Zeo Punctuation on Mass Effect

[Dark Matter]

Fallout? There are a few characters with excellent dialog(mostly the ones with voice acting) but the majority of them are completely lifeless and dull, including all the companions. Bioware games, despite their cliches, beat FO any day. In fact, BIO games have superior dialog to the vast majority of RPGs. I think it's ridiculous how much people here bash the writing in Bioware games despite the fact that a good portion of all the memorable characters in CRPGs come from BIO games (denying this fact is blatant fanboyism).

 

[Brother None]

(denying this fact is blatant fanboyism).

Oh good, for a minute there I thought you were making a statement of opinion, but apparently it's fact and anyone who disagrees with you is a fanboy (of...?)

 

[Annonchinil]

Yeah the cast of Jade Empire and NWN was really memorable, so were 80% of the characters in BG games. And its not like the characters in KOTOR were done before.

 

[psycojester]

That said, there are TONS of game whose writing is as good as PST's. TONS.

Name six please.

 

[Dark Matter]

Yeah the cast of Jade Empire and NWN was really memorable, so were 80% of the characters in BG games. And its not like the characters in KOTOR were done before.

I never claimed they have most the creative and interesting characters. But regardless of their genericness, your average BIO character is far more memorable than the average character in most other CRPGs. They're not incredibly unique, but for the most part, they're well written and full of personality.

 

[Andyman Messiah]

Fallout? There are a few characters with excellent dialog(mostly the ones with voice acting) but the majority of them are completely lifeless and dull, including all the companions. Bioware games, despite their cliches, beat FO any day. In fact, BIO games have superior dialog to the vast majority of RPGs. I think it's ridiculous how much people here bash the writing in Bioware games despite the fact that a good portion of all the memorable characters in CRPGs come from BIO games (denying this fact is blatant fanboyism).

Make like the flock of seagulls, laddie.

The only characters I remember from every single Bio game are the whiny pretty boy character, the evil, yet likeable b-action movie hero, the hilarious psycho and the vain love interest(s). Granted, the NPCs in Fallout 1 were probably not designed for fanservice but rather for a purpose, but I liked them anyway. Different strokes, y'know.

Also, I wonder why you thought I was bashing Bio. That's uncool. I can only take it you didn't see my funky wink-smiley and jumped to conclusions. It's really fucking funny. I make teh sarcasm and teh irony without a smiley and some people jump on me screaming bloody hell. I make teh sarcasm and teh irony with a smiley end some people jump on me screaming bloody hell. Do I have to use big fucking letters or something? I hate smileys but I've been told to use 'em. Your kind of people make me fucking schizo. Make up your minds. S'all I'm saying.

Also: Iguana Bob.

 

[Edward_R_Murrow]

I never claimed they have most the creative and interesting characters.

But regardless of their genericness

They're not incredibly unique, but for the most part, they're well written and full of personality.

Does not compute. How exactly can a character be generic, cliche, and not interesting and yet be well written? I thought a well ritten character was interesting, unique, and not merely some stereotype or cliche. I even liked Shadows of Amn and the characters, but it sure as hell wasn't for the writing, it was for the fact that they actually reacted to player actions pretty often. Else wise, they would have amounted to a boat full of B-grade mediocrity based on writing alone.

your average BIO character is far more memorable than the average character in most other CRPGs.

I disagree. They are equally memorable, being identified by some physical appearance things, stats, and a few quirks. There was hardly ever any development outside of Shadows of Amn, and when there was, it seemed cheesy as can be.

 

[Dark Matter]

I'm talking about writing in terms of dialog, not about the character's personality and such. Even if they're generic, Bioware characters have plenty of memorable, funny, witty lines. A lot more than most CRPGs.

 

[1eyedking]

Fallout's Cassidy, a non-talking head, has one-liners packed with more personality than all of the whiny characters from Baldur's Gate and Baldur's Gate II combined.

Even if you count Minsc twice.

 

[SuicideBunny]

despite the fact that a good portion of all the memorable characters in CRPGs come from BIO games (denying this fact is blatant fanboyism).

the only crpg (and not adventure) characters i remember well enough to be able to quote from memory without googling are from bloodlines, ps:t, and the end sequence of darkside of xeen. which one of those is a bioware game?

 

[Section8]

Yahtzee is tops, and he's pretty much spot on with criticism of "wordiness". It has it's place in the occasional game, like Torment, where the overall feel is of an interactive novel, but for the most part, it's just substituting often clumsy narrative content instead of actual interaction.

I haven't played Mass Effect, but if you do indeed get in conversations where NPCs give their life story at the drop of the hat, then it's definitely worth criticising. Listening to a life story doesn't have much scope for player interaction, so you're moving away from the strength of gaming as a medium. It should be obvious from his opening jab at JRPGs that he favours interaction over extensive narrative. At its very core, his criticism of Mass Effect is that this focus on extensive narrative isn't adequately compensated with gameplay - which is fine for people who like that sort of shit.

In short, it's typical Bioware - an adventure game/dating sim tacked onto clumsy Action RPG-ish gameplay. That's ample grounds for criticism. So harden the fuck up and don't spout off this "bad review" shit just because you like the Bioware formula.

 

[Volourn]

Is Section 8 still whining? Hilarious!

People like to bash 'fanboy's when they're just as bad as the fanboys - bashing something no matter what, and agreeing with anyone who bashes the subject of their ire. LMAO!


And, no, PST deserves criticism for it's spamming of nonsensical wiriting. It doesn't get a pass as an 'interatcive novel'. That's retarded. PST is a game. Just like ME. Just like any other game. Period.


"an adventure game/dating sim"

That must explain the fact that all the 'romances' put together take up maybe 15 minutes to 1 hour of a 20-50 hour game. *shrug*

Don't be retarded. It just embarasses you. At least know what you are talking about first.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

I sense plane tickets are coming.

 

[MasPingon]

That said, there are TONS of game whose writing is as good as PST's. TONS.

Like NWN 1?

 

[kingcomrade]

Like Halo

 

[Jeff Graw]

I haven't played Mass Effect, but if you do indeed get in conversations where NPCs give their life story at the drop of the hat, then it's definitely worth criticising. Listening to a life story doesn't have much scope for player interaction, so you're moving away from the strength of gaming as a medium.

For the most part they only give their life stories if you inquire about them. If you don't want to hear life stories, don't ask. It's pretty fucking simple.

In short, it's typical Bioware - an adventure game/dating sim tacked onto clumsy Action RPG-ish gameplay. That's ample grounds for criticism. So harden the fuck up and don't spout off this "bad review" shit just because you like the Bioware formula.

I'm not gung-ho on Mass Effect either, but you have to realize that it's possible to have a shitty negative review of a shitty game. The simple fact is that it's not a very great game, yet Yahtzee's review missed all of the blatant flaws but the inventory system -- and he spent the majority of the review complaining about a non-flaw.

 

[Brother None]

And, no, PST deserves criticism for it's spamming of nonsensical wiriting. It doesn't get a pass as an 'interatcive novel'. That's retarded. PST is a game. Just like ME. Just like any other game. Period.

So in whatever fantasy world you live in, the interactive movie genre never existed either because they're games just like any other games, period?

I also don't see what it would change about the game itself if people can't call it an interactive novel, it's still the same game. A rose etc.

 

[Astromarine]

Yahtzee is awesome. Also a huge fan of games as gameplay instead of "grand cinematic adventures". His favorite game is apparently Fantasy World Dizzy for the C64. He was weaned on the Spectrum and C64 days, where "bad enough dude" was all the characterization you needed. I find that point of view thoroughly respectable, though I do not share it (I was the same until I found Ultima). So I'm assuming he got the game to review as an assignment from the horrible mr. Pitts, and had to do something with it. Given those limitations, he did the best he could with hilarious results. I liked it.

 

[fastpunk]

And, no, PST deserves criticism for it's spamming of nonsensical wiriting. It doesn't get a pass as an 'interatcive novel'. That's retarded. PST is a game. Just like ME. Just like any other game. Period.

Critical failure!

That said, there are TONS of game whose writing is as good as PST's. TONS.

Like what? You still haven't said as much as one game. Please, share!

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I thought that review was pretty shit to be honest.

 

[Kingston]

I thought that review was pretty shit to be honest.

I haven't played the game, but yeah. It was a bit all over the place, and the ending joke didn't make me lol

 

[Hazelnut]

That said, there are TONS of game whose writing is as good as PST's. TONS.

Name six please.

We're waiting Volly...

 

[Claw]

"Okay, I did Mass Effect, can I go back to indulging myself now"

'nuff said. Besides, I watch Zero Punctuation mostly for entertainment.

 

[HanoverF]

This weeks review was definitely a low point. Worst than that review that wasn't really a review, but a travelogue about him getting his pole spit waxed at Valve.

 

[Jasede]

Yes.