Incline Battle Brothers + Beasts & Exploration, Warriors of the North and Blazing Deserts DLC Thread

[Reinhardt]

Orkz

 

[Teut Busnet]

Ok, I just slayed the Kraken.

It was invisible - or maybe just really well camouflaged.

Spoiler

I also have to say that you most likely need

Spoiler

Polearm weapons

or you're fucked isn't really a great choice. Especially in such a long fight, where you can spend 30-40 rounds chopping off tentacles before you realise you need to advance now. Not bad though.

 

[vazha]

What's the tactic there (never fought it before, about to, as soon as I have 17 necro ashes) - do i need tanks & polearms or will greatswords do the job?

 

[Modron]

What's the tactic there (never fought it before, about to, as soon as I have 17 necro ashes) - do i need tanks & polearms or will greatswords do the job?

Spoiler

You need at least one guy with reach because the krakken will insta gib whoever gets within 1 tile of his main body. 2 should be quite fine as damage you do to the tentacles is transferred to the main body albeit only up to a point. Also high melee on everyone is nice because it's the skill that is checked to break free yourself or others from the tentacles that drag you away towards the krakken's maw.

 

[vazha]

Ahh I see. Are there multiple tentacles or am I better bringing in a billhook instead of a warscythe?

 

[Modron]

Ahh I see. Are there multiple tentacles or am I better bringing in a billhook instead of a warscythe?

Spoiler

Unlimited tentacles, granted at first it is limited to 8 but after you kill enough of them it works down to just 5 regenerating ones that perpetually grab you such that 2 handers which take more than 4 ap to swing aren't that useful outside of the necessary reach weapons.

 

[Teut Busnet]

What's the tactic there (never fought it before, about to, as soon as I have 17 necro ashes) - do i need tanks & polearms or will greatswords do the job?

Spoiler

Give 1H weapons (I took swords) to your 2hBros, you'll want to be able to attack and move or move and free a Brother. I only had two Polearms, three would be optimal, I guess. Polehammers for the huge amount of armor should do well, but it didn't take me too long with my Longaxes. Don't bring archers, you need Bros with high melee attack ratings so you can reliably free yourself and others from the tentacles. The Goblin Trophy is useful, because it prevents being grabbed.

 

[vazha]

Do Krakens bleed? If yes, it might be the niche battle where the goblin jagged pike would shine - 2 tiles, 5 aps (for two-handers) and stack of bleed with each turn.

 

[Teut Busnet]

Spoiler

The Tentacles do - at least they got the 'Bleed' status. Not sure about the Kraken itself, but I don't think I caused bleeding with about two dozen hits of my Longaxes. Maybe unnecessary to mention, but keep your Bros close together, so that at least two can attempt to free a captured one.

 

[Taka-Haradin puolipeikko]

https://steamcommunity.com/games/365360/announcements/detail/1692689571340497500

Update 1.2.0.22
3 January - rapsdjff

Bugfixes for things reported over the holidays.

Changelog for 1.2.0.22

• Added new 'Hardware Sound' option to audio options menu. This is enabled by default, but can be disabled if you experience any issues with sound such as sound effects missing or playing abnormally quiet/loud. Requires restart of the game to take effect.
  
• Changed tools to be available more often and in higher quantities in larger cities and settlements with surrounding manufacturing locations.
  
• Fixed Kraken head not showing properly on its assigned tile in some cases.
  
• Fixed combat between AI parties on the worldmap not resolving in some cases.
  
• Fixed characters not deserting the player when they should.
  
• Fixed news about conquered towns and random events sometimes not firing during civil war late game crisis. You may get spammed a bit with events upon loading an existing save until the event queue is unclogged.
  
• Fixed Potion of Oblivion not properly removing skills and effects gained from perks.
  
• Fixed combat freezing on AI turn under specific circumstances.
  
• Fixed issue with 'The enemy is retreating' dialog sometimes awkwardly appearing when the next round has already started.
  
• Fixed various minor issues.

 

[Prime Junta]

One thing's been niggling me about the advice given here in re building your bros.

Basically, it's super end game focused. Yes in the very late game Zweihänders and other big weapons rule, but at least IME it's incredibly rare to have Zweihänders and bros experienced enough to use them and... not die, until the first endgame crisis. Getting to that crisis is the problem, and for that journey the rules are different.

Simply put, all the way up to and including the first endgame crisis, the only thing standing between you and oblivion is a shieldwall with enough shield specialist bros in it. Fight me.

Also, archers and arbalesters are super powerful in the early game and it's useful to keep one as a sniper even pretty late into the campaign.

I.e. if you want to make it to and through the first endgame crisis, go with shieldbros in the front, pikebros and 1 or tops 2 archers in the back. After that, you do you.

 

[hivemind]

just build people to use twohander while u have tjem use shields....

this isnt't hard .............................

 

[Whiskeyjack]

just build people to use twohander while u have tjem use shields....

this isnt't hard .............................

Yeah, the stat distribution is pretty much the same, and a lot of early perks suck/are a bit trappy anyway. Student levels you faster + let's you have an extra late game perk instead of a kind of crappy 2md rank one. Recover is awesome for fights that drag. Brawny and rotation are good no matter what. Underdog is a must for any frontline bro. And then you get BF and go crazy with 2H bros from then on.

 

[Prime Junta]

just build people to use twohander while u have tjem use shields....

this isnt't hard .............................

Nope. Perks are different and some stats are different.

 

[Whiskeyjack]

just build people to use twohander while u have tjem use shields....

this isnt't hard .............................

Nope. Perks are different and some stats are different.

Which stats are different? MA, MD, and FAT are your primary, with a dash of health and resolve when you get a bad roll on a primary stat.

Shield expert is probably the only thing that a non 2H bro would want from the standard 2H build (at least to the point until 2H become functional when they get battleforged). After BF you may branch off (probably not killing frenzy, maybe not berserk, but definitely indom, and obviously not reach advantage).

Even on a shieldbro, leveling Rdef isn't a very good ROI since kite shields are so strong there. That takes out anticipation's value as well. Steelbrow - normally I think that's viable for nimble builds instead of BF builds. Colossus is not a great perk investment for non nimble builds, but even then, the whole point of a shield bro is not to get hit.

I just don't see where there is a *huge* divergence up to level 7 between building a shield bro and a 2H bro. After 7 you probably branch out, definitely after level 8 (depends on if you want to get indom at 8 or wait a bit - I go for either KF or Reach Advantage first depending on which 2H weapons I have at that point and whether the 2H bro is going to hit consistently enough to trigger either of those procs). The only divergence I can think of is at level 4, where you take brawny or rotation instead of shield expert, but both of those are good perks for a shieldbro anyway.

 

[Teut Busnet]

One thing's been niggling me about the advice given here in re building your bros.

Basically, it's super end game focused. Yes in the very late game Zweihänders and other big weapons rule, but at least IME it's incredibly rare to have Zweihänders and bros experienced enough to use them and... not die, until the first endgame crisis. Getting to that crisis is the problem, and for that journey the rules are different.

Simply put, all the way up to and including the first endgame crisis, the only thing standing between you and oblivion is a shieldwall with enough shield specialist bros in it. Fight me.

Also, archers and arbalesters are super powerful in the early game and it's useful to keep one as a sniper even pretty late into the campaign.

I.e. if you want to make it to and through the first endgame crisis, go with shieldbros in the front, pikebros and 1 or tops 2 archers in the back. After that, you do you.

A lack of ranged units will put you in positions where you have to charge though.

Even suboptimal archers will encourage your enemies to attack, wich is advantageous the vast majority of times.

 

[vazha]

One thing's been niggling me about the advice given here in re building your bros.

Basically, it's super end game focused. Yes in the very late game Zweihänders and other big weapons rule, but at least IME it's incredibly rare to have Zweihänders and bros experienced enough to use them and... not die, until the first endgame crisis. Getting to that crisis is the problem, and for that journey the rules are different.

Simply put, all the way up to and including the first endgame crisis, the only thing standing between you and oblivion is a shieldwall with enough shield specialist bros in it. Fight me.

Also, archers and arbalesters are super powerful in the early game and it's useful to keep one as a sniper even pretty late into the campaign.

I.e. if you want to make it to and through the first endgame crisis, go with shieldbros in the front, pikebros and 1 or tops 2 archers in the back. After that, you do you.

Not sure i follow your logic - What prevents you from using perk calculator and building your future two-handers as passable shield/spearbros in early game?
The early perks are pretty much the same for any build. You need backstabber, you need that ranged defense buff, colossus, brawny and fortified mind. Student too. Late game add reach advantage, berserk, frenzy, indomitable/battleforged, preferred weapon focus and you re ready to go. If you mass-field two-handers (especially promising ones) in early game, of course you'll get wrecked by marksmen and their ilk.

 

[Prime Junta]

Which stats are different? MA, MD, and FAT are your primary, with a dash of health and resolve when you get a bad roll on a primary stat.

Damagebros need RD because they will be targeted and won't have shields. Shieldbros don't. Damagebros need a weapon spec. Shieldbros don't. Damagebros will find Rotation highly useful to get out of trouble; shieldbros not so much.

More to the point, starting stats for the bros are different. Damagebros will want as high MA as possible; shieldbros can make do with less. A bro with decent starting MD and HP will make for a perfectly good shieldbro; a bro with middling MA will never make a good damagebro.

These differences might seem small but there are only so many perks and so many levelups you can take. If you're growing your 2H damagebros from the start, you will significantly gimp yourself in the early/midgame when things are hardest. Even when you start having decent damagebros, it helps a lot to have shield experts around because their shieldwall will also protect them.

 

[Teut Busnet]

Late 2H bros won't need ranged defense because they'll have 300+ / 320+ armor and just laugh at projectile damage. (Or you give them a kite shield to wheater the storm - in Gobbo City for example)

Rotation isn't only a perk to get out of trouble, it's useful to help other Bros or even use it offensively. Every melee Bro should have 'Rotation'.

Shields are still very useful without the 'Shield Expert' perk.

 

[Prime Junta]

Late 2H bros won't need ranged defense because they'll have 300+ / 320+ armor and just laugh at projectile damage.

Maybe, but 2H bros with decent RD are supremely useful way before that.

See, this is my point exactly -- y'all are talking about extremely late-game optimisation, like way past the first endgame crisis. Most of us never play that far. I'm only just now even continuing after the endgame crisis, I've always finished the game at that point. That's all very interesting I'm sure but in my view the early-midgame is much harder, and build advice -- especially for relativey newbs to the game -- should address that. I don't think I've ever had even one bro with 300/320 armour, let alone a full dozen!

Put another way, if you're assaulting the Black Monolith on Veteran or higher, I don't think you need much build advice.

 

[Teut Busnet]

You could at least have quoted the sentence afterwards too, where I mention you can still use a shield with a 2H Bro before the frontlines clash...

A two-hander is viable once you get over 200 armor - that should be possible way before the first crisis hits.

 

[Tigranes]

I don't really see it in this case. You can't pick exactly what stat distribution your bros will have anyway, so you aren't always rolling with the 'optimal'. You might have a bro built for shieldbroing that later becomes a very competent twohandbro.

I do like to kit out a bit heavier armour on a dude being built for Nimbledodge, or stick a shield on a future twohandbro. That doesn't mean I take Shield Expert. On Veteran at least, I don't think your bros need to be so painstakingly optimised to survive into level 8+, so it's not as if one or two perk differences are really killing them.

I think, until late game, the rule of the game is be a bit more flexible with your bros and be ready to give a Sword specialist an Axe for that fight or a shield or whatever.

 

[hivemind]

its literally just a brainless grind where nothing matters until like day 120

 

[Whiskeyjack]

You could at least have quoted the sentence afterwards too, where I mention you can still use a shield with a 2H Bro before the frontlines clash...

A two-hander is viable once you get over 200 armor - that should be possible way before the first crisis hits.

And if your first crisis is noble war, you'll be swimming in 200-250 helms and 190-210 armor, and should probably be able to dagger down a knight or two for some 300+ pieces.

Late 2H bros won't need ranged defense because they'll have 300+ / 320+ armor and just laugh at projectile damage.

Maybe, but 2H bros with decent RD are supremely useful way before that.

See, this is my point exactly -- y'all are talking about extremely late-game optimisation, like way past the first endgame crisis. Most of us never play that far. I'm only just now even continuing after the endgame crisis, I've always finished the game at that point. That's all very interesting I'm sure but in my view the early-midgame is much harder, and build advice -- especially for relativey newbs to the game -- should address that. I don't think I've ever had even one bro with 300/320 armour, let alone a full dozen!

Put another way, if you're assaulting the Black Monolith on Veteran or higher, I don't think you need much build advice.

RD on a 2H bro is a complete waste. The only ranged you should be concerned with are heavy crossbows from arbs in the noble war getting a headshot. Everything else is shrugged off by battleforged. And again - just carry a kite shield if you're so worried.

I dont have anyone pick up a 2H weapon until level 7. You're just archer fodder until then.

Edit - and except in rare cases, I dont take a weapon spec until level 10 or 11. Why spec my best guy for swords when I may find an amazing unique hammer?

 

[Prime Junta]

I dont have anyone pick up a 2H weapon until level 7. You're just archer fodder until then.

Fair enough. I do sometimes. It does work if you do pump RD and have shieldbros on both sides.

Edit - and except in rare cases, I dont take a weapon spec until level 10 or 11. Why spec my best guy for swords when I may find an amazing unique hammer?

I've never found any amazing unique weapon. I've barely found any unique weapons at all. Passing on the weapon spec on the off-chance that I might find one seems really dumb. If I do I'll just hire another swordmaster and train him up to use it -- surely by that point I'd have the cash.

Some of the weapon specs are massively useful however: for heavybros the lower fatigue penalty makes a huge difference, and some give tons more versatility. Polearm specialty makes it possible to have one protect your flank effectively, same with axe specialty and a longaxe.

Question to you and others:

(1) What day, roughly, are you in when you have these wonderful bros with 320/300 armour and unique weapons?
(2) How many? Do you have one star striker, or is your frontline all 320/300 heavybros with 2Hs?
(3) Ironman?
(4) If this is before the first endgame crisis, can you share some tips on how to reasonably consistently get there?
(5) How do you deal with archers in the early/midgame? Brigand marksman hit %s are absurd. Giving everybody but shieldbros Anticipation seems like a bit of a waste IMO, and those fuckers can really ruin your day in the opening round.