NWN Shadows of Undrentide impressions

[Lemunde]

Yeah, I know I'm a few years late to the game but I got a hair up my butt to install this thing and force myself to play all the way through.

First let me give you a little background. I bought NWN and both expansions as soon as they came out. For the official campaign I probably got through half of the first chapter before I got fed up with it. With SoU I barely even got started before I put it away. I spent more time with HoTU but I still didn't get far enough into it to accomplish anything. Most of my time was spent screwing around with the toolset.

The reason I originally couldn't get into any of these campaigns is because they just felt too linear and I didn't feel like there was any point to gaining levels since it was set up so you're at a predefined level at every point in the game no matter how many times you play it because there's only so much experience you're allowed to acquire before you're forced to move on.

This isn't the only game that does this. Baldur's Gate was the first game I played like this and I got just about as far. KotOR had the same problem as did every other game I played based on the same basic DnD like gameplay.

I know what you're thinking. "It's all about the story and characters and not the grinding" but these sort of things are important to me in an RPG. Nevertheless I decided to give NWN another shot starting with Shadows of Undrentide.

I remembered all the piss-poor reviews this expansion got going in. I couldn't remember exactly what everyone said was wrong with it but I figured I'd know by the time I beat it. To be honest it wasn't that bad. The worst parts about it were some of the things I already mentioned and the fact that it's linear as hell. There's some parts where you get to choose what task to do first but you're going to have to do all of these tasks eventually to progress.

There's a bit of "Choices and Consequences(tm)" but not enough to make me want to play through again. At one point I was told to go kill this dragon and when I got to the dragon he made me a better offer so I decided to go kill my previous employer. That was kind of fun. Well maybe fun isn't the right word for it. I'll just call it an interesting twist.

I can't remember any other part in the game where I got a choice like that. At the end I was given a choice to join the big bad guy in conquering the world but I suspect it wouldn't have had any effect on the final outcome.

The campaign was a lot longer than I thought it would be. The only thing I think I can remember from reviews is complaints that it was too short. I think I got my money's worth.

It's got a lot of bugs. During the second chapter I came across this maze room with disappearing walls that slowly brought my PC to it's knees. My computer's no slouch. It's not top of the line but it can run most modern games on respectable settings. I'd hate to see how this would have run on my computer five years ago. Anyway it was an obvious memory leak so saving and reloading every four or five minutes got me through it.

I had Deekan as my companion throughout most of the game. I'm not sure how but at one point he died and when I resurrected him he became hostile. So I killed him again and resurrected him and he became friendly again. But every time after that when he died he would be resurrected hostile and I would have to go through the same process of kill-res so I could move on.

The story was somewhat entertaining. Most of it I could tell what was going to happen next but it threw me a few curves here and there. Going to face the big bad guy then finding out what it really was was a nice one. Just one of those moments where you think you're at the end only to find out you still have a good ways to go.

I died a lot. This is one thing that irritates me most about this game. Some people may look at this sort of challenge as a good thing but I prefer to think it's possible, if you're careful enough, to get through the entire game without dieing once. With this game, as near as I can tell, it just can't be done. You NEED to get lucky at certain points because that's the only way you'll survive. I suppose I could go through again with a higher level character but that sort of defeats the purpose.

Probably the most redeeming quality about this game is the level to where you can customize your character. Picking the right equipment to go with your character build and the feats you select goes a long way to keeping you alive.

However I'm still confused by most of the stats and DnD jargon it threw at me. For someone who doesn't know the ins and outs of DnD rules you're not going to know if a +2 dagger with keen is better than a dagger that does an extra 1d6 frost damage. There's nothing in the game that tells you exactly what these weapon and armor attributes do. It took me forever to figure out what the +2 meant.

All in all it's a decent enough game. The story and basic game mechanics bring it up to about a C+. And I actually did find a couple of spots in the game where some monsters respawned. I just wish it gave you the chance to go back to previous areas and mess around for a little bit and maybe do some exploring instead of dragging you kicking and screaming all the way to the end boss.

 

[deuxhero]

If your looking for a grindfest, you should be looking at a Nippon Ichi Software titile (that wasn't meant to be snarky), or an MMO (that was), not a wRPG


and you don't know what keen means? Read the Goddamn manual/srd.

 

[cardtrick]

. . . you actually thought it was too hard?

 

[Xi]

How interesting, I got the same itch to reinstall NWN as well. Most of my gripe with the game was from my previous multi-player experience of it. Me and one of my buddies played through the OC, and I felt like I missed a lot of the dialog and didn't really know what had happened when we got to the end. You see, he would click through the text so damned fast, hardly reading any of it, and I just put up with it. So this was the precursor to my current desire to replay it.

I'm toward the end of Chapter one in the OC atm. Playing a Druid/Shifter.(5/1 atm) I played a druid in BG2, so I felt like it would be a good choice. So far, the game has been rather easy, and I've even put it up to the "hardcore" rules for some challenge. I've only ever had to revive my rogue hireling a few times, and between him and my summoned pets, we are a force to be reckoned with.

My real goal behind this D&D binge was to eventually get into the expansions, of which I have not even touched yet. So basically I'm building a character to import into those settings atm, but I might finish the original game just to re-experienced what i had missed.(Which I hear isn't much anyway)

Cheers!

Edit: And I just wanted to add that NWN's front-end is far superior to NWN2. It seems like a pretty huge undertaking and offers a LOT of different tools, and functionality that the second doesn't have. Not a knock, on the second, just something I have noticed. It seems like a far more polished experience.(Even if the story elements aren't as good)

 

[MetalCraze]

I remember that the final boss fight was the easiest one from all Bioware games to that date. well it isn't a fully Bioware game tbh but still.
and I don't really remember that it was hard in all other departments. the understanding of how you had so much trouble completing it evades me.

 

[WalterKinde]

I was never keen on the DnD jargon either , just play the game, you'll learn by trial and error.
I didn't know what the hell i was doing in Baldur's Gate when i first started to play it.
Coming from a console rpg background and fallout i couldn't understand why my wizard couldn't wear armor like my fighter or why when i sent him first into battle against kobolds he was dying so much faster than the other members of the group.
I learned to play with strategy in mind and not just kill kill with the pc in the fore front, let Jaharia and the others do the fighting.
Just have fun.

 

[Lemunde]

. . . you actually thought it was too hard?

I admit it may have been because of the character I was playing. I went rogue and eventually shadowdancer and never chose an armor type greater than light because I wanted to maximize my dexterity bonus. I'm going to use the same character for HoTU so I'll probably upgrade to medium armor when I get the chance. Also I was playing on normal difficulty if that makes any difference.

 

[MetalCraze]

the proper character build decides everything.
monks f.e. do not wear any reasonable armour and don't use any weapons at all (well they can use that japanese thingies but that's it). the main stat for monks is dexterity. then strength. and constitution being almost a dump stat. I said almost.
after level 15 with a proper build they become unstoppable killing machines. enemy rarely hits them - but they hit back hard.

with rogues aim for the same - hit hard and avoid being hit. except also remember to use stealth and sneak attacks (sneak attacks - some overpowered shit right there). also in the beginning of the game try to take a companion that will add to your character (you're a rogue - what Deekin?). like in your case your companion must attack enemies directly, be a "tank" (there's one I think) - while you will do sneak attacks. after your companion will get "stoned" I'm sure you will already be a quite powerful rogue.

 

[Volourn]

SOU's boss is a joke. And, definitely the easiest of any BIO game end boss. NWN OC's boss while not super hard definitely isn't as easy as easy.

SOU is probbaly BIO's worst campaign just being middle of the road (slightly less than KOTOR). NWN OC is very underrated though with some very nice quests, and characters that people that knock seem to ignore... all, the while praising BG's quests as sueprior. LMAO

 

[Texas Red]

SOU is probbaly BIO's worst campaign just being middle of the road (slightly less than KOTOR). NWN OC is very underrated though with some very nice quests, and characters that people that knock seem to ignore... all, the while praising BG's quests as sueprior. LMAO

Worst campaign, lawl? Its exactly like the campaign of the OC. You're the best student training to become an adventurer, you get some clue, discover that an ancient nation wants to rise, destroy boss through battle.

Though I admit that like the village and the dialogs but there was so little of it. Bioware definitely knows what their fans wanted: D&Diablo, conversations were so 90s.

 

[easychord]

SoU was my favourite NWN module. It may have been a bit linear and lacked things that some modules have but it was fun from start to finish for me.

I'm glad that the final boss wasn't as challenging as HotU. The epicness upon epicness of the combat in that module was just so much cheese for me. My Wizard/Arcane Archer spent a fair amount of the module obliterating small armies of demons with AOE spells with one or two hits. The only thing that that character could do in the last fight to make a difference was spam resurrect on the two fighter characters who could land a hit despite being killed in one or two rounds.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

SOU is probbaly BIO's worst campaign just being middle of the road (slightly less than KOTOR)

Slightly? You think KOTOR is only slightly less 'middle of the road' than SoU?

 

[Jasede]

SoU positively surprised me. I enjoyed the difficulty when I played a Shifter.

That said, playing a Shifter may have helped- I do think it's the most fun class you can play.

 

[racofer]

SoU positively surprised me. I enjoyed the difficulty when I played a Shifter.

That said, playing a Shifter may have helped- I do think it's the most fun class you can play.

Now with that I agree. Although I dislike most of the stuff done by Bioware regarding storyline with over usage of cliches, playing a shifter was very interesting. I remember that you could mix up so many different character builds with only one. You could become immune to most spells if done properly and during multiplayer games it was easy to adapt to a tough situation.
Multiclassing with monk also made some very overpowered builds, like druid6/monk1/shifter33 and buffing up wisdom, then transforming into a lich wielding a scythe. You would move fast like monks did, your AC would go through the roof, lichs are immune to most spells and damage wise was pretty good.

This was also one of the reasons I disliked nwn2 so much.

 

[Xor]

I played SoU as a paladin, but I gave up in the desert part. I remember the dialogs being better than the OC, but it still wasn't enough to keep me interested in finishing.


I liked HotU more, probably just because the 'epic' aspect fits better with Bioware's design style.

 

[Relayer71]

I remember the OC being immensely dull, early on it became tedious.

SoU was an improvement being that it was streamlined in comparison to the OC (being an XP) and had better dialogue over the OC but it was still boring.

HoTU on the other hand was nothing special but fun to play - I didn't finish it for some reason and am thinking of installing it again. Maybe I'll try SoU again, it has been awhile and I probably played it too soon after playing the OC.

 

[Hamster]

I think that SoU is the best of them. NWN OC is shit, that goes without saying, and HotU was fun at the begining, but later it put me off with pretty retarded depiction of that drow city, it was ridiculous so i lost nterest and got bored.

 

[MetalCraze]

then again the ability to play diplomat in the city of mind-flayers for a little was a very good thing in an addon.
the drow city - yes - and nowhere near the one in BG2.

just that case of addons being better than the original. guess the illness of all NWN series.

 

[nomask7]

The drow city was the low point of HotU. After you've completed the Underdark, you've still got at least 1/3 of the game ahead of you: the best part, I think (although I loved the beginning as well: playing it without using the map was great, didn't even glance at it).

 

[Volourn]

there was a drow city in HOTU? more like an encampment/small town at best

of course it doesn't compare to the drow city in BG2.

 

[Admiral Rimjob POOBUM]

I liked the interlude part of SoU when you were travelling with the caravan. Sucker for that kind of thing. The rest was kind of dull, though.

 

[nomask7]

Do encampments have inner and outer walls that are twenty yards high? Whatever it was supposed to be, the whole Underdark episode wasn't especially interesting, though it was passable to be sure. (And no, I don't care how many worse episodes there are in other games or how many worse games there are. The amount of distilled shit in the world doesn't change passable into anything better than passable.)

 

[Wyrmlord]

SoU positively surprised me. I enjoyed the difficulty when I played a Shifter.

That said, playing a Shifter may have helped- I do think it's the most fun class you can play.

They removed Shifter in NWN2.

 

[AlanC9]

My Wizard/Arcane Archer spent a fair amount of the module obliterating small armies of demons with AOE spells with one or two hits. The only thing that that character could do in the last fight to make a difference was spam resurrect on the two fighter characters who could land a hit despite being killed in one or two rounds.

Must have been poor spell selection. My AA didn't have much trouble hitting and damaging him with bow fire, and my pure wizard crushed him. Like most outsiders, he's got no acid resistance.

 

[AlanC9]

My real goal behind this D&D binge was to eventually get into the expansions, of which I have not even touched yet. So basically I'm building a character to import into those settings atm, but I might finish the original game just to re-experienced what i had missed.(Which I hear isn't much anyway)

SoU and HotU use a single PC who is not the NWN OC PC. SoU happens at the same time as the OC, and when you take that character into HotU, you meet some characters from the OC.

Edit: And I just wanted to add that NWN's front-end is far superior to NWN2. It seems like a pretty huge undertaking and offers a LOT of different tools, and functionality that the second doesn't have. Not a knock, on the second, just something I have noticed. It seems like a far more polished experience.(Even if the story elements aren't as good)

What was better about it? This is actually still a live topic on the BioBoards. The NWN1 radial was never popular, but some fans never forgave Obsidian for yanking it. I never really understood why anyone cared about the radial, since the only thing you use it for is to populate the quickbar.