game equivalent to stealing money?

You are not very bright, are you?

A developer makes a game expecting to earn a certain amount of money by selling it, just like a carpenter who makes a table expects to sell it. Both products = money. Just because one product is a physical object and another product is a program doesn't make any difference. By stealing a game you steal the money the developer could have gotten otherwise.

Here is an example. Troika makes Arcanum, Sierra fucks up and sit on the game for 6 months while everyone and their fucking dog are stealing the game. Result: Arcanum sells very poorly, Troika makes no money, and things go downhill eventually killing Troika.

It all hinges on the origin of property.

No, it all hinges on the origin of one's fucking decency. It's that simple and there is no need to overcomplicate it.

With no scarcity, there would be no property. For IP, there is no scarcity, so there is no property.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of.

<Tucker's quotes>

You took them way, way out of context, if you are using them to justify piracy.

 

[Vault Dweller]

fact number one:
>>developers ain't getting a damn shit from sales<<

They do. Don't talk about things you don't understand. They make you look stupid.

fact number two:
>>you won't save your franchise nor are you going to make an incentive for game industry by buying a game to make good games<<

Neither true nor false.

 

[mathboy]

fact number one:
>>developers ain't getting a damn shit from sales<<

fact number two:
>>you won't save your franchise nor are you going to make an incentive for game industry by buying a game to make good games<<
... the only thing you do is promoting status quo -> the reason why there is 12?! final fantasies 4 unreal tournaments (or is it 5?) and so on. Conclusion: >> by not buying games there comes a chance that we might see something new and original and hopefully good.

fact number three:
price of 3 newest games = price of newest Geforce

I don't know how the game-developing works, but if the developers don't get a damn shit from the sales and therefore no one buys their games, you want to support the developer, right, not some greedy big corporation.

Then the big corporations who have already put LOTS of money into the development of the game (they pay the developers for a couple of years), money they might never see again. If no one buys the game the publisher has payed a lot for, then they won't want to make any more of that kind. And the franchise dies.


I do not like the intellectual property laws, but I still buy games, because that's the way it works today. To change it, there has to be alternatives, and someone has to create the alternatives. And now that Linux is pretty popular as a OS, more stuff is developed for it, and I believe one can actually use it today, but gaming with it is still pretty dead. So starting developing free programs and games for free OSes is the way to change the ways it work, buying Mount&Blade might help to as it is an independent game proving that you can actually get people to buy the product without it being finished and thus support modern games by having some sort of tech demo displayed to the public and collecting their "donations".

 

[Voltare]

As I stated in another thread, stealing someone's game is stealing, period.It is my intellectual property, because my intellect created it.Dev's are taking or inventing measures against pirates.Has anyone devised a way around Valve's Steam yet? I remember when it first came out, a whole lot of pirates were pissed because their pirated half life 1 copies wouldn't work.....

 

[Slaine]

fact number one:
>>developers ain't getting a damn shit from sales<<

They do. Don't talk about things you don't understand. They make you look stupid.

fact number two:
>>you won't save your franchise nor are you going to make an incentive for game industry by buying a game to make good games<<

Neither true nor false.

No, developers ain't getting anything from sales. Do some research (you being a 1337 developer does not count). Has any of you ever bought a game directly from developers? no i don't think so.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I don't need to do any research, everyone, but you, obviously, knows how publisher-developer relationship works. Anyway, here is Leon's quote from the Troika sales number thread:

The reason Andrew could see our royalty statements is because we were an open book company - besides sharing good news with our employees (like good sales numbers) everyone knew where we were financially at all times, even when the news was bad.

Now, think very hard and tell me what "royalty statements" most likely refer to. Hint: it's got nothing to do with the Queen of England.

 

[Slaine]

Has anyone devised a way around Valve's Steam yet?

yes it was pretty easy... you don't even need to install the game (hl2) in order to play it.

 

[Slaine]

I don't need to do any research, everyone, but you, obviously, knows how publisher-developer relationship works. Anyway, here is Leon's quote from the Troika sales number thread:

The reason Andrew could see our royalty statements is because we were an open book company - besides sharing good news with our employees (like good sales numbers) everyone knew where we were financially at all times, even when the news was bad.

Now, think very hard and tell me what "royalty statements" most likely refer to. Hint: it's got nothing to do with the Queen of England.

That doesn't prove anything nor is it relevant. It's true however that devs usualy actually get some money from it but it never more that 20%. Guess who takes the rest.

 

[spacemoose]

Has any of you ever bought a game directly from developers? no i don't think so.

Speak for yourself assboat. I buy directly from developers whenever its possible, example - Paradox games.

 

[Slaine]

Has any of you ever bought a game directly from developers? no i don't think so.

Speak for yourself assboat. I buy directly from developers whenever its possible, example - Paradox games.

*bows*

 

[mathboy]

I don't need to do any research, everyone, but you, obviously, knows how publisher-developer relationship works. Anyway, here is Leon's quote from the Troika sales number thread:

The reason Andrew could see our royalty statements is because we were an open book company - besides sharing good news with our employees (like good sales numbers) everyone knew where we were financially at all times, even when the news was bad.

Now, think very hard and tell me what "royalty statements" most likely refer to. Hint: it's got nothing to do with the Queen of England.

That doesn't prove anything nor is it relevant. It's true however that devs usualy actually get some money from it but it never more that 20%. Guess who takes the rest.

The people who risk a couple of million dollars to get the game made maybe?

 

[Roqua]

Slaine is a fucking genius.

The civil disobedience doesn’t work or hold water since you can’t get around tyranny of the masses (or the center). The vast majority of gamers are fucking idiots so the vast majority of games are made for fucking idiots. Every time I see the top 10 bullets for music I say, “What the fuck. Who’s buying this shit? What fucking idiot bought a Britney Spears CD? Why the fuck do people watch Oprah? What the fuck is going on? Why isn’t a new Sin City movie made every week? Who the fuck is in charge of this shit? Why the fuck is there a Country Music Channel on TV? People really watch soap operas?”

If everyone liked what I did Oprah would be sucking dick in a back alley and wouldn’t have a weight problem since she wouldn’t be able to afford enough food to get fat, and no one sure as fuck wouldn’t want to hear a fucking thing that stupid fat cunt bitch had to say unless it was about how cheap her blowjobs were. But, fucking idiots control the market since there are more of them and they have shitty taste. Why isn’t there a channel that plays SeaLab all day? Because people don’t know what good is. Same reason no AAA crpg will ever be good again, or even a crpg in reality.

But I still don’t steal, even stupid shit I wouldn’t have bought. I wouldn’t watch Oprah, so guess what? I don’t watch Oprah. I don’t get that whole, “I wouldn’t have bought it” argument. I wouldn’t play a game I wouldn’t have bought. I would rather finger my asshole than play a game I wouldn’t of bought. Instead of playing games I wish I didn’t buy I’m typing a post.

That goes into another issue called Opportunity Cost. The cost of playing games you wouldn’t of bought is the lost opportunity to shoot heroin, huff gas, finger asshole, improve your hygiene and appearance, trim nose hairs, massage ballsack, stroke penis, learn something, interact with people, think about what a taint is for, put lipstick on nipples, watch Oprah, strengthen ties/bond with family, get drunk, get arrested, tickle a nun, read a book, twiddle thumbs, clean your filthy pig house, play with your kids, help your mommy with the laundry, hump your mother in the butt, etc, or other things you should want to do besides playing games that aren’t worth buying. The list doesn’t end.

If your life is so gay yoou would rather spend time playing games not good enough to spend money on, maybe it is time to put the computer away or at least consider suicide. Maybe not buy some other things and save up for a prostitute?

 

[Twinfalls]

You really do make me laugh Roqua. (Don't worry, I still hate you)

 

[Roqua]

You really do make me laugh Roqua. (Don't worry, I still hate you)

Well, I love you. I love you even though you are gay and an Idahian. I love and forgive you, and accept you for who you are. I love all my fellow man, even the gay ones and the sheep that go astray and are filled with ignorant hate and misplaced anger. I love you forever and always, my cute little Fancypants.

 

[Jason]

Who will hook up first? Twinfalls & Roqua or Twinfalls & Tintin? Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[Twinfalls]

Head out of the gutter, my little M.A.P.P.L.E.T.H.O.R.P.E.

 

[Jason]

sorry

 

[Slaine]

But I still don’t steal, even stupid shit I wouldn’t have bought.

And I'm sure it makes you feel comfortable.

 

[Human Shield]

With no scarcity, there would be no property. For IP, there is no scarcity, so there is no property.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of.

Sorry, but he is right.

Such industries need new strategies, like Stardock where you pay for official support, or preorder based development.

 

[spacemoose]

With no scarcity, there would be no property. For IP, there is no scarcity, so there is no property.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of.

Sorry, but he is right.

Such industries need new strategies, like Stardock where you pay for official support, or preorder based development.

Who gives a fuck if this scarcity its 'not natural'. Without artificial scarcity there would be no incentive for people to create 'intangible' property like software, books and games that I enjoy. See the fucking soviet union. Stealing ideas or 'intangibles' is equivalent to stealing physical objects, because you're taking away the IP creator's ability to generate wealth from his labor.

 

[mathboy]

Such industries need new strategies, like Stardock where you pay for official support, or preorder based development.

Who gives a fuck if this scarcity its 'not natural'. Without artificial scarcity there would be no incentive for people to create 'intangible' property like software, books and games that I enjoy. See the fucking soviet union. Stealing ideas or 'intangibles' is equivalent to stealing physical objects, because you're taking away the IP creator's ability to generate wealth from his labor.

Such industries need new strategies, like Stardock where you pay for official support, or preorder based development.

Mount&Blade's preorder system seems to work pretty well. They develop something like a tech demo and let the customers fund their development, instead of showing the tech demo to a publisher who then funds the development hoping to be paid by the customers.

 

[Roqua]

But I still don’t steal, even stupid shit I wouldn’t have bought.

And I'm sure it makes you feel comfortable.

And I'm sure an ass full of my cock and a mouth full of my cum would make you feel dreamy, but what the fuck does any of this have to do with anything?

As to you fucking queers precious scarcity, there are assholes on everyone, making them not scarce, so I guess I can assrape anyone since no scarcity equals no property. I own the intangible rights to all you bitches asses. Bend and spread em ladies.

 

[xemous]

To create that sofware you relied on knowledge (programming languages, mathematics, ect),

 

[obediah]

How is copying a game equivalent to stealing money?

You are not very bright, are you?

Copying a game (assuming piracy vs. backup) IS NOT stealing. They both are crimes, but they are distinct. Glossing over the differences for Joe Schmoe is seductive because Joe Schmoe knows stealing is wrong already, but it also makes you look like a dumbass when you don't recognize the differences.

As a developer it's really not in your best interests to confuse the two anyway. Because if your game is physical property rather than information property - I am entitled to do anything I want to your game after I buy it. I can make copies and give them to friends, or sell them for 1/2 what you charge.

The same information property concept that makes it impossible for me to steal your game by downloading it, also puts constraints on what I can do with it after buying it.

A developer makes a game expecting to earn a certain amount of money by selling it, just like a carpenter who makes a table expects to sell it. Both products = money. Just because one product is a physical object and another product is a program doesn't make any difference.

It is a ridiculously fucking huge difference. Look at real, 100% assured losses. If I steal a table, the maker is out all the resources it took to make the table (a sale wasn't guaranteed so we're ignoring expected profit). If I warez AoD, your are out $0, zilch, nada, nothing. If I break into your house and steal a boxed version of AoD, then you're out the material and packaging costs.

By stealing a game you steal the money the developer could have gotten otherwise.

Your misuse of the word steal here is pretty funny. If I pirate a game I would have otherwise bought, I do rob the developer of a bit of money. If I walk into a store and steal that game, I don't rob the developer at all (at least not directly) - it's almost as good as a sale from your perspective - especially if the game is selling well.

It all hinges on the origin of property.

No, it all hinges on the origin of one's fucking decency. It's that simple and there is no need to overcomplicate it.

Both are wrong, but understanding how they are wrong is not overcomplicating things. Speeding and genocide are both wrong, but understanding the difference between the two isn't rocket science. And accusing speeders of genocide to back your position is stupid.