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Age of Empires II: Definitive Edition (AKA AoE2 HD HD)

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
^ Absolutely not. I have never had an issue identifying an Age of Empires unit. The visual readability of the game is very good.
 
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^ Absolutely not. I have never had an issue identifying an Age of Empires unit. The visual readability of the game is very good.

Please read the post I was replying to, it's a solution for if they did add a wider variety of unit appearances based on cultural region, which would reduce readability.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Please read the post I was replying to, it's a solution for if they did add a wider variety of unit appearances based on cultural region, which would reduce readability.

I did read it. I really dislike the use of UI overlays to make up for a lack of visual clarity. Even if they add more regional specific units in the future, you know what it is simply by looking at it. The only issue would be if you don't know the civs. Then I could see how someone could confuse a Boyar with a Keshik, not based on visual clarity but just not remembering what something does.
 

Caim

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Not sure what to make of the Georgians, but the Armenians have some interesting things. Champions in Castle Age, with +30 HP as a unique tech? Yes please. Their unique units are pretty interesting as well, archers that ignore pierce armor and warrior priests that can fight as well as deal damage feels like a callback to Galactic Battlegrounds. Oh, and the Armenians can now hard counter relic victories by building their new unique building and creating a new relic on the map.

The new Persian bonus that grants gold when killing enemy military units with cavalry sounds nuts in larger battles.
 

Endemic

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Some more balance changes independent of the DLC are coming up soon:

 

Caim

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The new changes look cool, and as per usual probably a bit OP - Revamped Persians look insane tbh.
And the Persians aren't even DLC-exclusive, everyone will get access to them. It's not a pay to win situation this time!


Normal price is 15 bucks, 15% off if you buy before the 31st (also the release date).

Also a full campaign for everyone, centered on Tamar the Great, Thoros the Great (who were both alive in the 1160s) and Ismail I, who lived around the 1500s. Big gap here.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Gave the PUP a bit of a go and tried out the Georgians - awesome on African Clearing, can do 17 pop scouts no problem. Arena start is a bit harder, it's like a pseudo-Chinese start into a Poles type eco situation in Castle Age - will take some figuring out to find the most optimal way to set up their eco.

That 15% farming bonus given back to the Slavs feels incredible.
 

Zboj Lamignat

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So Armenians have access to fully upgraded +30hp champions in castle age, huh. That's certainly one idea about making militia-line viable.

Edit: Oops, the +30hp is imp tech.
 
Last edited:

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Armenians are an interesting one. I'm not sure which upgrade being available one age earlier is more interesting. I think Pikemen in the Feudal Age is probably the biggest one. Suddenly if you're behind and facing an imminent Knight Rush or a ball of scouts suddenly becoming Light Cav, Feudal Pikes can potentially save your life.

I think being able to research upgrades on the way up to the next age is nice for timings. Already being in Imp with Halbs pre-researched seems really nice, but maybe hard to afford the gold cost a lot of the time.

I'm not sure about Feudal Longsword or Castle Age 2HS - situationally ... sure
 

fantadomat

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Edgy Vatnik Wumao
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LoL nearly finished the expansion,it is total garbage. The campaigns are about losers and strong boss lady lol. It is sjw as they come. Also the maps are boring and i have the feel that with every new expansion the unit AI and the pathfinding becomes worst. I mean,that the units are retarded. I tell them to attack a building and they are too dumb to do that,original aoe2 had a lot better pathfinding.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
LoL nearly finished the expansion,it is total garbage. The campaigns are about losers and strong boss lady lol. It is sjw as they come. Also the maps are boring and i have the feel that with every new expansion the unit AI and the pathfinding becomes worst. I mean,that the units are retarded. I tell them to attack a building and they are too dumb to do that,original aoe2 had a lot better pathfinding.

The pathfinding is actually a lot better than before the DLC but there are some bugs with some of the commands - Patrol and Attack Move commands seem a bit bugged and so does Stand ground formation. I think the bugs have been there for a few patches.
 

fantadomat

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Edgy Vatnik Wumao
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Patrol and Attack Move commands seem a bit bugged and so does Stand ground formation
:nocountryforshitposters:

Nigga that is like all the commands....


Also pathfinding is terrible in this patch. They just cluster in a blob and can't even attack a building. When i click them a bit to the right they can't mark a way to the point because there is tree near it and go the long way around. They ignore orders only to fallow some retarded peasant half way around the map. The game is garbage...
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
There is a difference between targeting and pathfinding. The previous patch had some real wonky pathfinding issues, but the new patch is better - they replaced the short distance pathfinder with a new one - highly likely it's not perfect but I have noticed an improvement to previous.

The targeting issue is what causes units to walk around the back of something to attack it, it's because the path is blocked, so ideally they should retarget a new unit/building, but they do not.
 

Narax

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The campaigns are about losers and strong boss lady lol. It is sjw as they come.
She's the most popular monarch in Georgian history, thanks to western orientalists and romantic nationalists, even though her reign was not any more impressive than other rulers, she simply inherited the kingdom during its height, thanks to the efforts of three successful predecessors, David the Builder, Demetrius I, and George III. A campaign focused on the fragmentation of georgia would have been a lot more interesting.

Regardless, female representation is being heavily pushed in a lot of historical game titles, not just AoE. Now every dlc needs to have at least one female campaign, and in AoE4 a lot of units spawn as female, it is especially hilarious seeing the infamous mongol horde being 50% female.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
I've tried the Georgians a couple of times. I like them on a nomad start. The Mule cart wood economy feels smooth. Monaspa are pretty easy to mass. Svan Towers is a great upgrade even if you're just grabbing it for the extra damage it gives to TCs/Castles.

Haven't tried the Armenians yet - looking forward to giving them a go on a water map to try the double shot galleys, and also Arena pocket to give the Warrior monks a go, and then maybe do a big Castle age ram and 2HS push from the pocket.
 

Endemic

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I foresee a nerf to Bohemians in the next patch. FC into Hussite Wagons + monks is stomping the 1v1 ladder right now (close to 60% WR on some land maps).
 

Endemic

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Jul 16, 2012
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Yup, they are indeed getting nerfed:

GAME
Stability & Performance
Fixed a crash that occurred when typing certain numbers on the lobby search bar in multiplayer menus.
Fixed a crash that occurred when attempting to launch the title on Steam when another instance of the game from the Microsoft Store was already running.
Fixed a crash that could occur when playing custom lobbies with AI if the object tracker and world object list got desynchronized.

Graphics
Units standing behind Mule Carts now display outlines.

Audio
Fixed an issue where Gaia attack notifications would not play on Custom Maps.

UI
QoL: The option ‘Extended Unit Stats’ was added to the Interface Settings. Toggling this setting on will make the command panel show additional stats when selecting a unit or a building.
Keep technology, Watch Tower, Guard Tower, Stone Wall, Pavilion A buildings now have unique icons.
Added blue versions to several small buttons in Return of Rome mode.

Settings
Fixed an issue where the Safe Delete pop-up would only trigger if the last unit a player selected was a hero.

Hotkeys
Fixed an issue where Wood Upgrades technology hotkey was not working for Two-Man Saw.

Recorded games & Spectator
Fixed an issue where holding down Shift and left-clicking an object from another player wasn’t switching the POV to the object’s owner.

Multiplayer
Changed Enter interaction in menus so that taunts only fire when the Enter key is released, instead of every frame the key is down.
Changed the behavior of Pause during Multiplayer so that players can no longer scroll, zoom or interact with the minimap while the game is paused.

GAMEPLAY

General
Gates can now be locked before their construction is finished.
Deer and other Prey Animals now have more consistency in how long they pause before moving again.
Monks now instantly search for new healing targets instead of waiting for 3 seconds.

Fixes
Fixed an issue where Trebuchets would ignore shift commands when attacking buildings.
Fixed an issue where rams grouped with other units would stop moving before reaching an enemy target when the player issued an attack move.
Fixed an issue where Villagers would lose their field of view, and Mule Carts (if completed) would become invisible if the player rung the town bell when the Mule Carts were under construction.
Fixed an issue where if a player has converted Monks and then researches Block Printing, the player would be granted vision in an area around the converted Monks the moment the tech finished.
Fixed a rare issue where the Go Back to Work hotkey would sometimes cause Villagers to become stuck inside a building.
Fixed an issue where moving large groups of units would cause some units to stop reacting to group commands.
Fixed an issue where using the Guard command switched units formations to Line Formation.
Fixed an issue where Villagers would stay selected when using CTRL to select military.
Fixed a rare issue where units would slide across untraversable terrain when being patrolled on Stand Ground.
Warrior Priests in no attack stance can now heal allied units.
Villagers no longer can drop off resources into buildings with a Mule Cart garrisoned inside.

Campaign
General
Joan of Arc is no longer able to heal units.

Campaign Missions
Attila the Hun #1: The Scourge of God: Fixed an issue where the wrong dialogue could play after defeating Bleda.
Attila the Hun #6: The Fall of Rome: The enemy factions will now resign correctly and are no longer kept alive by Wonder or Town Center foundations.
Barbarossa #2: Henry the Lion: Player now has the correct population limit.
Bayinnaung #2: The Mandalay Cobra: Fixed an issue where some starting units would disappear shortly after closing the initial Objectives pop up.
Ismail #1: The Red Hats: Farrukh Yasar no longer splits from his army when moving out.
Ismail #4: The Fallen Amir: Shaybani Khan’s units, if they have been bypassed, can now track the player’s units and find them more easely.
Ivaylo #1: A Most Unlikely Man: Fixed an issue where a rock formation in the right side of the map was not displayed as expected.
Sforza #4: Blood and Betrayal: Fixed an issue where some gates would not be fully destroyed after reducing their HP to 0.
Suryavarman I #5: Nirvanapada: Fixed an issue where the game statistics at the end of the mission could show negative values.
Tamar #1: Takeover: Armenia’s villagers next to mule carts will no longer walk away to hunt Ibexes if the player waits before meeting Zakare.
Tamar #3: The Protectorate: Yury will now become aggressive if the player chooses to attack the Turkomans first instead of liberating the city.
Thoros #1: Outlawed: Fixed an issue where players would receive more food in tribute than needed in order to research the infantry upgrades at the start of the mission.
Thoros #3: Caught in the Crossfire: The player is now allowed to research Fereters after advancing to the Imperial Age.
Thoros #4: Bloody Crestwaves: The player now needs to research Fereters on their own (except on Standard difficulty).
Thoros #5: Of Turncoats and Traitors:
The player is no longer attacked by the Byzantines right away after the fleeing to Mleh's camp.
Church Sanctuary achievement no longer requires keeping the villagers alive after they have changed ownership.

Co-op campaigns
Tamerlane #5: Scourge of the Levant: Changed civilizations of Cilician Armenia and Georgia to Armenians and Georgians, respectively.

Balance Changes
General
Monk conversion consistency:
Monk conversion chance 25% ▶ 40%, interval 4-10 ▶ 5-9.
Previously 40% of conversions would happen at either 4 seconds or 10 seconds, creating highly volatile and RNG dependent interactions. With these changes, 80% of conversions will happen between 5 and 7 seconds.
Below are some ancillary changes. Here, the average conversion time remains unchanged compared to before, but now with the more consistent conversion behavior.
Scout resistance set to +3 min conversion time, +1 max conversion time, +2 conversion resistance.
Ships resistance set to +2 min, +2 max.
Teutons resistance set to +3 min, +2 max.
First Crusade resistance set to +4 min, +4 max.
Developer Note: “The goal of the conversion change + supporting changes is to keep the average conversion time the same but reduce the variability, creating more consistency in how long it takes conversions to occur. Our aim is to reduce the frustrating elements of conversions while keeping the relative power level the same.”
New Technology available in the Castle Age for all civilizations at the Monastery: Devotion. Required for Faith.
Devotion (100 food 150 gold): unit conversion resistance set to +1 min, +1 max. (Units are 15% harder for enemy Monks to convert)
Faith cost decreased from 750 food 1000 gold ▶ 550 food 750 gold.
Faith conversion resistance set to +4 min, +4 max. (Units are 50% harder for enemy Monks to convert).
The combination of Devotion + Faith is equivalent to the previous version of Faith.
Dromon projectile attack rebalanced to deal equal damage with all individual projectiles instead of full damage on a main projectile with mostly cosmetic secondary projectiles.
Damage reduced from 50 ▶ 10.
Bonus damage vs. Buildings reduced 135 ▶ 35.
Bonus damage vs. Siege reduced 20 ▶ 4.
Bonus damage vs. Castles 0 ▶ 12.
Increased projectile spread area.
Cavalier upgrade time reduced from 100 seconds ▶ 80 seconds.
Mule Carts are now targeted with lower priority than units (same as other buildings).

Armenians
Galley-line fires two projectiles Civilization Bonus changed ▶ Galley-line and Dromons fire an additional projectile.
Galley-line secondary projectile changed to always be an arrow for better readability of the bonus.
Warrior Priest with Relic no longer incorrectly receives extra line of sight from Block Printing technology.

Bengalis
(Elite) Ratha Cavalry Archer armor increased from 0 ▶ 1.
(Elite) Ratha now deals 20% trample damage in melee mode.

Bohemians
Hussite Wagon HP reduced from 180 ▶ 160.
Hussite Wagon main projectile damage reduced from 11 ▶ 10.
(Elite) Hussite Wagon train time increased from 21 seconds ▶ 26 seconds.

Chinese
Town Center Civilization Bonus increased from +10 population space and +5 LOS ▶ +15 population space and +7 LOS.

Georgians
Buildings cost 50% fewer resources to repair Team Bonus reduced ▶ Buildings cost 25% fewer resources to repair.
(Elite) Monaspa no longer incorrectly receives extra damage against buildings, archers, skirmishers, camels and Shotel Warriors when grouped.

Hindustanis
Villager discount Civilization Bonus increased from -5%/-10%/-15%/-20% ▶ -8%/-13%/-18%/-23%.

Huns
(Elite) Tarkan base movement speed increased from 1.35 ▶ 1.4.
Huns now start with a unique scouting horse on nomad style maps once their starting Town Center is completed.

Koreans
(Elite) Turtle Ship receives attack ground ability.

Persians
Savar bonus damage vs. Archers reduced from 3 ▶ 2.
Savar upgrade research time increased from 150 seconds ▶ 160 seconds.

Poles
Folwark cost decreased from 125 wood ▶ 100 wood.

Portuguese
(Elite) Organ Gun damage decreased from 7 (9) ▶ 6 (8).
(Elite) Organ Gun bonus damage vs Infantry and Skirmishers increased from 1 ▶ 2.

Vikings
Defeating Warrior Priests with infantry units now correctly generates a gold reward when Chieftains is researched.

Return of Rome
General
Scout cost reduced from 100 food ▶ 90 food.
Mysticism technology effect changed from double priest hitpoints ▶ priests +20 HP (effect reduced by 5 HP)
City Watch research time reduced from 45 seconds ▶ 15 seconds.
Stone Thrower, Catapult, and Heavy Catapult Melee Armor reduced from 0 ▶ -2.
Tower build time decreased from 72 seconds ▶ 65 seconds.

Carthaginians
Team bonus changed from Fire Galleys +1 Pierce Armor ▶ Academies work 20% faster.

Egyptians
Priests range bonus decreased from +3 ▶ +2/3 in Bronze/Iron Ages.

Lac Viet
Forager gather bonus decreased from 20% ▶ 15% faster Foragers.

Macedonians
House HP team bonus increased from +25 HP ▶ +50 HP.

Minoans
Ships cost bonus adjusted from -30% ▶ -15/20/25/30% in Stone/Tool/Bronze/Iron Age.

Yamato
Ship HP bonus changed from +20% HP ▶ +10/15/20/25% HP per Age.

AI
General
Fixed an issue where AI explorers may not find an unexplored tile for enemy object/home and will fall idle, we now fallback to unit AI scouting.

Scenario Editor
"Change Object Civilization Name", "Change Object Player Color" and "Change Object Player Name" trigger effects now reset on the object ownership change, so the new ownership is correctly presented.

LOCALIZATION
Return of Rome: Added localized VO for the Legacy Age of Empires campaigns.
 

Sensuki

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Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
I really like these balance changes although I think there are a few civs being slept on - Bulgarians could maybe use something, Burmese (change the relic bonus to a civ bonus and give them a new TB?), Italians and Vikings on land maybe. Celts and Sicilians midgame ?

I'm kind of sort of surprised the Inca food discount on military units hasn't been nerfed yet, but I think it will be at some point in the future.

The Huns and Chinese changes are incredible for Nomad starts. Chinese suddenly become A+ tier if not S tier on Nomad again and Huns get a significant boost with the Horse scout - also a bonus that will scale really well with player skill, and be super handy in team games.
 

Endemic

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I really like these balance changes although I think there are a few civs being slept on - Bulgarians could maybe use something, Burmese (change the relic bonus to a civ bonus and give them a new TB?), Italians and Vikings on land maybe. Celts and Sicilians midgame ?

I'm kind of sort of surprised the Inca food discount on military units hasn't been nerfed yet, but I think it will be at some point in the future.

The Huns and Chinese changes are incredible for Nomad starts. Chinese suddenly become A+ tier if not S tier on Nomad again and Huns get a significant boost with the Horse scout - also a bonus that will scale really well with player skill, and be super handy in team games.

Chinese didn't get their 6 villagers, Huns can't build a TC + dock with their starting wood.

Devotion seems like it will buff cavalry/elephant civs a fair bit (Faith rarely gets researched, so I can see why it was split into two techs).
 

Sensuki

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New North Korea
Codex 2014 Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
I really like these balance changes although I think there are a few civs being slept on - Bulgarians could maybe use something, Burmese (change the relic bonus to a civ bonus and give them a new TB?), Italians and Vikings on land maybe. Celts and Sicilians midgame ?

I'm kind of sort of surprised the Inca food discount on military units hasn't been nerfed yet, but I think it will be at some point in the future.

The Huns and Chinese changes are incredible for Nomad starts. Chinese suddenly become A+ tier if not S tier on Nomad again and Huns get a significant boost with the Horse scout - also a bonus that will scale really well with player skill, and be super handy in team games.

Chinese didn't get their 6 villagers, Huns can't build a TC + dock with their starting wood.

Before I posted this thread comment I had downloaded the PUP and tested both. First try, Chinese on Nomad - no idle TC, FC time 15:55. I can already consistently between 16m and 17xx mins with Huns in a straight FC, the free horse will let you scoop up sheep, find your close boars super easy and also find all the enemy TC and dock locations which is massive.

Just before the PUP I made this video (just against AI):
 

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