Game News Bethesda to develop and publish Fallout 3?

[Jed]

Nice "UR DUMB" line. Oh, and good job revealing the horrible bile filled bias that you probably all the people here share against Morrowind. I mean you always can fall back on the fact that BethSoft is the devil.

I like Morrowind, you flailing idiot. I played both fucking expansions. However, they will destroy Fallout. This is evident in the arrogance of Bethsoft in claiming to be big fans, but instead of contracting the development to Troika or Obsidian they're gonna butcher it with there good intentions. You've heard about what roads to hell are paved with, right? There's a good reason that proverb exists. By the way, I realize that you'll be gone within a few days so you won't be here to eat your words, but I hope you realize that you will be eating most of the shit you're spewing here. DaggerFallout will fail.

PAGE SEVENTEEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

 

[Worm]

and quit with your "all camera anglez R equal" shtick, because it's getting downright self-parodical. "You could do anything from any perspective" - well, it seems like you're the one who's cornered the market on "batshit insane." You might not care about having tactical combat in a FO game, but the fact remains that you simply can't code tactical, turn-based combat with APs, multiple targets and weapons, and a battlefield with obstructions and range limitations unless you at least have some sort of roving camera.

I'm not entirely obsessed with an isometric view, having cut my teeth for years on the free camera in Bungie's two Myth games, but dammit, you need to be able to at least see the fucking battlefield before you can, you know, fight on it.

But go ahead, prove me wrong: either point to successful first-person examples of such combat, or outline how you see such a system working from a first-person perspective. That's a challenge you've so far ignored.

Well, it would just be like Fallout. It could be a grid based system where you click on a grid from your characters first person view and he would move to it or you could simply choose a path with the movement keys you use to move out of battle and your action points would be depleted on how much you walked. You'd physically aim your gun to the body part you wanted to hit (unless you had that one quick shot perk) it would highlight it and show the precentage chance. I admit you wouldn't be able to hit obstructed parts, but isn't that kind of the point? Then the turn would end and the enemies would move during this time you'd be free to turn and look at them as they moved, though if you happened to not notice and enemy he'd attack you without you knowing about it. Your camera would immediately snap to where your character was shot from so you know where the enemies are.

 

[Worm]

However, they will destroy Fallout. This is evident in the arrogance of Bethsoft in claiming to be big fans, but instead of contracting the development to Troika or Obsidian they're gonna butcher it with there good intentions. You've heard about what roads to hell are paved with, right? There's a good reason that proverb exists. By the way, I realize that you'll be gone within a few days so you won't be here to eat your words, but I hope you realize that you will be eating most of the shit you're spewing here. DaggerFallout will fail.

See this is the problem. I don't know it will succeed I don't have a scrying glass. I just believe it's going to succeed.

Big fans have all accepted that BethSoft immediately doesn't know what they are doing well only previously having seen their work with TES games and Fallout 3 would be better off with Troika or Obsidian . Even if BethSoft thinks they can do a better job they are wrong.
I mean is that the basic idea here? Am I wrong before the fact? Let's not be stupid here.

 

[Greenskin13]

Again, my awful optimism is that the foundations of Fallout will remain. Yeah, and the other two games played nothing like Fallout, that was the point right? I didn't play BOS but I thought Fallout Tactics was kind of fun.

I'm pessimistic because I don't want developers to screw up games I like. I'm not going to hold their hands and kiss their butts if I think what they're doing will screw up Fallout. And from what I'm reading from Pete Hines' interviews, I'm concerned that BethSoft is making some very poor decisions.

Lets look at his most recent interview:

Finger: The diehard Fallout fans are demanding that Fallout 3 take place from a top-down view and that its combat will be turn-based. I've read many comments that say it's not Fallout without these elements. What can you say to those fans right now to ease their minds?

Pete Hines: Until we show the game itself, nothing we say will ease their minds.

Just as Mr. Teatime analized, I can't see this as any more than Pete Hines telling the fans that they're not going to get what they want(TB, Iso) but instead their banking on the hope that we'll somehow accept their FP RT Fallout game once we see it. Really, I've got no reason to feel optimistic when Petey just said I won't be getting a proper FO sequel.

So, they aren't good at isometic, I don't see what this has to do with turn based play which is a pretty simply concept.
"what else about Fallout's elements are they going to sacrifice because it's not what they do well?"
NONE! I say that's because I'm optimistic. You think they are going to drop all of Fallouts identfying traits. I don't think the camera angle is a big point.

You're giving them the benefit of the doubt, saying that they can make an FP TB. Okay, I already see FP as a letdown, but what worries me more is that it seems Petey is telling us that BethSoft isn't willing to implement core elements from the original FO because it's not what they do. And now that Hines is telling me that he can't ease my mind, I'm not inclined to give this guy any slack.

 

[Worm]

Finger: The diehard Fallout fans are demanding that Fallout 3 take place from a top-down view and that its combat will be turn-based. I've read many comments that say it's not Fallout without these elements. What can you say to those fans right now to ease their minds?

Pete Hines: Until we show the game itself, nothing we say will ease their minds.

Just as Mr. Teatime analized, I can't see this as any more than Pete Hines telling the fans that they're not going to get what they want(TB, Iso) but instead their banking on the hope that we'll somehow accept their FP RT Fallout game once we see it. Really, I've got no reason to feel optimistic when Petey just said I won't be getting a proper FO sequel.

Nothing he could say WOULD ease your mind. You bastards are so tight strung about this game a blow job(cunnilignus for the ladies ^_^) wouldn't ease your minds!

So, they aren't good at isometic, I don't see what this has to do with turn based play which is a pretty simply concept.
"what else about Fallout's elements are they going to sacrifice because it's not what they do well?"
NONE! I say that's because I'm optimistic. You think they are going to drop all of Fallouts identfying traits. I don't think the camera angle is a big point.

You're giving them the benefit of the doubt, saying that they can make an FP TB. Okay, I already see FP as a letdown, but what worries me more is that it seems Petey is telling us that BethSoft isn't willing to implement core elements from the original FO because it's not what they do. And now that Hines is telling me that he can't ease my mind, I'm not inclined to give this guy any slack.

That's fine. Ultimately, I might be happy with FallMORROWINDout (OMG SO CLEVAR!). So I win every damn way. Unless they make it an eighteen wheeler game.

 

[Sheriff05]

Wow, if you ever had a real argument, it's obviously flying apart at the seams with this desperate keyboard diarrhea. Take a break, Worm. Go back to your cuddly Morrowind fan forums and talk about the new cool nude mods for the dancing ladies. Leave the critical thinking to those of us in the "Fallout Taliban."

Since "The Worm" doesn't seem to want to give up and 20 pages here is inevitable-
I just have to add that this barb is a nice shot of hilarious genius,
encore Jed!!

 

[Greenskin13]

Nothing he could say WOULD ease your mind. You bastards are so tight strung about this game a blow job(cunnilignus for the ladies ^_^) wouldn't ease your minds!

Oh, I don't know. Telling us he's making an isometric TB Fallout that uses SPECIAL would ease me.

Listen to Jed and take a break. These sorts of arguements don't sell your points.

That's fine. Ultimately, I might be happy with FallMORROWINDout (OMG SO CLEVAR!). So I win every damn way. Unless they make it an eighteen wheeler game.

Thanks for contributing to the discussion.

 

[Worm]

Wow, if you ever had a real argument, it's obviously flying apart at the seams with this desperate keyboard diarrhea. Take a break, Worm. Go back to your cuddly Morrowind fan forums and talk about the new cool nude mods for the dancing ladies. Leave the critical thinking to those of us in the "Fallout Taliban."

Since "The Worm" doesn't seem to want to give up and 20 pages here is inevitable-
I just have to add that this barb is a nice shot of hilarious genius,
encore Jed!!

Oh yeah. It's great. My arguments are totally unsubstantial but no reason why. ROFL "keyboard diarrhea" and the ever popular GBTF(GO BACK TO FARK) variation. He should sell this shit.

 

[Worm]

Nothing he could say WOULD ease your mind. You bastards are so tight strung about this game a blow job(cunnilignus for the ladies ^_^) wouldn't ease your minds!

Oh, I don't know. Telling us he's making an isometric TB Fallout that uses SPECIAL would ease me.

Listen to Jed and take a break. These sorts of arguements don't sell your points.

That's fine. Ultimately, I might be happy with FallMORROWINDout (OMG SO CLEVAR!). So I win every damn way. Unless they make it an eighteen wheeler game.

Thanks for contributing to the discussion.

Well, you basically gave me a "let's agree to disagree" post here. I mean you simply don't trust Bethseda, I do. That's the fundamental difference it's not that any of you know how the game is going to end up, it's not that any of you have industry insght, it's simply that the guys you wanted to do it aren't doing it, and on top of that the guys you don't want doing it may not be doing it the way you wanted. What more is there to argue about?

 

[Greenskin13]

I don't trust BethSoft because they've given me no reason to trust them. Pete Hines tells me he's got nothing to say that will ease me, and that BethSoft isn't going to do anything they don't do well, including isometric views. Your arguements seem to be that I'm just a whiny bitch and that anything can happen. I take statements made by BethSoft employees. Maybe I'm scrutinizing Pete Hines here, but I don't want BethSoft, or anyone with the Fallout license for that matter, to screw up.

 

[HanoverF]

Well, you basically gave me a "let's agree to disagree" post here. I mean you simply don't trust Bethseda, I do.

Its not that we simply dont trust em, its that we are using past instances, quotes from PR guys and developers, and rational thought to discern that while the game may or may not be good, it sure as hell looks like it isn't going to be Fallout, and thats bad. Whereas you put on earmuffs and a welders helmet and are dancing around clapping like a mental patient cause you believe in fairies, santa claus, the easter bunny, and Bethesda.

 

[Sheriff05]

it's not that any of you have industry insight

How the fuck do you arrive at that stupid conclusion?
Even Volourn, has as much if not more "industry insight" than your average smuck
at "brand X" software. Just because you can code doesn't mean you have a fucking clue.
It's over Worm, time to hit the road.

 

[Worm]

Well, you basically gave me a "let's agree to disagree" post here. I mean you simply don't trust Bethseda, I do.

Its not that we simply dont trust em, its that we are using past instances, quotes from PR guys and developers, and rational thought to discern that while the game may or may not be good, it sure as hell looks like it isn't going to be Fallout, and thats bad. Whereas you put on earmuffs and a welders helmet and are dancing around clapping like a mental patient cause you believe in fairies, santa claus, the easter bunny, and Bethesda.

All of which occured within a few days of them announcing they are going to develop the game. I mean if the guys who are making it can't even have a solid impression of the game where'd you guys get it? Also, I like where I'm in total denial for disagreeing.

it's not that any of you have industry insight

How the fuck do you arrive at that stupid conclusion?
Even Volourn, has as much if not more "industry insight" than your average smuck
at "brand X" software. Just because you can code doesn't mean you have a fucking clue.
It's over Worm, time to hit the road.

Okay one of you has more industry insight than an average smuck who is working at a software place. Though no one who is still wasting time on me has any.

I don't trust BethSoft because they've given me no reason to trust them. Pete Hines tells me he's got nothing to say that will ease me, and that BethSoft isn't going to do anything they don't do well, including isometric views. Your arguements seem to be that I'm just a whiny bitch and that anything can happen. I take statements made by BethSoft employees. Maybe I'm scrutinizing Pete Hines here, but I don't want BethSoft, or anyone with the Fallout license for that matter, to screw up.

I'll finish part for you
"I take statements made by BethSoft employees" "as scripture."-Worm

 

[Greenskin13]

Oh, switching tactics?

Well, forgive me for trying to use some quotes to emphises my points rather than spewing wishful thinking without any basis. Maybe I should be like you in the reverse and just say "Morrowout will be poopie!". Just so that you and I can be on the same thinking level.

 

[Worm]

Oh, switching tactics?

Well, forgive me for trying to use some quotes to emphises my points rather than spewing wishful thinking without any basis. Maybe I should be like you in the reverse and just say "Morrowout will be poopie!". Just so that you and I can be on the same thinking level.

God, what do the quotes even mean a few days after they accept they will be doing development. I realize you guys have all been dreaming about FO3 ever since FO2 but just maybe some people don't have a perfect FO3 blue print in their heads. I'm not screaming Fallout 3 will be great, but I'm not screaming it will be awful and I believe you people are pretty unjustly saying FO3 will suck because a good amount of you didn't dig Morrowind much. Development hasn't even taken place, therefore the interviews just may not reflect a completely developed game.

 

[Greenskin13]

BethSoft didn't just decide one day to get up and buy the FO license. It's had since Decemeber to get at least some of their shit together. If they came out here and still don't have the slightest clue of what they're going to do, well then they clearly aren't taking the license seriously. If what Pete is saying doesn't reflect what the devs are/will be doing to FO, then he's got to come out here and tell us that he screwed up and that he didn't mean that FO3 will not be isometric and that he can say something to put us at ease. But so far, I just see more confirmation for my pessimism.

 

[Worm]

BethSoft didn't just decide one day to get up and buy the FO license.

Oh, well since this is the first I heard of it I figured they had.

It's had since Decemeber to get at least some of their shit together. If they came out here and still don't have the slightest clue of what they're going to do, well then they clearly aren't taking the license seriously. If what Pete is saying doesn't reflect what the devs are/will be doing to FO, then he's got to come out here and tell us that he screwed up and that he didn't mean that FO3 will not be isometric and that he can say something to put us at ease. But so far, I just see more confirmation for my pessimism.

Oh, okay, I guess. I didn't know they had been planning to outbid everyone since December.

 

[Jed]

All that has to be said to "ease minds" is:
We at Bethsoft will do our goddamnest to deliver Fallout 3 as a worthy successor to the original games. We will keep the core components intact--the great PnP feel, the pulpish 'future of the '50s,' turn-based combat, isometric view, moral ambiguity, freedom of choice, freedom of character development, true non-linerity, and consequence. We try to stick as close to canon as possible, and as fans ourselves, will be constantly returning to the old games to remain inspired and to see how things can be improved.

 

[Greenskin13]

Damn you, Jed. For a second there, I thought that was real.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

You bastards are so tight strung about this game a blow job(cunnilignus for the ladies ^_^) wouldn't ease your minds!

Line up, boys! Worm's offering!

 

[Shevek]

All that has to be said to "ease minds" is:
We at Bethsoft will do our goddamnest to deliver Fallout 3 as a worthy successor to the original games. We will keep the core components intact--the great PnP feel, the pulpish 'future of the '50s,' turn-based combat, isometric view, moral ambiguity, freedom of choice, freedom of character development, true non-linerity, and consequence. We try to stick as close to canon as possible, and as fans ourselves, will be constantly returning to the old games to remain inspired and to see how things can be improved.

Exactly. Though it may have been met with some skepticism, this kind of statement would have garnered a far more positive response from this community.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

BethSoft didn't just decide one day to get up and buy the FO license.

Oh, well since this is the first I heard of it I figured they had.

It's had since Decemeber to get at least some of their shit together. If they came out here and still don't have the slightest clue of what they're going to do, well then they clearly aren't taking the license seriously. If what Pete is saying doesn't reflect what the devs are/will be doing to FO, then he's got to come out here and tell us that he screwed up and that he didn't mean that FO3 will not be isometric and that he can say something to put us at ease. But so far, I just see more confirmation for my pessimism.

Oh, okay, I guess. I didn't know they had been planning to outbid everyone since December.

Actually, they've been planning for longer than that.

IGNPC: Can you tell us how long Bethesda has had its eye on Fallout?

Pete Hines: A pretty long time. For the majority of five years we've said, internally, that if we could pick another game to develop internally, it's been that we could do a great Fallout game. It's something we've talked about internally for a very long time.

 

[Worm]

All that has to be said to "ease minds" is:
We at Bethsoft will do our goddamnest to deliver Fallout 3 as a worthy successor to the original games. We will keep the core components intact--the great PnP feel, the pulpish 'future of the '50s,' turn-based combat, isometric view, moral ambiguity, freedom of choice, freedom of character development, true non-linerity, and consequence. We try to stick as close to canon as possible, and as fans ourselves, will be constantly returning to the old games to remain inspired and to see how things can be improved.

Exactly. Though it may have been met with some skepticism, this kind of statement would have garnered a far more positive response from this community.

Maybe they aren't catering to this community, wow. Still I guess I'd like to hear that it's turn based.

IGNPC: Can you tell us how long Bethesda has had its eye on Fallout?

Pete Hines: A pretty long time. For the majority of five years we've said, internally, that if we could pick another game to develop internally, it's been that we could do a great Fallout game. It's something we've talked about internally for a very long time.

That's nice. I don't see how that means they've been developing their idea for the game. I mean each individual person may have an idea of what kind of game they want they still need to meet and discuss it. Though I wouldn't chock up five years of thinking it would be a good game for them to develop to any real time of professional game developement.

 

[Elwro]

Ya know folks, this news just startles me. I don't have the time to read all about it now, but I just want to say that I'm gonna give Bethsoft the benefit of doubt here (I still think they will can this game in order to finish TESIV: the Oblivion in 3 years). They have plenty of time to learn more about the games. I had fun with Daggerfall, I had fun (albeit somewhat less) with Morrowind. I hope that, if they ever release it at all, they will provide a handy-dandy editor for FO3. If they use the NetImmerse (or how was it called)engine, that would seem likely to happen. I know we all love the isometric&tb Fallouts, but I just view this one as a SF RPG which may be quite good - something I've been missing for some time now.

Unfortunately we've seen one horrible attempt on a real-time SPECIAL game. If FO3 is a FPS, something even more horrible might happen. But I'll wait.

 

[Reklar]

All that has to be said to "ease minds" is:
We at Bethsoft will do our goddamnest to deliver Fallout 3 as a worthy successor to the original games. We will keep the core components intact--the great PnP feel, the pulpish 'future of the '50s,' turn-based combat, isometric view, moral ambiguity, freedom of choice, freedom of character development, true non-linerity, and consequence. We try to stick as close to canon as possible, and as fans ourselves, will be constantly returning to the old games to remain inspired and to see how things can be improved.

Exactly. Though it may have been met with some skepticism, this kind of statement would have garnered a far more positive response from this community.

Maybe they aren't catering to this community, wow. Still I guess I'd like to hear that it's turn based.

IGNPC: Can you tell us how long Bethesda has had its eye on Fallout?

Pete Hines: A pretty long time. For the majority of five years we've said, internally, that if we could pick another game to develop internally, it's been that we could do a great Fallout game. It's something we've talked about internally for a very long time.

That's nice. I don't see how that means they've been developing their idea for the game. I mean each individual person may have an idea of what kind of game they want they still need to meet and discuss it. Though I wouldn't chock up five years of thinking it would be a good game for them to develop to any real time of professional game developement.

Why are you even here Worm? You joined three days ago and already you have over 60 posts, all of which criticize and insult the members of this community. You preach tolerance and patience for Bethesda, but practice exactly the opposite by coming to RPG Codex and stirring the fire. Your point of view, or argument, whatever you wish to call it, would be best served by replying with calm, rational and logical, based on fact, posts, not joining the flamewar in progress. To date the only reasonably noninflamitory thing you have said is 'Give Bethesda a chance', which unfortunately is drowned out by the negative spam that constitutes the rest of your posts. If you want a postive reaction try being proactive and do so yourself, not because you are obligated to or owe it to anyone, but because it's more productive.

That being said, I don't have a great deal of optimism for Bethesda's chances of making even a spiritual successor to Fallout because of their history of making first/third-person games with real-time combat, a vastly different character creation schema, and an EverQuest-style skill advancement system, none of which bear any resemblance to the elements that comprise Fallout's design. Do I think it is possible for Bethesda to make a game faithful to Fallout's design if they really are serious about it? Yes, I believe it is possible, but as I said I don't have an optimistic view on this happening simply because very few development studios or publishers in recent years have proven they have the capital or desire to spend the time required to make such a change of direction. They want to turn a profit for the least amount of investment in time and money, which is generally good business sense with the caveat that the product is high quality and well received, which as current trends have shown leads to stagnation in design because they see a formula that sells and stick to it. Whether Bethesda is open to changing the formula that has sold well for them or not is open to debate, but I would surmise that their economic position is not such that they can afford to spend the requisite time needed to learn a new style of design, even if they have the desire. This is not necessarily something I hold against them mind you, but it does lessen my opinion that the outcome of their labors will be what I want to see titled as Fallout 3, which in the final analysis is all I truly care about.

-Reklar
(a Fallout/RPG fan)