How you're suppose to give feedback to games.

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

Time and time again game developers must put up with bullshit from gamers who refuse to go into details why they dislike a game.
I am not referring to your natural right to not play a game, as that could be invoked at any time regardless of liking the game.
I am talking about the sort of subhuman opinion which will say a game is shit or call out a "specific" component of the game as shit,
and not go into adequate detail.

And yes it's possible for both you and the dev to be subhumans.

Ofcourse to some degree it's hard to predict what degree of detail would be useful or necessary



Allow me to help you see levels of constructive criticism.
And this is the simplest example.

1) Your game is shit.
2) Your game's UI is shit.
3) Your game's main menu is shit.
4) Your game's main menu lags .
5) Your game's main menu lags when I hover my mouse over the New Game button.
That's shitty!
6) Your game's main menu lags when I hover my mouse over the New Game button.
That's shitty! However I noticed this happened only when I was running a recording software.


Level 1 is useless to consumers and gamedevs. Unless there are tons of reviews saying the same thing,
and that overall there's more negative than positive. Then Level 1 is adequate for the consumer but not the gamedev.

Level 2 is semi-useful to consumers who want to trust a crowd and are UI-whores, but not useful to a gamedev unless there was very few UI elements.

Level 3 is is actually useful to the gamedev, but perhaps not as useful to the consumer's frustration because it shows the consumer
is a bit shallow.

Level 4 is useful to the game dev and the consumer. But not as useful as you might think.
The cause for lag at the main menu could be numerous. However given the simplicity that a main menu should have,
if the problem is truly UI related it should be easy to fix.

Level 5 is very useful to the gamedev and the consumer. The gamedev will know exactly what to target in their debugging.

Level 6 is even more useful to the gamedev. Because it points out that a recording software and the FPS of the main menu
combined with hovering over a UI element causes lag. This matters because as a dev you presumably want recording software to play
well with your game and vice versa.


If your feedback is not atleast level 3 or greater, you are not even trying to be useful.
You are child throwing a tantrum. Good for you, but the dev owes you nothing.
I'm sure it's cathartic especially if the game is shit overall or that particular issue was nagging you hard.
But you are owed ZERO respect for that opinion. One individual is not a mass.

And let me correct perhaps the worst preconception of all time.
The possibility that there is a real cause for your expressed issue is not validation that there is such an issue.

 

[motherfucker]

Have you considered making games that aren't shit?

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

Have you considered making games that aren't shit?

That is a good example of low effort subhuman feedback I was referring to!

The point is you should instead aim for a higher quality comment like so:

"Have you considered making games that dont' have a broken main menu that lags"

That's a level 4 type comment, though given your subhumanness i'm guessing you're at best capable of:

"Have you considered making games that' don't have a broken main menu"

Now at level 4 of feedback, I can say yes I have considered it, and I made one!

In turn I ask: have you considered that if you tried to make a game yourself
you'd understand games aren't just apples / oranges, but in fact as vastly complex differences as paper planes are to legit 747 aircraft?
And by 747 aircraft I don't mean the toymodel you have in your head you subhuman never been a gamedev moron.

 

[King Crispy]

The last time someone tried to give feedback to you on your Redaxium Steam page you banned him from it.

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

The last time someone tried to give feedback to you on your Redaxium Steam page you banned him from it.

I only banned two people. Konjad and one of lady "Theo" gaga's simps.
Konjad's ban should be long long over by now.

The forum is actually quite open and accepting of views about the game.

 

[Lord of Riva]

I have had similar experiences having to wade through criticisms like these when we, back when I still did, was involved in the video game industry.

I think you make a mistake here, people who purchase and play your game are not your critics, not that I recommend you getting in touch with those... but your customers.
It's true that many people just voice their one point of frustration and then go away and do something else but at the same time it's not their Job to give you feedback.

If you go to eat somewhere and order a beef burger and you get one with shit, you also will only say something along the lines of "This is disgusting, go fuck yourself, I am leaving" and not describe in detail what brought you to this decision.

Many developers for some reason, I guess that has to do with how many gaming enthusiasts are actually willing to give in-depth feedback, believe that they are owed some form of more clear statements from their customers.

In truth most people just want to enjoy a product and have never thought about what details there are that annoy them, it's too much effort and those who would like to do it often do not have the background and experience to adequately describe what is annoying them, "it just does not feel right", "The controls are floaty", "I have the feeling the game is not doing what I want it to do".

In my eyes you have to take what you are getting and rather than demand that your audience "learns" to give feedback you have to learn to extract the feedback from what you are getting.

That said, you are a special person, with a special perception, while I can understand your frustration for lack of success of your games (And I am throwing no shade here, I saw you code and not everyone manages to release a game at all) I do not think your are overly competent in reacting to feedback or change your perception on things.

Or in other words, to be real here: In your case it may be possibly better to just Focus on what you want to do rather than trying to find out what others want, you will have to live with being a small indie with only a niche of success pertaining to people knowing you, both in camaraderie or being memed on .

 

[leuMOX]

Player: *elaborates*

Developer: *and then I ignored that*
OR
Developer: "you're wrong"

If I have an issue, and I care enough to moan about it, I always post at least a "level 4". But I expect basically nothing to be done about it.

I don't waste my time going into detail anymore unless I get a response from the developer.

 

[Lord of Riva]

Player: *elaborates*

Developer: *and then I ignored that*
OR
Developer: "you're wrong"

If I have an issue, and I care enough to moan about it, I always post at least a "level 4". But I expect basically nothing to be done about it.

I don't waste my time going into detail anymore unless I get a response from the developer.

That is a fair point, most developer argue either "it's not important enough", "no ressources or time" or "This is my game and my vision". To some extent that is necessary, design by committee does to work but if you want to know why people are not willing to give feedback, that is one of the issues.

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

Ok Lord of RIva.

Yes there's a big distinction between a regular player and a insta-quitter. Your regular players you need be more patient with.
I have almost no regular players so this thread was not directed or inspired by them.

That said IF a player to leaves negative feedback, my OP stands. sorry it just does.

 

[James_xeno]

Some really good points. One of the aspects of this that often gets ignored is the breakdown in official game community spaces. The rush to social media, for official social spaces, including feedback and commentary, has been a disaster for not just fandoms but feedback and interaction as well. Putting aside the watered down nature of everything, in terms of who is speaking and getting a voice. (due to the nature of social media as an unfocused space with huge numbers of random already registered users.. leading to a lack of even basic filters on who is taking the time to interact) The way in which social media encourages blunt confrontational communications, especially in places that limit characters, makes nuanced detailed discussion difficult. But there is also issues in the way topics, threads and posts are usually displayed. It becomes really hard to keep track of things, even without a huge number of replies.

Generally speaking, social media has been a disaster for fans, fandoms and the industries themselves. From normies, to stupidity, to the injection of politics,.. social media makes it all so much worse.

 

[Krice]

I think op's perspective is hilarious. Then again, nothing new really here. I think a lot of developers (not to single out anyone here) are difficult people, let's just say how it is. I would argue that it's not difficult to learn how to get feedback and understand what players and users are trying to tell. Even if it sometimes feels "dumb" or whatever.

 

[Grauken]

OP confuses customers with QA

Also OP's games look like dogturds

 

[Maxie]

OP confuses customers with QA

Also OP's games look like dogturds

lots of indie developers operate under the assumption that you doing QA for their shitty weekend projects is a given and that you shouldn't be reimbursed for it, they even call it Early Access these days
why i saw a dumbo like that on this very forum just last week or something

 

[Vic]

silence sometimes speaks louder than words

 

[Vic]

but here’s my 2c: I wouldn’t install that turd on my machine even if you gave me 50 bucks.

now for 100… we can talk

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

I think op's perspective is hilarious. Then again, nothing new really here. I think a lot of developers (not to single out anyone here) are difficult people, let's just say how it is. I would argue that it's not difficult to learn how to get feedback and understand what players and users are trying to tell. Even if it sometimes feels "dumb" or whatever.

Your post is shit.

OP confuses customers with QA

Also OP's games look like dogturds

Your post is shit.

but here’s my 2c: I wouldn’t install that turd on my machine even if you gave me 50 bucks.

now for 100… we can talk

Your post is shit.


I hope this was helpful feedback!

 

[Krice]

Yeah.. good luck with that attitude. Some people just want to undermine their own possible success with that kind of stuff. Sometimes it can be done (if you are really good at what you do), but it's much easier if you don't appear to be a total asshole.

 

[mediocrepoet]

I think op's perspective is hilarious. Then again, nothing new really here. I think a lot of developers (not to single out anyone here) are difficult people, let's just say how it is. I would argue that it's not difficult to learn how to get feedback and understand what players and users are trying to tell. Even if it sometimes feels "dumb" or whatever.

Your post is shit.

OP confuses customers with QA

Also OP's games look like dogturds

Your post is shit.

but here’s my 2c: I wouldn’t install that turd on my machine even if you gave me 50 bucks.

now for 100… we can talk

Your post is shit.


I hope this was helpful feedback!

This post is shit, but then, your games are shit. Not sure what I expected tbh.

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

Customers are not your QA. Yes, it would be great if every player had the time and energy to report every bug and talk about every design issue, but that's not going to happen.

You're lucky if you get a handful of passionate fans who can share feedback and answer your questions, but even in this case, they're not developers.

Most of them have no clue how the game works under the hood or give a shit about ultra-specific details, so they're not going to write feedback in a way you want and to get to Level 4+ you'll have to ask additional questions, and even then there's no guarantee you'll get all of the answers.

 

[GrafvonMoltke]

*supposed

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

I think op's perspective is hilarious. Then again, nothing new really here. I think a lot of developers (not to single out anyone here) are difficult people, let's just say how it is. I would argue that it's not difficult to learn how to get feedback and understand what players and users are trying to tell. Even if it sometimes feels "dumb" or whatever.

Your post is shit.

OP confuses customers with QA

Also OP's games look like dogturds

Your post is shit.

but here’s my 2c: I wouldn’t install that turd on my machine even if you gave me 50 bucks.

now for 100… we can talk

Your post is shit.


I hope this was helpful feedback!

This post is shit, but then, your games are shit. Not sure what I expected tbh.

Your post is shit too.

It feels good to help so many people when I could just say nothing.

If you guys can't turn my feedback into gold, that's a you problem it was your posts afterall.

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

Customers are not your QA. Yes, it would be great if every player had the time and energy to report every bug and talk about every design issue, but that's not going to happen.

You're lucky if you get a handful of passionate fans who can share feedback and answer your questions, but even in this case, they're not developers.

Most of them have no clue how the game works under the hood or give a shit about ultra-specific details, so they're not going to write feedback in a way you want and to get to Level 4+ you'll have to ask additional questions, and even then there's no guarantee you'll get all of the answers.

What's this: a deluded dev thinks their opinion matters to others?

It doesn't. I say this with true constructive love: your post is shit bro.

Git gud and good luck!

 

[GrafvonMoltke]

Prosper: pls help me give me feedback
People: your game's not very good
Prosper: FUCK YOU GUYS

 

[Vic]

looks like shit, haven’t played. what more can I say

 

[NoMoneyNoFameNoDame]

looks like shit, haven’t played. what more can I say

You poor poor men.