Review Fragland shows affection for KOTOR

[Vault Dweller]

Tags: Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic

<a href=http://www.fragland.net>Fragland</a> posted this <a href=http://www.fragland.net/index.php?page=reviews&rid=308>review</a> of everyone's favourite game, <a href=http://www.bioware.com/games/knights_old_republic>KOTOR</a> giving it <b>90.3%</b> which is kinda retarded if you ask me. I refer to <b>.3%</b>, of course.
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<blockquote>When I first heard that the battle-system of KoToR would be turn-based I started to spontaneously throw up. I am absolutely no lover of this concept but in this game it luckily has been worked out very well. Members of your party who die during combat will re-emerge after a fight with a minimum on health point. The game isn’t over until your complete party has deceased but since you can save at any time this is not a big problem.</blockquote>
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I'm beginning to suspect that people who react that way to turn-based combat are simply morons who can't comprehend the concept of tactics and planning and thus see no reason in having turns.
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Spotted at: <A HREF="http://www.gengamers.com">GenGamers</A>

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

::hangs the "Unavailable for Comments" sign at the door::

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

::scribbles "due to personal problems involving inflatable dolls." on the sign and sneaks off like a thief in the night::

 

[Vault Dweller]

::scribbles "due to personal problems involving inflatable dolls." on the sign and sneaks off like a thief in the night::

lol, this is absolutely hilarious Thank you, Otaku

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

::scribbles "due to personal problems involving inflatable dolls." on the sign and sneaks off like a thief in the night::

:shock:

 

[Jed]

KotOR is turn-based? Why didn't someone tell me? I just thought the combat was shitty old pause-time...

 

[Volourn]

You both thought wrong. It has good old pause-time; but with less stuff to do...

 

[Vault Dweller]

KotOR is turn-based? Why didn't someone tell me? I just thought the combat was shitty old pause-time...

No, it's definitely turn-based, every profeshunal review says so:

Game Power AU: The combat isn't real-time, although it may appear to be, which means that your characters vital statistics, class, skill set and weapons all matter in a battle – your hand-eye coordination doesn't, and if your statistics aren't a match for your opponent's, no amount of ducking, dodging or blocking will save your skin

OcPrices: Now before you run away screaming, thinking this sounds really dull, boring, and extremely nerdish, please stop and listen… it actually works extremely well. For starters, despite technically being turn based, actions are played out in real time and all the dice rolling and character stats for combat are worked out in the background away from your eyes.

GameSpot AU: Knights Of The Old Republic's combat model takes some getting used to. While it initially looks like it's all done in real time, it's actually just faked;

Wicked Toast: The combat itself is turn-based, yet done so fluidly that it feels like real-time

Armchair Empire: When you’re exploring, everything is real-time but once you jump into combat KOTOR shifts to turn-based action. While turned-based combat may seem weird considering all the Star Wars action games that have been released, it works

GameChronicles: It’s all turn-based and all the results are determined by the roll of unseen dice combined with modifiers based on your stats, skills, and any items or equipment you have equipped. The combat will actually play itself out if you leave it alone but by fine-tuning the combat you can be a devastating force of nature.

PC Gameworld: So much is streamlined that the game, essentially turn-based, has a real-time feel that draws you into the combat, without making you feel like you've given up one ounce of control.

 

[Jed]

No, it's definitely turn-based, every profeshunal review says so:

Well, if the EXPURTS! say so, who am I to dissent?

 

[Vault Dweller]

it's like that thing in PST where if you claim 10 times that you're someone else, that fictional character becomes real. At this point I have no doubt that KOTOR is teh finest turn-based game I've ever played

 

[Jed]

it's like that thing in PST where if you claim 10 times that you're someone else, that fictional character becomes real. At this point I have no doubt that KOTOR is teh finest turn-based game I've ever played

Wha? I must've missed that one. What part of the game was that in?

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Troughout PS:T when people ask you their names, you can say your name is 'Adahn'. If you say it many times, it eventually sort of becomes true, and you'll meet 'Adahn' in the Smoldering Corpse bar (or was it the Dustie's bar?). You talk to him, and all. I think he even gives you an item, before disappearing.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Yep, you meet this character in the Smoldering Corpse bar, the higher your wisdom and intelligence are, the more stuff you can get from him. If you tell him that he isn't real, he will disappear

 

[Jed]

I never said my name was 'Adahn' in the game because I couldn't figure out why my Nameless One knew to say it. I never remembered seeing it before it mysteriously appeared in my dialogue choices.

Damn. What does he give you, anyway?

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

According to DSimpson's FAQ, found here:

NPC: Adahn (doesn't join)

Try not to reveal that you made Adahn up. Ask him if he knows who you
are and he'll say that you're an old friend. Say your farewells, and
Adahn will stop you saying that he has some of your stuff. With an INT
or WIS of 14 you can have him check his left sleeve again:

250 EXP
Adahn's Ring (sell for 50 copper)

If you have to ask "did you lose it" you get the ring but nothing else.

With an INT or WIS of 16 or more you can ask if there was some money
that went along with this:

500 EXP
100 Copper

Lastly, with an INT or WIS of 17 or more you can ask for that old magic
item he was to give you:

Adahn's Dagger +1
1000 EXP

After which, Adahn vanishes.

This is after Trias and Curst Gone.

 

[dagamer667]

I guess it's too hard for some of those over-educated professionals to comprehend such complicated idea as continuous turn-based combat. NWN and KOTOR have clearly timed rounds, but will only pause if the player hits the pause button. It's not surprising though. Web "journalism" was never famous for its commitment to being objective and informative.

Anyway, I believe the reason many people dislike TB is due to designers failing to account for the specifics of TB than the system itself.

How many of you cursed when you ran into a dozen ants or rats in FO games? I know I did. Nothing beats waiting for some ant to crawl into your line of fire so that you can cook it with one shot of your Plasma Rifle. A pointless and tedious fight that dragged on due to the slower-paced TB design. Silent Storm suffers from the same problem. In larger maps, enemy turns can frequently take up to a minute until you trim the enemy headcount a bit. To add insult to injury, the game also gives "civillians" a turn even though all they do is pointlessly shuffle around the map. Contrast that with ToEE, where "adjacent" monsters acted simultaneously, and where most fights were relatively short. When you had to face over 10 enemies, you usually had the fireball spell or other WMDs to quickly reduce the enemy count. I still remember how handy turn undead was in the big fight on the forth floor . That's probably why I enjoyed ToEE TB far more than I did Fallout 2. Another game I remember is Anachronox. It's not strictly an RPG, but its TB fights were also enjoyable because there was not a lot of combat and only a few fights were protracted enough to become tedious. Simply put, in TB games you can't throw hordes of low-level fodder like you can in RT.

I get a feeling RT is so popular because far too many RPGs rely on throwing low-xp monsters (games like NWN even cheat on XP awards to keep you from leveling up) to keep you too busy to notice the scarcity of anything else. Imagine a turn based NWN with lvl 8 PC forced to play the neverending whack-a-mole with cr1 (or whatever the heck it is) goblins.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

I guess it's too hard for some of those over-educated professionals to comprehend such complicated idea as continuous turn-based combat.

There really isn't such a thing. There's no such thing as simultaneous turn based either, because that's called phase based.

How many of you cursed when you ran into a dozen ants or rats in FO games? I know I did. Nothing beats waiting for some ant to crawl into your line of fire so that you can cook it with one shot of your Plasma Rifle. A pointless and tedious fight that dragged on due to the slower-paced TB design.

That's why I cranked up my combat speed slider for things like that. Still, those ants shouldn't have been there in the first place.

Silent Storm suffers from the same problem. In larger maps, enemy turns can frequently take up to a minute until you trim the enemy headcount a bit. To add insult to injury, the game also gives "civillians" a turn even though all they do is pointlessly shuffle around the map.

Silent Storm needs a combat speed slider in a BAD way.

I get a feeling RT is so popular because far too many RPGs rely on throwing low-xp monsters (games like NWN even cheat on XP awards to keep you from leveling up) to keep you too busy to notice the scarcity of anything else. Imagine a turn based NWN with lvl 8 PC forced to play the neverending whack-a-mole with cr1 (or whatever the heck it is) goblins.

NWN's combat bored me to tears - especially as a melee character. All I did was click on a monster and watch the rounds go by for the most part. Every now and then I'd chug a potion or click on Power Attack. I fail to see how NWN's combat is a step up from turn based because of the lack of doing anything.

 

[Volourn]

Lack of doing stuff? Weirdd.. You, and I have different copies of NWN then as that only occurs wikth the really easy battles which can occur in any game where you basically do nothing.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Lack of doing stuff? Weirdd.. You, and I have different copies of NWN then as that only occurs wikth the really easy battles which can occur in any game where you basically do nothing.

I mentioned drinking potions and power attack.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

I mentioned drinking potions and power attack.

Yeah. That's doing stuff alright.

 

[Volourn]

Yeah, sure is. :D Espicially when there's lots of thinsg you could be doing to help your cause in a battle.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Yeah, sure is. :D Espicially when there's lots of thinsg you could be doing to help your cause in a battle.

Like eating donuts and looking at the screen!

 

[Volourn]

Or having one handed fun after removing Aribeths' armour!

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Or having one handed fun after removing Aribeths' armour!

Teh jiggly wins!

 

[Volourn]

Darn. i let the secret fo the real reaosn why I like NWN come out. Noooooo!