Review Yahtzee: DA2 takes it cues from Mass Effect

[DarkUnderlord]

Tags: Dragon Age 2

<p>Opinions on Dragon Age 2 have been mixed. <a href="http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/2978-Dragon-Age-II">Yahtzee ventures forth</a> to "decide whether it's a vastly improved epic, perfectly spiced with all the gay sex that got cut out of Mass Effect 2 - or a rushed out cash-in with more loading time than a truck full of giant sea turtles":</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p style="padding-left: 30px;">There are two types of games made today. Those that are made mainly because the developers thought it would be a lovely thing for everyone to play and those that are made mainly because the developers thought it would be lovely to add another ball-room to their golden money palace.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p style="padding-left: 30px;">DA2 sits firmly in the latter. It takes its cues from Mass Effect 2 [single named character and dialogue responses], has re-used environments and combat which consists of wading in and mashing the attack button.</p>
<p style="padding-left: 30px;">&nbsp;</p>
<p style="padding-left: 30px;">It's not a game, it's "a holding pattern" for Dragon Age 3.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Will Dragon Age 3 be even more dumbed down or will BioWare actually decide to make that one into an RPG?</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Thanks <strong>Fens</strong>!</p>

 

[Zarniwoop]

Why would they make DA3 better?

Biofags love the new shit, the streamlining and dumbing down. They think DA2 and ME2 are some of the best RPG's ever made, and they buy it in their millions, making lots of $$$. Hell they're even happy when the almighty EA bans someone from their game for criticizing it.

If more derp=more money, why would they make a game where you needed an IQ of more than 70 to play it?

 

[thesheeep]

Well, BioWare games get better the more they accept that they are action games and shooters.
ME2 already was massively superior to ME1. If DA3 follows that path, it can only be better than DA2.

I doubt BioWare is able to really create a true RPG these days.

 

[Forest Dweller]

Am I the only one who thinks he tries too hard?

 

[KazikluBey]

Yes, you are a unique little snowflake.

 

[Achilles]

Yahtzee's reviews are not reviews at all. You just watch them for the lulz, if you're into that type of humor.

 

[Brother None]

Hating Yahtzee has gotten old. It's the new loving Yahtzee.

 

[Xor]

I doubt many of the people who bought DA2 and didn't like it compared to the first game will buy DA3. Bioware may have already lost a sizeable portion of their customer base for that game. The fanboys who post on their forums obviously will, but that group only represents a small minority of their overall customer base. You generally have to be pretty devoted to a game to register on the company forums and post about it.

Reputations are fragile things. It's very difficult to make a good reputation, but it's incredibly easy to destroy one.

Unless DA2 actually manages to make new customers for Bioware (which is clearly what they intended) they're going to be in trouble when DA3 rolls around.

 

[Forest Dweller]

Hopefully so. It's time they learn a lesson and maybe teach it to other companies as well.

 

[Mastermind]

I doubt many of the people who bought DA2 and didn't like it compared to the first game will buy DA3. Bioware may have already lost a sizeable portion of their customer base for that game. The fanboys who post on their forums obviously will, but that group only represents a small minority of their overall customer base. You generally have to be pretty devoted to a game to register on the company forums and post about it.

Reputations are fragile things. It's very difficult to make a good reputation, but it's incredibly easy to destroy one.

Unless DA2 actually manages to make new customers for Bioware (which is clearly what they intended) they're going to be in trouble when DA3 rolls around.

Try actually reading their forums. The DA2 bashing is practically endless.

 

[DragoFireheart]

I doubt many of the people who bought DA2 and didn't like it compared to the first game will buy DA3. Bioware may have already lost a sizeable portion of their customer base for that game. The fanboys who post on their forums obviously will, but that group only represents a small minority of their overall customer base. You generally have to be pretty devoted to a game to register on the company forums and post about it.

Reputations are fragile things. It's very difficult to make a good reputation, but it's incredibly easy to destroy one.

Unless DA2 actually manages to make new customers for Bioware (which is clearly what they intended) they're going to be in trouble when DA3 rolls around.

Try actually reading their forums. The DA2 bashing is practically endless.

Generally, if the forums of a game company contain some of the bashing (not just a couple disgruntled people, but dozens), it's likely that the silent majority partially agrees with them enough to the extent that said game company made a bad rep for themselves.

 

[Xor]

For the people who are bashing DA2 on the bioware boards, all bioware has to do is say "DA3 is better" and they'll probably believe it. They are the devoted. It will take a consistent and noticeable decline in quality over multiple games before many of them abandon bioware.

 

[potemkin]

Where is the "back to normal speed" button in that video? Are there subtitles or something?

 

[Azrael the cat]

I doubt many of the people who bought DA2 and didn't like it compared to the first game will buy DA3. Bioware may have already lost a sizeable portion of their customer base for that game. The fanboys who post on their forums obviously will, but that group only represents a small minority of their overall customer base. You generally have to be pretty devoted to a game to register on the company forums and post about it.

Reputations are fragile things. It's very difficult to make a good reputation, but it's incredibly easy to destroy one.

Unless DA2 actually manages to make new customers for Bioware (which is clearly what they intended) they're going to be in trouble when DA3 rolls around.

Try actually reading their forums. The DA2 bashing is practically endless.

Generally, if the forums of a game company contain some of the bashing (not just a couple disgruntled people, but dozens), it's likely that the silent majority partially agrees with them enough to the extent that said game company made a bad rep for themselves.

Agreed. DA2, however, will still sell fuckloads. The pre-orders and early purchases (pre anti-hype spreading) alone probably are enough to make it a mega-hit, and lots of Bioware fans (not talking about the forum-dwelling diehard fans, but the vast numbers who see them as a reliable developer and buy on reputation) would purchase it due to their confidence in the Bioware brand, even if they see a bad review - they trust Bioware more than they trust internet drama.

BUT it may well cost them come DA3. Crap games don't sink an established developer until their next product, as gamers often buy on reputation, and the reputation of a franchise/developer is set by their PREVIOUS game, not their current one. Plenty of folks might not 'hate' DA2, but find it mediocre enough that it isn't worth paying full price. Next time, unless DA3 is a substantial improvement, they'll try the demo first, or wait until it drops in price, or until it's been scrutinised by 'the internet'. If it turns out to be as terrible as DA2, those gamers won't buy it at all. It isn't that DA2 means that DA3 will tank - but it means that DA3 will be held up to a degree of consumer scrutiny rather than coasting in to mega-hit sales on the basis of pre-orders and early purchases alone.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Agreed. DA2, however, will still sell fuckloads. The pre-orders and early purchases (pre anti-hype spreading) alone probably are enough to make it a mega-hit, and lots of Bioware fans (not talking about the forum-dwelling diehard fans, but the vast numbers who see them as a reliable developer and buy on reputation) would purchase it due to their confidence in the Bioware brand, even if they see a bad review - they trust Bioware more than they trust internet drama.

BUT it may well cost them come DA3. Crap games don't sink an established developer until their next product, as gamers often buy on reputation, and the reputation of a franchise/developer is set by their PREVIOUS game, not their current one. Plenty of folks might not 'hate' DA2, but find it mediocre enough that it isn't worth paying full price. Next time, unless DA3 is a substantial improvement, they'll try the demo first, or wait until it drops in price, or until it's been scrutinised by 'the internet'. If it turns out to be as terrible as DA2, those gamers won't buy it at all. It isn't that DA2 means that DA3 will tank - but it means that DA3 will be held up to a degree of consumer scrutiny rather than coasting in to mega-hit sales on the basis of pre-orders and early purchases alone.

Exactly. Bioware has forever hurt their reputation. Long term fans will dwindle, newer fans may see the light and shun them, conspiracy theorists will go ape shit over their belief that EA ruined Bioware.

In the end, it doesn't matter. Bioware will go the way of Sega in regards to making good games. UTTER SHIT.

 

[Zarniwoop]

Maybe they'll also see the light with regards to "professional" review sites, and not just assume everything with a "Generally Favorable Reviews" on Metacritic is automatically any good? Critic score of 82 and user score of 43 kind of says it all doesn't it?

Then again maybe I'm just kidding myself?

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Agreed. DA2, however, will still sell fuckloads. The pre-orders and early purchases (pre anti-hype spreading) alone probably are enough to make it a mega-hit, and lots of Bioware fans (not talking about the forum-dwelling diehard fans, but the vast numbers who see them as a reliable developer and buy on reputation) would purchase it due to their confidence in the Bioware brand, even if they see a bad review - they trust Bioware more than they trust internet drama.

BUT it may well cost them come DA3. Crap games don't sink an established developer until their next product, as gamers often buy on reputation, and the reputation of a franchise/developer is set by their PREVIOUS game, not their current one. Plenty of folks might not 'hate' DA2, but find it mediocre enough that it isn't worth paying full price. Next time, unless DA3 is a substantial improvement, they'll try the demo first, or wait until it drops in price, or until it's been scrutinised by 'the internet'. If it turns out to be as terrible as DA2, those gamers won't buy it at all. It isn't that DA2 means that DA3 will tank - but it means that DA3 will be held up to a degree of consumer scrutiny rather than coasting in to mega-hit sales on the basis of pre-orders and early purchases alone.

Exactly. Bioware has forever hurt their reputation. Long term fans will dwindle, newer fans may see the light and shun them, conspiracy theorists will go ape shit over their belief that EA ruined Bioware.

In the end, it doesn't matter. Bioware will go the way of Sega in regards to making good games. UTTER SHIT.

I agree with all this, although I think Mass Effect 3 might be untainted by all this because it is made by a different team. Same with TOR. Those games exist in their own separate bubbles. But DA2 is an indication of what EA want Bioware to become, and it aint pretty. The future is grim.

 

[zelda64whatagreatgame]

it' odd that you guys are still harping on about a company that haven't released anything worthwhile since 2001 or whenever baldurs gate 2 came out. get into your heads that this company makes cliched fantasy entertainment for pre-teens and retard adults.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

it' odd that you guys are still harping on about a company that haven't released anything worthwhile since 2001 or whenever baldurs gate 2 came out. get into your heads that this company makes cliched fantasy entertainment for pre-teens and retard adults.

NWN and expansions: Good
KOTOR: Very good
Jade Empire: Very good
Mass Effect: Very good
Mass Effect 2: Very good.
Dragon Age: Very good
Dragon Age 2: Just about average.

'haven't released anything worthwhile' indeed.

 

[Virtual Vice]

Vanilla NWN, good?

Did you create your own "good" OC? Is it available somewhere?

 

[Serious_Business]

I doubt many of the people who bought DA2 and didn't like it compared to the first game will buy DA3. Bioware may have already lost a sizeable portion of their customer base for that game. The fanboys who post on their forums obviously will, but that group only represents a small minority of their overall customer base. You generally have to be pretty devoted to a game to register on the company forums and post about it.

Reputations are fragile things. It's very difficult to make a good reputation, but it's incredibly easy to destroy one.

Unless DA2 actually manages to make new customers for Bioware (which is clearly what they intended) they're going to be in trouble when DA3 rolls around.

Try actually reading their forums. The DA2 bashing is practically endless.

Generally, if the forums of a game company contain some of the bashing (not just a couple disgruntled people, but dozens), it's likely that the silent majority partially agrees with them enough to the extent that said game company made a bad rep for themselves.

Agreed. DA2, however, will still sell fuckloads. The pre-orders and early purchases (pre anti-hype spreading) alone probably are enough to make it a mega-hit, and lots of Bioware fans (not talking about the forum-dwelling diehard fans, but the vast numbers who see them as a reliable developer and buy on reputation) would purchase it due to their confidence in the Bioware brand, even if they see a bad review - they trust Bioware more than they trust internet drama.

BUT it may well cost them come DA3. Crap games don't sink an established developer until their next product, as gamers often buy on reputation, and the reputation of a franchise/developer is set by their PREVIOUS game, not their current one. Plenty of folks might not 'hate' DA2, but find it mediocre enough that it isn't worth paying full price. Next time, unless DA3 is a substantial improvement, they'll try the demo first, or wait until it drops in price, or until it's been scrutinised by 'the internet'. If it turns out to be as terrible as DA2, those gamers won't buy it at all. It isn't that DA2 means that DA3 will tank - but it means that DA3 will be held up to a degree of consumer scrutiny rather than coasting in to mega-hit sales on the basis of pre-orders and early purchases alone.

Bullshit. DA2 isn't any worst than the first one. Any casual player (which is the main market of Bioware) won't see any difference - in fact, they might see this sequel as an improvement. The hardcore rpg crowd (rpg codex) + the hardcore bioware crowd don't mean shit. The fact that these two have the same opinion does not mean anything about the game's quality - at least in terms of how enjoyable it can be for the non initiated who does not pour copious amounts of circular abstract critical thinking into his mindless entertainment

 

[sser]

SW:TOR will more than likely bury BioWare.

 

[Dark Matter]

Why would they make DA3 better?

Biofags love the new shit, the streamlining and dumbing down. They think DA2 and ME2 are some of the best RPG's ever made, and they buy it in their millions, making lots of $$$. Hell they're even happy when the almighty EA bans someone from their game for criticizing it.

If more derp=more money, why would they make a game where you needed an IQ of more than 70 to play it?

Uh, no. Most Bioware fans didn't even like DA2, let alone think it's one of the best RPG ever made. Vault Dweller's review was almost unanimously praised on the Bioware forums. Stop making shit up.

 

[Lyric Suite]

SW:TOR will more than likely bury BioWare.

We can only hope. Looks shitty enough so far.

 

[Esquilax]

SW:TOR will more than likely bury BioWare.

What do you base this on? It might, I don't know much about it, but what makes you see it as the most likely scenario?