Incline True Thief 4 Dark Mod is released

[J_C]

FFS, just try it, if you have any interest. If you still think it's shit, you can delete it right away. If you aren't interested anyway, why make up stupid excuses?

Don't drag me into some "if you're not with us you're against us" bullshit.

I am so interested in trying it, that I wish they'd act like they had an interest in other people trying it. It's a massive jump in scale, but imagine if the inXile kickstarters were banking on jokes about Golden Manbabies. Wouldn't it be lovely -- we could all continue on, smug in the belief that no-one else has any interest, because everyone is dumb and we are smart.

The rest of the trailer looks fantastic. They should have started and stopped with the fantastic parts. The shit voice-acting on the cutting room floor. For a "joke" sounds a lot like the kind of VA these projects sometimes end up with, so it's pretty asinine to have ganged up on someone for puking in their mouth a little and stopping the video.

They should have floated that shit, and someone should have said, "no, this is not only kind of dumb, but will give the wrong impression to anyone who hasn't been following / half-following this project." Or was the trailer just for the purposes of a masturbatory circle-jerk? Because I strongly believe an easily-installable standalone Dark Mod could make a huge splash, outside the usual community.

Anecdotally, in "real life" all the other people I know who are "gamers" -- that bop around forums, that make "cultural" in-jokes -- have the worst, and most predictable taste. The people who like good games don't do that, because they have extremely low tolerances for retardation.

As it should be, in all things 'd

Sophistry and pseudo-ethical argument aside, it's stupid to lead your trailer with tone and content not found in the product. If that content sucks, it's indicative of a disregard for the quality of tone and content. Thankfully I -- unlike 99.99% of the potential audience for this -- know better, having kept one eye on this project for a while.

I'm kinda OK in english, but I simply don't understand what are you rambling about.

 

[DeepOcean]

FFS, just try it, if you have any interest. If you still think it's shit, you can delete it right away. If you aren't interested anyway, why make up stupid excuses?

Don't drag me into some "if you're not with us you're against us" bullshit.

I am so interested in trying it, that I wish they'd act like they had an interest in other people trying it. It's a massive jump in scale, but imagine if the inXile kickstarters were banking on jokes about Golden Manbabies. Wouldn't it be lovely -- we could all continue on, smug in the belief that no-one else has any interest, because everyone is dumb and we are smart.

The rest of the trailer looks fantastic. They should have started and stopped with the fantastic parts. The shit voice-acting on the cutting room floor. For a "joke" sounds a lot like the kind of VA these projects sometimes end up with, so it's pretty asinine to have ganged up on someone for puking in their mouth a little and stopping the video.

They should have floated that shit, and someone should have said, "no, this is not only kind of dumb, but will give the wrong impression to anyone who hasn't been following / half-following this project." Or was the trailer just for the purposes of a masturbatory circle-jerk? Because I strongly believe an easily-installable standalone Dark Mod could make a huge splash, outside the usual community.

Anecdotally, in "real life" all the other people I know who are "gamers" -- that bop around forums, that make "cultural" in-jokes -- have the worst, and most predictable taste. The people who like good games don't do that, because they have extremely low tolerances for retardation.

As it should be, in all things 'd

Sophistry and pseudo-ethical argument aside, it's stupid to lead your trailer with tone and content not found in the product. If that content sucks, it's indicative of a disregard for the quality of tone and content. Thankfully I -- unlike 99.99% of the potential audience for this -- know better, having kept one eye on this project for a while.

I'm kinda OK in english, but I simply don't understand what are you rambling about.

I think he doesn't like the voice acting on the trailer and think it would harm people perception of the mod. Why he need 7 pharagraphs to say that? I don't know.

 

[J_C]

Ah, I get it. Well I agree that the VO is not particulary good, but I think the people who are interested in a hardcore stealth game like this will look over it.

 

[tuluse]

He's not even talking about an in-game voice. Just the one used in the trailer.

 

[Gord]

Which is clearly ironic, and at that it's working well.
In-game VO depends on the used mod.
Actually I get the impression he's either trolling or 'sperging.

 

[gromit]

Neither, just saying it's completely understandable for... whoever it was, that everyone was picking on... to stop watching after .5s of that narration. After all, there are lots of fan projects that "non-ironically" sound like that. It's completely the trailer producer's fault, not that guy.

They made an irrelevant, mis-understandable, potentially audience-losing, non-joke for... what, exactly? Themselves? That's not who trailers are for.

I can't believe I'm catching so much flak for suggesting a team with a solid product lead with their best foot forward, when they're on the brink of greater exposure.

Anyway, J_C, somewhere in that rambling rant, was a bit about how I don't think the entire audience for a "hardcore" stealth game will (necessarily) look past it.

"Likes really good games" != "Member of small insular community or subculture, and/or exposed to their particular jokes and tropes"

 

[Azazel]

I'm not sure if your signature is intentionally ironic or not. Regardless, this is very much:

 

[Wirdschowerdn]

Good news for audiophiles:
http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/15161-unable-to-locate-3d-audio/page__view__findpost__p__323238

Serpetine, the dude responsible for porting the audio engine to OpenAL EFX, is onto it.

Thief mod community is best mod community.

 

[Kitako]

And now that is out, of course I'm stuck with this sucky netbook that won't even run NWN1. Some days it truly sucks to be me.

 

[A user named cat]

Uhh, this is supposed to be good? Nice Helen Keller AI (mute the audio, LPer is obnoxious):

 

[Tzaero]

Uhh, this is supposed to be good? Nice Helen Keller AI (mute the audio, LPer is obnoxious)

Yeah this guy is a twat, don't make him put you off. You can easily get through the level faster than this guy, i presume hes slow only for LPs.

 

[MetalCraze]

Good news for audiophiles:
http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/15161-unable-to-locate-3d-audio/page__view__findpost__p__323238

Serpetine, the dude responsible for porting the audio engine to OpenAL EFX, is onto it.

Thief mod community is best mod community.

I fap


Of course if that's exactly what he means - e.g. porting it to software EFX.
Fuck Creative morons seriously.

 

[sexbad?]

Uhh, this is supposed to be good? Nice Helen Keller AI (mute the audio, LPer is obnoxious):

My stars, that AI is so fucking bad.

 

[AluminumHaste]

LOL poor Fen, he gets so much flak for his style of LP from people like you. He definitely isn't what you like in your LPs, probably a good idea NOT to continue watching his videos then.
And what part was "so fucking bad"?

EDIT: There's also options for AI Acuity. From "Nearly Blind" to "Hardcore" where they can see you from across the level practically.

 

[sexbad?]

LOL poor Fen, he gets so much flak for his style of LP from people like you. He definitely isn't what you like in your LPs, probably a good idea NOT to continue watching his videos then.
And what part was "so fucking bad"?

EDIT: There's also options for AI Acuity. From "Nearly Blind" to "Hardcore" where they can see you from across the level practically.

I didn't watch the whole thing, but there is no defense for the retarded enemies from around 8:00 to 10:30.

I don't get why there should be options like that at all. Make the enemies realistically competent, and then make challenges according to that enemy AI.

 

[AluminumHaste]

Hmmm, okay at around 8 minutes, the AI turns around because it heard a noise behind it, how does that make them retarded? And the reason he just stood there was because the player was in full shadow. Don't forget that most Let's Players of Dark Mod (me included) change the video levels so the video isn't so dark, when playing that mission it's actually very dark in that shadow.
And the part where the AI keeps sitting down and getting up is an interesting bug, I think what's happening is that the player isn't in shadow so is partially lit. What happens then is that the AI kept seeing the player out of the corner of it's eye and getting back up, probably alert level 2, which means he won't search but definitely noticed something. That will have to be addressed in a future update.

And about the options for Acuity: that's a new feature to be able to change that on the fly. Most players will pick Challenging or lower depending on how shit they are at this game. People like me, who've been playing it since about 2006, have no problems with the AI acuity and actually want increased difficulty. I sometimes play at Hardcore, which is really HARD.
I understand that you don't get why there's an option for it. If you play it for a year or two you might come to appreciate the decision and realize that nothing get's added or changed without lengthy discussion among team members, who seriously take into account player feedback.

 

[skacky]

What's wrong with the "retarded enemies"? This is pretty much how they behaved in Thief too.

 

[AluminumHaste]

And if you don't like LPs with voice overs, try some of mine, I don't talk at all.

The Transaction


Mandrasola

 

[AluminumHaste]

For example the first image is what you would see in game, as you can see it's quite dark, and the light gem is almost completely black.

The second image is normally what I would change it to for youtube.

 

[sexbad?]

Hmmm, okay at around 8 minutes, the AI turns around because it heard a noise behind it, how does that make them retarded? And the reason he just stood there was because the player was in full shadow. Don't forget that most Let's Players of Dark Mod (me included) change the video levels so the video isn't so dark, when playing that mission it's actually very dark in that shadow.
And the part where the AI keeps sitting down and getting up is an interesting bug, I think what's happening is that the player isn't in shadow so is partially lit. What happens then is that the AI kept seeing the player out of the corner of it's eye and getting back up, probably alert level 2, which means he won't search but definitely noticed something. That will have to be addressed in a future update.

At around eight minutes, the AI does turn around because he heard you, but he doesn't see you even though you're right in front of him and there's a light source behind you, so he should be able to see your silhouette very clearly. That's an inexcusable oversight if the "king of stealth" means you can make use of such a simple, easy exploit.

What's wrong with the "retarded enemies"? This is pretty much how they behaved in Thief too.

That sounds awful. Maybe I won't play the originals after all.

 

[Infinitron]

That sounds awful. Maybe I won't play the originals after all.

If you're talking about what happens at around 8:35, well, that would be an unusual moment in Thief. Usually dark spots are in corners, not in the middle of the street. That's a matter of map design.

But the point is, in Thief, if there's a dark spot where your light gem is dark, you can hide in it without being seen. Occasionally this may result in some unusual realism-straining situations.

 

[sexbad?]

That sounds awful. Maybe I won't play the originals after all.

If you're talking about what happens at around 8:35, well, that would be an unusual moment in Thief. Usually dark spots are in corners, not in the middle of the street. That's a matter of map design.

But the point is, in Thief, if there's a dark spot where your light gem is dark, you can hide in it without being seen. Occasionally this may result in some unusual realism-straining situations.

All right, that makes more sense in terms of design. I would be willing to overlook total invisibility in darkness if most of the time that just meant most of the time the darkness is in an actually obscured area.

 

[AluminumHaste]

At around eight minutes, the AI does turn around because he heard you, but he doesn't see you even though you're right in front of him and there's a light source behind you, so he should be able to see your silhouette very clearly. That's an inexcusable oversight if the "king of stealth" means you can make use of such a simple, easy exploit.

What's wrong with the "retarded enemies"? This is pretty much how they behaved in Thief too.

That sounds awful. Maybe I won't play the originals after all.

Oh that lol. There was some discussion about adding the ability of the AI to distinguish your silhouette outlined against a bright backdrop, but the implementation is too complicated. As far as I know, there isn't a single game in the world that has AI that can recognize you against a bright backdrop that I know of.
In that part of the video the player is in complete darkness, which means he is almost invisible to the AI, it does not matter what is behind the player. No game has that. If you find one let me know.

I'm beginning to understand where all this hate and vitriol and "it's fucking shit" is coming from. You've never played the original games which were the direct inspiration of this Mod. I'm not surprised you seem to have unrealistic expectations of our AI.

 

[Infinitron]

AluminumHaste You don't work in marketing, do you?

sexbad is a bit of a YouTube reviewing celebrity. Be nice to him!

 

[AluminumHaste]

I do some work on the mod itself, for the past 7 years, so no, not in marketing. I don't get what you mean by be nice to him, I'm not being mean.....