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Torment Torment: Tides of Numenera Pre-Release Thread [ALPHA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Also WL2 "making them money" is really sort of false idealism. They are in reality borrowing money from the profits of their game to finish it. It is costing them profits and net capital from the game

What else do you want them to do with the money?

They either start making money from T:TON and WL2 and building the rest of their games from that capital (like Blizzard, Bioware, etc)

We already know inXile isn't going to do that. It's gonna be Kickstarter every time, baby. Maybe Obsidian too. It'll be interesting to see how their next Kickstarter goes. It might be here sooner than some people think. :M
 

Hormalakh

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i don't care what inxile is going to do as a long-term business strategy. i just want to make sure they make a GOOD t:ton game without crashing and burning as a company until T:TON is complete. anything after its release it up to inXile.
 

tuluse

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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
early access isn't a long-term business strategy.
It's nice to know that we have business experts like Hormalakh on the codex to let us know this. Otherwise I might have been fooled by something like Minecraft selling millions of copies while in alpha.
 

Hormalakh

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an exception does not make the rule tuluse. look at every other company that's tried that. minecraft also had a fairly feature complete game at alpha when it was "sold" at early access. the price point and the value given to players at the time were matched. nobody ever expected the game to become what it has become now. if they did, less people would have paid for early access at that time.

your example is also incorrect: it would be a more appropriate example if mojang continued to use early access for its other two games: scrolls and cobalt. it isn't doing that. guess why? because it wouldn't work. they've used the capital from minecraft to make the other two games.
 
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Brother None

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whenever anybody says "we aren't concerned about money" I become concerned with my money.
But I didn't say that. I would be worried too if we just weren't concerned about money. But that's not the case, the case is money is not a concern exactly because we actually do budget smartly and have people in charge who are very good at financial matters. If we actually weren't then we'd be in a situation where we'd have had to either cut down Wasteland 2's scope or release it in an unfinished state, neither of which happened. Yeah Wasteland 2 is taking longer than the initial release date (one which was set for a game with a budget of less than one million so I don't even know if you can call that a delay, that's more an issue in Kickstarter's approach), but that's not to the detriment of either us as a company, Torment as a product or to the consumers (as it'll make for a better end product), and as a studio we're in a very good situation as aside from the two Kickstarters we have income from a surprisingly well-performing back catalog, including the Bard's Tale and Choplifter HD but also amusing spikes from games like the Impossible Quiz (thanks pewdiepie), and Wasteland 2's early access has been successful as well. We are in about as good a situation as you can possibly want for a studio of our size at this point.

As for "on time", WL2, PE and DOS all slipped from their initial release dates and I don't think anyone has a problem with that for any of them. Games are complex products that take time to get right. As long as you can bear the financial burden and don't go into Duke Nukem Forever territory as Lhynn put it, it's hard to find fault with that.

As for "to actually see something in an update", sure, we'll show more in future updates. In due time. It's hard to object to primarily talking design now since it is what we're spending the most time on (along with story, but it's hard to talk about that without spoilers), and it's what people are interested in reading. But yes, we'll show more moving forward, that is not really contingent on WL2 as Torment's team does include programmers/artists independently. Like I said, pre-production doesn't mean it's all just on paper, it's just easy and more interesting to talk about the design stuff.
 

Hormalakh

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very well. i'll admit when i'm wrong. doesn't change my cynicism about inXile. we'll see what happens with the game... until then, i'll wait
 

Zed

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inXile had their second Kickstarter already. It went very well. I don't think they'll have a third mega-successful KS without anything released beyond Early Access. Besides, what would they do next?
They could do another WL or Torment game, although that requires a successful game to build on. They could probably do another game in Numenera's setting. I'm sure Obsidian wouldn't mind if they created a game in Eternity's setting. Perhaps when Torment leaves pre-production, they could go the route of creating their own IP. Maybe something like a WL2-esque sci-fi RPG, since that's one setting for this type of RPG not really exploited yet.

Obsidian won't go KS before an alpha of PoE is released. I'm hoping it will be a short-production entry in the Eternity series. Like MotB or IWD2. Ziets in charge would be sweet.
 

Ravel myluv

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inXile had their second Kickstarter already. It went very well. I don't think they'll have a third mega-successful KS without anything released beyond Early Access. Besides, what would they do next?
They could do another WL or Torment game, although that requires a successful game to build on. They could probably do another game in Numenera's setting. I'm sure Obsidian wouldn't mind if they created a game in Eternity's setting. Perhaps when Torment leaves pre-production, they could go the route of creating their own IP. Maybe something like a WL2-esque sci-fi RPG, since that's one setting for this type of RPG not really exploited yet.

Obsidian won't go KS before an alpha of PoE is released. I'm hoping it will be a short-production entry in the Eternity series. Like MotB or IWD2. Ziets in charge would be sweet.

I doubt Obsidian would let InXile do something in their PoE new franchise, since they plan to make sequels if the game is successful.

I also think Obsidian won't wait to release an alpha to launch a second kickstarter. I think it will come a week or two after a first long gameplay video.
 

Zed

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I also think Obsidian won't wait to release an alpha to launch a second kickstarter. I think it will come a week or two after a first long gameplay video.
I'm sure I recently read something about Obsidian not releasing a KS before an alpha or beta. Perhaps it was something Roguey made up.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Pillars of Eternity isn't going to be publicly released as an alpha. That's Torment and D:OS.

They can still "release" it internally and make a video, though.
 

Zed

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Pillars of Eternity isn't going to be publicly released as an alpha. That's Torment and D:OS.

They can still "release" it internally and make a video, though.
Perhaps not publicly, no, but they will release something playable showcasing the basics and combat.
 

Ravel myluv

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I also think Obsidian won't wait to release an alpha to launch a second kickstarter. I think it will come a week or two after a first long gameplay video.
I'm sure I recently read something about Obsidian not releasing a KS before an alpha or beta. Perhaps it was something Roguey made up.

I read something stating it would be in march or something. Highly unlikely they'll have an alpha released before then.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I also think Obsidian won't wait to release an alpha to launch a second kickstarter. I think it will come a week or two after a first long gameplay video.
I'm sure I recently read something about Obsidian not releasing a KS before an alpha or beta. Perhaps it was something Roguey made up.

I read something stating it would be in march or something. Highly unlikely they'll have an alpha released before then.

You read that here: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...ure-kickstarters-at-rock-paper-shotgun.88469/

“I’m happy to make Eternity, and the hope is to come up with another Kickstarter that people would be interested in. My hope is that by March or April of next year, we’ll have something we can kind of start talking to people about.”

Notice that "starting to talk to people about" doesn't mean the Kickstarter starts then.
 

throwaway

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Been pretty quiet on this front. Given how busy (designer meetings etc) it was before W2's release became an issue I'm inclined not to buy that it fit perfectly into their plans. With the further push W2 got I wonder at what point reiteration will turn into thumb twiddling.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
WL2 itself was very quiet during preproduction. That's just inXile's style.
 

hiver

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Oy, Oy!
Can we have one thread where i dont have to think about w2 beta?

we were promised a new screenshot or some sort of new mockup and i could really use some refreshment. And more info on things and stuffs.
besides, im just waiting for them to post something so i can post one of the latest scientific discoveries on how to boost creativity.

... ready when you are devs. :)
 

hiver

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5OXBM8g.jpg
 

StaticSpine

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GamesBeat checked in with 10 large Kickstarters on their current status, Torment included. Brian Fargo comments:

Update: Torment is still in heavy preproduction, inXile CEO Brian Fargo told GamesBeat. The team has generated about 800 pages of design documents and a prototype for one of the crisis areas. “We are working on some beautiful new screens, which we hope to show in the next 90 days or so,” he said. “We are thankful for the long design stage we were given thanks to crowdfunding.”
http://tormentrpg.tumblr.com/

three months till new screens :M
 

Brother None

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Really indepth questions and answers in this interview with Adam Heine on the Italian Torment blog.

Focus is a really big deal in Numenera. There are almost thirty Foci in the Corebook and they all have a deep influence on character development. How many of them can we expect to see in Torment? Will the Last Castoff and his companions have different Foci? Are we going to experience something new/different compared to the tabletop game?

Focus is a big deal, and we want to emphasize the specialness of it. To that end:

  • The PC will be able to choose from several different Foci at or near the start of the game.
  • Torment’s PC will have the unique ability to change his Focus at will (though not necessarily for free; more on that later). So not only can you try out different Foci without restarting the game, but you will unlock new Foci throughout the game and can switch over to the new ones if you want.
  • We haven’t finalized our Foci design yet, but we’re planning for at least a couple of PC Foci unique to Torment, in addition to those we adapt from the Corebook (which will be many).
  • Companions will have Foci unavailable to the PC, each uniquely suited to their character. (Although not the sole reason for this decision, this supports the Numenera rule that no two party members should share the same Focus).
  • Some Companions will have new Foci made up especially for them.
  • In the Meres (you know about the Meres, right? In which the PC temporarily takes control of another person’s body during some critical point in their life), the character whose body the PC inhabits can also have their own Focus. Sometimes this is a Focus that was already available to the PC or a Companion, but other times it will be unique to that Mere. This lets us explore Foci that are uniquely cool but that would be difficult to design for across the entire game (like Exists Partially Out of Phase, which enables the character to walk through walls).
This sounds like a lot of Foci (I actually have almost 30 listed in the initial draft of the design doc), but it’s far from finalized. Additionally, less than half the Foci in the initial draft are marked as A-priority (meaning we will do them in some form); the rest are necessarily marked as “we’ll do this as resources allow.”

Numenera providers players with lots of unique options during character creation, but it also features a fairly linear character progression, probably because of its huge list of gears (Artifacts and Cyphers mostly) that work like Skills or Perks. Are you aiming for the same result in Torment? Or will leveling be a more open-ended affair? As a rule, what do you think about gear-centric advancement systems?

Well, first, we are implementing Artifacts and Cyphers as close to the spirit of the tabletop as we can. So Cyphers are planned to be unique (some may overlap in abilities, but each cypher will be different), some of them powerful, all of them one-shot, and all of them encouraged to be used (i.e. we are implementing the tabletop game’s limits on how many cyphers a character can safely carry). We’re even extending the concepts with our crafting design (which you may have read about), giving the player more options for item progression and customization.

As for character progression, we’re aiming for a little more customization than the tabletop provides. We’ll have more class abilities than in the Corebook, a defined set of Skills, and the PC will be able to switch his Focus on the fly. So there should be enough there to give the player a sense of progression and choice at each Tier (plus Numenera’s character upgrades and customizations between Tiers: increasing Stat Pools or Stat Edge, learning a new Skill, increasing maximum Effort Level, etc).

Regarding gear-centric advancement systems in general, what I like about them is they allow the player to adapt to new situations as he finds them. Come across a pack of armor-wearing gorillas immune to your poison attack? Switch out your poison weapons for something that will work against them.

That doesn’t mean I like gear-centric systems as a rule, of course. I think any system can be made to work, but it depends on the implementation. If the player can always switch gear without a cost or a trade-off, then it can become too easy to fend off any situation.

What I like about Numenera’s Cypher system, though, is how it encourages players to use items rather than hoard them. I always hoard consumables in RPGs, which basically means I’m missing out on a portion of the game because “I might need this later.” But in Numenera, I can only hold a limited number of Cyphers, and I know I’m going to find more around every corner, so rather than hoarding them, I find myself looking for clever opportunities to use them. It’s a great consumables system, in my opinion.

Also, you can now ask Adam questions on his own blog, a la Formspring.
 

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