Anime Are there any Actually Good D&D books?

[ERYFKRAD]

I liked Raistlin when I was an edgy teen

Guess that means you're not a teen anymore.

 

[Fedora Master]

I liked Raistlin when I was an edgy teen

Guess that means you're not a teen anymore.

No, I'm an edgy manchild, duh

 

[Erebus]

Just read the "Empires" trilogy, set in the Forgotten Realms and written by three different authors. It's quite unusual as far as D&D fiction is concerned, because it doesn't involve adventurers, monsters, powerful artefacts or anything like that. It's about a large-scale war started by the Tuigans (the pseudo-Mongols of the FR) and mainly features the points of view of kings, generals and advisors.

Recreating the Mongol invasions in the Forgotten Realms doesn't work very well, to put it mildly. In the first two books, the authors stick very close to their historical inspiration ; that might be okay (if unimaginative) in a different setting, but it seems absurd in the Forgotten Realms, a world full of monsters, non-humans, spellcasters and magical items. On the plus side, those books have a fairly realistic tone, far from the black-and-white morality so common in D&D... but the third novel will take that realistic tone and sacrifice it on an altar made of green wood.

The second novel is the only one that's worth anything (it's written by Troy Denning, one of the better D&D authors) : the plot is reasonably interesting and it's actually possible to care about the main characters.

In the first book, the entire first half is devoted to showing that the Tuigans are reaally like Mongols and that their leader is reaally kind of like Genghis ; stuff actually happens in the second half, but the author fails to make it exciting.

In the third book, the author is less interested in telling a gritty war story than in showing the moral quandaries of the nice LG king who's horrified at the thought of not behaving like a paladin all the fucking time. And the Tuigans lose because they suddenly forget how to use strategy.

 

[Gahbreeil]

Elminster in Myth Drannor is a fantastic novel. I recommend it and Temptations of Elminster, the next book in the series. I recommend both because these books are about a wizard.

I still have Making of a Mage to read but academic research takes up too much of my time. And yes, seriously, Elminster is better than Drizzt.

 

[Cael]

Just read the "Empires" trilogy, set in the Forgotten Realms and written by three different authors. It's quite unusual as far as D&D fiction is concerned, because it doesn't involve adventurers, monsters, powerful artefacts or anything like that. It's about a large-scale war started by the Tuigans (the pseudo-Mongols of the FR) and mainly features the points of view of kings, generals and advisors.

Recreating the Mongol invasions in the Forgotten Realms doesn't work very well, to put it mildly. In the first two books, the authors stick very close to their historical inspiration ; that might be okay (if unimaginative) in a different setting, but it seems absurd in the Forgotten Realms, a world full of monsters, non-humans, spellcasters and magical items. On the plus side, those books have a fairly realistic tone, far from the black-and-white morality so common in D&D... but the third novel will take that realistic tone and sacrifice it on an altar made of green wood.

The second novel is the only one that's worth anything (it's written by Troy Denning, one of the better D&D authors) : the plot is reasonably interesting and it's actually possible to care about the main characters.

In the first book, the entire first half is devoted to showing that the Tuigans are reaally like Mongols and that their leader is reaally kind of like Genghis ; stuff actually happens in the second half, but the author fails to make it exciting.

In the third book, the author is less interested in telling a gritty war story than in showing the moral quandaries of the nice LG king who's horrified at the thought of not behaving like a paladin all the fucking time. And the Tuigans lose because they suddenly forget how to use strategy.

I found the second novel to be pure dogshit. The retardism of the pseudo-Chinese is hilarious, and the "everyone dies" part of it is absurd. The Emperor of the place is supposed to be a LG type, but he doesn't make a sound when his only female minister outright murders the family of his best general? WTF?

 

[Erebus]

I found the second novel to be pure dogshit. The retardism of the pseudo-Chinese is hilarious, and the "everyone dies" part of it is absurd. The Emperor of the place is supposed to be a LG type, but he doesn't make a sound when his only female minister outright murders the family of his best general? WTF?

I won't say that the pseudo-Chinese setting is especially good, but I rather liked the deadliness of court intrigues. The emperor is shown to be a fairly good judge of character, but when events make his general's behavior appear suspicious for a long while, he ends up listening to the lies whispered in his ears.

He's certainly a more believable ruler than fucking Azoun, who only cares about doing what's right and agonizes for pages after endorsing the slightest lie.

 

[Cael]

I found the second novel to be pure dogshit. The retardism of the pseudo-Chinese is hilarious, and the "everyone dies" part of it is absurd. The Emperor of the place is supposed to be a LG type, but he doesn't make a sound when his only female minister outright murders the family of his best general? WTF?

I won't say that the pseudo-Chinese setting is especially good, but I rather liked the deadliness of court intrigues. The emperor is shown to be a fairly good judge of character, but when events make his general's behavior appear suspicious for a long while, he ends up listening to the lies whispered in his ears.

He's certainly a more believable ruler than fucking Azoun, who only cares about doing what's right and agonizes for pages after endorsing the slightest lie.

No. He was an idiot. The plan called for Batu to be incommunicado. It was intended to surprise the enemy. So when Batu went incommunicado, he gets... suspicious??? That is not the general being suspicious. It is the emperor being retarded.

And there is no justification of him believing the woman about the massacre of the kids. That is pure BS. The Emperor decides who is a traitor and who dies, not some glorified clerk. He should have been pissed that it happened without someone consulting him, at the very least.

 

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I remember the original Dragonlance trilogy and the Twins trilogy being fun reads. They're not super deep like LotR or Narnia, but the characters were different from each other and had conflict with each other. There was character drama to get invested in. The rest of the franchise wasn't entertaining. In the War of Souls, All of the characters you liked are gone, their kingdoms destroyed or occupied, and you're left with new characters who aren't anywhere near as likeable as the old cast. I had some of the other books like the one about "Raistlin's Daughter" or the one about the first dragon rider, but never got far into those books and eventually tossed them out.

 

[SerratedBiz]

I've always felt like I'm the only one who thinks so but I liked the Dragonlance Heroes books (especially The Legend of Huma, Weasel's Luck and Galen Beknighted).

 

[RPK]

I remember the original Dragonlance trilogy and the Twins trilogy being fun reads. They're not super deep like LotR or Narnia, but the characters were different from each other and had conflict with each other. There was character drama to get invested in. The rest of the franchise wasn't entertaining. In the War of Souls, All of the characters you liked are gone, their kingdoms destroyed or occupied, and you're left with new characters who aren't anywhere near as likeable as the old cast. I had some of the other books like the one about "Raistlin's Daughter" or the one about the first dragon rider, but never got far into those books and eventually tossed them out.

I tend to agree. I read one of the war of souls books and wasn't overly impressed. Of all the newer DL books I read, I only really liked Dragons of Summer Flame and that one isn't really "newer" it just wasn't written when the first couple trilogies were, if I recall correctly. Never read anything that wasn't written by Weis and Hickman either.

 

[Erebus]

Finished the "Counselors and Kings" trilogy by Elaine Cunningham. It's okayish by the standards of D&D fiction, but it could have been better. The ending is unbelievably rushed, with half the cast (though mostly the villains) dying in a variety of disappointing ways during the last 15% of the third book.

In the War of Souls, All of the characters you liked are gone, their kingdoms destroyed or occupied, and you're left with new characters who aren't anywhere near as likeable as the old cast.

My main problem with the War of Souls is that it completely undoes the attempt to change the Dragonlance setting. The Fifth Age wasn't perfect, but it had some pretty good ideas. Having all the dragon lords die and the gods return is about as creative as having Palpatine be the main villain in the Star Wars sequel trilogy.

 

[NecroLord]

Elminster in Myth Drannor is a fantastic novel. I recommend it and Temptations of Elminster, the next book in the series. I recommend both because these books are about a wizard.

I still have Making of a Mage to read but academic research takes up too much of my time. And yes, seriously, Elminster is better than Drizzt.

Fuck Elminster and maybe Drizzt(he can be a decent character when not in full Mary Sue mode).

Anyway, so the Dragonlance novels are worth a read?

 

[RPK]

Elminster in Myth Drannor is a fantastic novel. I recommend it and Temptations of Elminster, the next book in the series. I recommend both because these books are about a wizard.

I still have Making of a Mage to read but academic research takes up too much of my time. And yes, seriously, Elminster is better than Drizzt.

Fuck Elminster and maybe Drizzt(he can be a decent character when not in full Mary Sue mode).

Anyway, so the Dragonlance novels are worth a read?

the old ones. as long as you go in just expecting some dumb fun.

 

[Melan]

Anyway, so the Dragonlance novels are worth a read?

No. They are bad even as YA fantasy, and this was something that was already clear to 12-years-old me (I read them nevertheless, but it was rather obvious).

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Anyway, so the Dragonlance novels are worth a read?

Nothing that should ever be placed on a "best of fantasy" list, but the original trilogy (Dragonlance Chronicles) is competently written by Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman; though note that this trilogy (as with the original Dragonlance series of adventures) was a transparent attempt to cash in on the Tolkien craze. The sequel trilogy (Dragonlance Legends) is worthwhile as a follow-up for people who enjoyed Chronicles. You might also consider the story anthologies (Dragonlance Tales series, and a few in other settings), where the quality was always mixed but did include a number of good stories. The best novels you'll find other than those initial Dragonlance ones would be something like Azure Bonds by Jeff Grubb or Pages of Pain by Chris Avellone Troy Denning. TSR pumped out an ever-increasing number of novels per year even as the quality declined, which was perhaps the primary cause of the financial crisis that arrived at the end of 1996, when Random House called in TSR's debts resulting from unsold items.

 

[Fedora Master]

Elminster in Myth Drannor is a fantastic novel. I recommend it and Temptations of Elminster, the next book in the series. I recommend both because these books are about a wizard.

I still have Making of a Mage to read but academic research takes up too much of my time. And yes, seriously, Elminster is better than Drizzt.

Who does he fuck in that one?

 

[Cael]

Elminster in Myth Drannor is a fantastic novel. I recommend it and Temptations of Elminster, the next book in the series. I recommend both because these books are about a wizard.

I still have Making of a Mage to read but academic research takes up too much of my time. And yes, seriously, Elminster is better than Drizzt.

Who does he fuck in that one?

Mystra

 

[NecroLord]

Elminster in Myth Drannor is a fantastic novel. I recommend it and Temptations of Elminster, the next book in the series. I recommend both because these books are about a wizard.

I still have Making of a Mage to read but academic research takes up too much of my time. And yes, seriously, Elminster is better than Drizzt.

Who does he fuck in that one?

Mystra

Right, I forgot about that.
This motherfucker bones a GODDESS!
Ed Greenwood strikes again.

Zed Duke of Banville You, sir, are a legitimate D&D scholar.
Thank you all. I might just give the Dragonlance novels a go.

 

[Lt Broccoli]

Recently finished purchasing the collection of nearly all D&D novels (excluding Endless Quest). Project started in March 2022. The methodology is to read each title sequentially by publishing date so as to experience the anticipatory feeling the fans would have as they wait for a series to be written. The gamut of titles begins with Quag Keep from February 1978, and the latest being Dragons of Deceit which was published in August 2022 - (first time a Dragonlance novel was published since 2010 which is quite interesting). The project I estimate will take 20 years to complete. I can only comment on those up to 1988 so far. Best reads so far are The Chronicles Trilogy, Legends Trilogy, The Icewind Dales Trilogy and The Finder's Stone Trilogy. Character development was done particularly well in The Finder's Stone Trilogy. That said, Gary Gygax's Gord the Rogue series is fascinating to read as Gygax has shall we say...a very unique style... of course him being the father of D&D.

 

[Theldaran]

About Death's Gate. It starts promisingly and has some highlights, like the Abarrach book -a master class on practical necromancy.

But the underlying setting is not well thought -alas, the world is our world resulted from a nucular war, plus some further shit. And the ending is just... Ugh. The problem with Weis and Hickman is that they usually have no clue about how to end their works. This is a case of it. The baddies are defeated but at a high cost, and the plot gets semi-resolved but not completely. It started great but went downhill from mid-series on.

Enviado desde mi CPH2271 mediante Tapatalk

 

[Cael]

Recently finished purchasing the collection of nearly all D&D novels (excluding Endless Quest). Project started in March 2022. The methodology is to read each title sequentially by publishing date so as to experience the anticipatory feeling the fans would have as they wait for a series to be written. The gamut of titles begins with Quag Keep from February 1978, and the latest being Dragons of Deceit which was published in August 2022 - (first time a Dragonlance novel was published since 2010 which is quite interesting). The project I estimate will take 20 years to complete. I can only comment on those up to 1988 so far. Best reads so far are The Chronicles Trilogy, Legends Trilogy, The Icewind Dales Trilogy and The Finder's Stone Trilogy. Character development was done particularly well in The Finder's Stone Trilogy. That said, Gary Gygax's Gord the Rogue series is fascinating to read as Gygax has shall we say...a very unique style... of course him being the father of D&D.

I have always had a soft spot for the Maztica trilogy, for some reason.

 

[Lt Broccoli]

Recently finished purchasing the collection of nearly all D&D novels (excluding Endless Quest). Project started in March 2022. The methodology is to read each title sequentially by publishing date so as to experience the anticipatory feeling the fans would have as they wait for a series to be written. The gamut of titles begins with Quag Keep from February 1978, and the latest being Dragons of Deceit which was published in August 2022 - (first time a Dragonlance novel was published since 2010 which is quite interesting). The project I estimate will take 20 years to complete. I can only comment on those up to 1988 so far. Best reads so far are The Chronicles Trilogy, Legends Trilogy, The Icewind Dales Trilogy and The Finder's Stone Trilogy. Character development was done particularly well in The Finder's Stone Trilogy. That said, Gary Gygax's Gord the Rogue series is fascinating to read as Gygax has shall we say...a very unique style... of course him being the father of D&D.

I have always had a soft spot for the Maztica trilogy, for some reason.

The Maztica trilogy is coming up on my read list in the next six months or so as it was published in 1990, but I did read it before way back in the early 90s. I recall it having a unique setting with fascinating characters. First use of a couatl in a D&D novel I think.

 

[Cael]

Recently finished purchasing the collection of nearly all D&D novels (excluding Endless Quest). Project started in March 2022. The methodology is to read each title sequentially by publishing date so as to experience the anticipatory feeling the fans would have as they wait for a series to be written. The gamut of titles begins with Quag Keep from February 1978, and the latest being Dragons of Deceit which was published in August 2022 - (first time a Dragonlance novel was published since 2010 which is quite interesting). The project I estimate will take 20 years to complete. I can only comment on those up to 1988 so far. Best reads so far are The Chronicles Trilogy, Legends Trilogy, The Icewind Dales Trilogy and The Finder's Stone Trilogy. Character development was done particularly well in The Finder's Stone Trilogy. That said, Gary Gygax's Gord the Rogue series is fascinating to read as Gygax has shall we say...a very unique style... of course him being the father of D&D.

I have always had a soft spot for the Maztica trilogy, for some reason.

The Maztica trilogy is coming up on my read list in the next six months or so as it was published in 1990, but I did read it before way back in the early 90s. I recall it having a unique setting with fascinating characters. First use of a couatl in a D&D novel I think.

It is basically Hernan Cortez's conquest of the Aztecs in FR.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Recently finished purchasing the collection of nearly all D&D novels (excluding Endless Quest). Project started in March 2022. The methodology is to read each title sequentially by publishing date so as to experience the anticipatory feeling the fans would have as they wait for a series to be written.

If RPG Codex had an award for greatest masochist, you would win it.

 

[Lt Broccoli]

Recently finished purchasing the collection of nearly all D&D novels (excluding Endless Quest). Project started in March 2022. The methodology is to read each title sequentially by publishing date so as to experience the anticipatory feeling the fans would have as they wait for a series to be written.

If RPG Codex had an award for greatest masochist, you would win it.

Lol! Perhaps... By the time I reach Planescape's 'Pages of Pain' (at my current rate by year 2029) I may indeed know the true meaning of the Lady's gifts.