Bow vs Crossbow

[Walks with the Snails]

Well, D&D has them, doesn't get much more mainstream than that. You should be able to make one with high crafting skill.

 

[Rabby]

Here's my two cents.

If bow skill is manifested by talent and training achieving some sort of heroic ability, then perhaps additional stat enhancements and skills that belong to the player would make sense. On the other hand, a crossbow, requiring less training, would depend more on the quality of the item itself. In addition to just more accurate, faster firing, and higher damage, perhaps some unique skills and different attack styles can be learned in bow training that's inaccessible to the less rigorous art of crossbow-shooting. I like attack techniques that aren't just strict +X to hit, +X to damage, but rather can be applied in different situations.

Some examples I'm thinking of off the top of my head are:

1. A 'trance' or a 'groove' in shooting. Where you lower the AP required to shoot each arrow, but that bonus is lost whenever you move or perform an action that isn't shooting the bow. In other words, continuous shooting allows you to fire at a higher rate since you've gotten into the groove/trance.

2. Called shots on the amount of damage you deal. Since a bow offers more flexibility in the tension of the string, you don't need to pull it perfectly taut every time. Instead of dealing, say, 6-12 damage per arrow, you can choose to deal 3-6 for example. It'd be neat if certain quests or encounters prompted events when the enemy's HP is low so an ability like this would actually be useful.

3. Firing multiple arrows simultaneously, at multiple targets. I think this would be self-explanatory.

4. Firing over cover. Instead of aiming directly at your target, you can fire upwards and gauge the descent of the arrow to land on top of your victim. Otherwise impossible shots can be made with this technique.

Personally, I've always enjoyed outside-the-box programming. Besides, mastery of a weapon, in my opinion, is more than being able to deadly. It's also a control and confidence that you possess.

In this respect, the difference between bows and crossbows can be made without just tweaking the statistics involved in the attacks. Whereas a crossbow requires less training and can still be effective, bows offer you much more flexibility in your approaches.

Rabby

 

[Vault Dweller]

Hey Rabby,
It's been awhile since I saw you here.

In addition to just more accurate, faster firing, and higher damage, perhaps some unique skills and different attack styles can be learned in bow training that's inaccessible to the less rigorous art of crossbow-shooting.

Great idea.

1. A 'trance' or a 'groove' in shooting. Where you lower the AP required to shoot each arrow, but that bonus is lost whenever you move or perform an action that isn't shooting the bow. In other words, continuous shooting allows you to fire at a higher rate since you've gotten into the groove/trance.

Hmm, don't think it would work. In PnP maybe, but not in CRPG where an archer would be shooting non-stop anyway.

2. Called shots on the amount of damage you deal. Since a bow offers more flexibility in the tension of the string, you don't need to pull it perfectly taut every time. Instead of dealing, say, 6-12 damage per arrow, you can choose to deal 3-6 for example. It'd be neat if certain quests or encounters prompted events when the enemy's HP is low so an ability like this would actually be useful.

Why would anyone choose to do less damage? I don't have any low HP enemies like rats or ants, but I'm curious about what you had in mind.

3. Firing multiple arrows simultaneously, at multiple targets. I think this would be self-explanatory.

That I'm considering currently. It's a good advantage, and it does remind me of Burst.

4. Firing over cover. Instead of aiming directly at your target, you can fire upwards and gauge the descent of the arrow to land on top of your victim. Otherwise impossible shots can be made with this technique.

I like that as well. Basically, it would make any cover less effective. Thanks for your thoughts.

 

[Rabby]

1. A 'trance' or a 'groove' in shooting. Where you lower the AP required to shoot each arrow, but that bonus is lost whenever you move or perform an action that isn't shooting the bow. In other words, continuous shooting allows you to fire at a higher rate since you've gotten into the groove/trance.

Hmm, don't think it would work. In PnP maybe, but not in CRPG where an archer would be shooting non-stop anyway.

Would it be more feasible if the state is easily broken? Perhaps it takes two rounds to initiate, and after the groove is established, being under attack from the enemy or taking any actions (moving, accessing one's inventory, etc) would cancel it. This would give the enemies an incentive to distract the archer as well.

2. Called shots on the amount of damage you deal. Since a bow offers more flexibility in the tension of the string, you don't need to pull it perfectly taut every time. Instead of dealing, say, 6-12 damage per arrow, you can choose to deal 3-6 for example. It'd be neat if certain quests or encounters prompted events when the enemy's HP is low so an ability like this would actually be useful.

Why would anyone choose to do less damage? I don't have any low HP enemies like rats or ants, but I'm curious about what you had in mind.

It would be similar in purpose to dealing non-lethal damage in DnD. Of course, the question is why WOULD anyone choose to do less damage? Probably not, unless there are quests like "scare off the neighbor who steals grapes from my orchard, but don't kill him!"

Maybe a better choice would be "Not shooting to kill," where your attack suffer an overall decrease in damage, but will never drop the enemy below 1 HP.

Here's a few more ideas on bow skills:

1. Spraying cover fire. Your chance to hit is drastically less, but the opponent who is the target of the cover fire would have his AP reduced in the next round. Would be a handy option to have trying to save your teammate who is making an escape from the enemy.

2. Temporary focus. You can sacrifice accuracy/damage on your next attack for extra accuracy/damage on the current one.

3. Voodoo arrows(!) I understand that magic is a very small portion of your game -- I just had an image of some crazy tribal shaman smearing his blood on the feather of the arrow as a curse. It costs you HP, but the arrow will deal more damage if it hits.

Looking forward to your game!

Rabby

 

[Balor]

A few cents from me too:

3. Firing multiple arrows simultaneously, at multiple targets. I think this would be self-explanatory.

At multiple targets? C'mon, it's way too arcade. At one target, just like burst in Fallout - maybe. But not more the 2 arrows, unless you'll come up with special implement for this.

1. Spraying cover fire. Your chance to hit is drastically less, but the opponent who is the target of the cover fire would have his AP reduced in the next round. Would be a handy option to have trying to save your teammate who is making an escape from the enemy.

Well, that would be fine, but only game that has proper mechanics of this so far is E5 . Not that easy to make and balance, you know.
And for 'not drawning your string fully' - well, it's obvious that 'lower damage shots' will spend less AP (and require less STR to perform).
Btw, good idea:
a shot with not fully drawn string - -AP, -Damage, -1/2 Str req. (beating off a rat swarm, for instance )
Snap shot - everything at normal.
Aimed shot +accuracy, +AP, +1/2 str reqs.
Nice enough, I think.

 

[Fez]

Mount & Blade has a good system for crossbows and bows, you should give it consideration. I find that both crossbows and bows are useful for different tactics and character builds in that system. Much better than BG's system which was just a matter of working out the damage per second or knowing in advance which weapon group gets the best items, you use what suits your own strategy or preference in M&B.

 

[jasondragon]

I think you should just focus on crossbows and nothing else. But make them really really cool! *innocent whistle*