CDP still rocks / TW2 incoming

[DefJam101]

Did anyone ever say TW had good combat? I don't remember this. It is, by far, the least frustrating RT combat system I have seen in an RPG. That's all. I've never seen a good RT system in an RPG.

Best TB combat I've seen in an RPG is Fallout/Fallout 2,

Are you just lying to assure people that you are, indeed, a Fallout fan?

Combat was one of the worst things about Fallout. Everything from interface design to the auto-aggro towns was clunky. Not to mention the fucked up difficulty curve.

 

[Ravn7]

when it comes to console edition CDP suddenly turns into a retarded studio

Few people have already told you that good combat for console players is not the same as good combat for PC.

If something doesn't fit your "flawless" logic you just don't see it at all, do you?

 

[MetalCraze]

Few people have already told you that good combat for console players is not the same as good combat for PC.

...and that is an argument for what?

Oh you probably wanted to say that giving you a direct control of your character in combat is console shit while the retarded "click-on-cue"/QTE mini-game is a very good PC combat system. Wow.

 

[Ravn7]

for this:

So fanboys must decide for themselves whether CDP sucks or not - because when it comes to PC version they are flawless but when it comes to console edition CDP suddenly turns into a retarded studio that can't make games for shit and only can add more bloom.

You've said something like that a few times.

If anyone thinks the combat is too easy, there's an insane difficulty mod for you. It's been there for quite a long time now.
http://www.thewitcher.com/forum/index.php?topic=17884.0

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Did anyone ever say TW had good combat? I don't remember this. It is, by far, the least frustrating RT combat system I have seen in an RPG. That's all. I've never seen a good RT system in an RPG.

Best TB combat I've seen in an RPG is Fallout/Fallout 2,

Are you just lying to assure people that you are, indeed, a Fallout fan?

Combat was one of the worst things about Fallout. Everything from interface design to the auto-aggro towns was clunky. Not to mention the fucked up difficulty curve.

Fallout was the only TB RPG I played that didn't make me want to tear my hair out.

 

[Jaime Lannister]

Did you play JA2 or Silent Storm or are you not counting those as RPGs?

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Oh, so we should throw all the lore from the books because you don't like silver swords?

Doom is an RPG because in the book you play a Space Marine and asking to play anything else is against the lore.

No, nice strawman but there's an easier solution. Have Attack, Block, Parry as three separate move options for both Steel and Silver. Then have skills appropriate to each. So you can focus on your "Attack Skills" for extra damage (which applies to Steel and Silver because it's still a fucking sword) but will get hit a lot yourself. Alternatively, you could mix up your play style by going for a lot of "Block Skills". Those skills allow you to block different attacks and mean you won't get hit, so you rely on wearing an enemy down. Alternatively, focus on "Parry Skills" to increase attack speed or mix and match between all of them. Throw in some combo moves you get from stringing together a bunch of moves in sequence and weyhey, you're done.

... or you know, throw melee in as an option against some monsters instead of just using it for some dumb fist-fighting mini-game.

... or even give me some options to increase the power of the other weapons like Axes and things and be a bit different. I do have amnesia after all and it is used to excuse everything else.

Oh and be sure to give the player less talents so they don't just level everything up anyway. Apparently I'm supposed to "choose carefully" but I ran out of decent stuff to spend Bronze talents on three levels ago.

Use the oils, then.

I am but not often, mainly because I haven't needed them that often so far. Only one or two places where there are an overwhelming number of Monster X do I bother using the Oil for it... or End of Chapter Boss Fights.

But then, even if you do want to focus on something, it's not like you get a choice ther either. Like the tough decisions you have to make when levelling up your character. Let's see now, I've pretty much chosen all the useful Bronze level skills and yet I keep getting more Bronze talents. Guess I may as well pick the fist-fighting and other mainly useless ones and hope I get some Silver talents in the next Chapter so I can actually improve or something. God forbid I get too far advanced of where I'm supposed to be.

Oh, please, bitching about this is like crying because in d&d a wizard doesn't get to cast Fireball before level 9.

Except there's nothing in the lore that prevents you from using Bombs earlier, right? So no, it's like complaining about a game that holds your hand the entire way through. Each Chapter is conveniently handed to you and you grind you way through it before you get to the next one. Mommy is there to hand out the skills only when you need them so that you don't get too confused. And you only open up the appropriate other skills when Mommy says it's okay. Whoop, you're fighting level 3 monsters now so here, you can now choose some level 3 skills.

Still, The Witcher is a nice Interactive Story Book and I'm enjoying the very linear and railed main plot (sorry, I don't get carried away by false illusions of "choice" that ultimately result in no significantly different consequences). I couldn't call it a True RPG™ though.

No, remembering to stop and pick the flowers because alchemy is good, and it saves your hide.

So far, only Blizzard and Swallow have saved my hide. A few of the sword oils have come in useful but haven't been entirely necessary. I don't know if that changes significantly later in the game (I guess I could be using Bombs but apparently I'm not allowed to choose them yet. I suppose it would break the game if I had the option to focus on that as a style instead of using Swords everywhere) but for now, Blizzard == Win.

Combat was one of the worst things about Fallout. Everything from interface design to the auto-aggro towns was clunky. Not to mention the fucked up difficulty curve.

Yeah sorry, I don't get people who dislike Fallout's combat. I love walking into The Hub when I finally get some Combat Armour and a Sniper Rifle and just opening up. I also love wandering around the world map just looking for merchants and raiders to pop. There's something satisfactory about the feel and response. The slow way you can get your rifle out on your turn, leisurely take your time to pick your target, aim at their groin if you want to knock them halfway across the map or eyes if you want to blow a chucnk of their right-side away and... click to pull the trigger.

Still, ToEE does have the best TB combat I've ever seen. Silent Storm was great fun blowing shit up and X-Com is always a blast.

 

[MetalCraze]

but I ran out of decent stuff to spend Bronze talents on three levels ago.

Oh that is just the beginning of problems with the flawed gimmick (yes unneeded) TW system. By the end of the game you will have all bronze, nearly all silver and nearly half of the gold skills which are about +hp, +dmg anyway.

But CDP masked the unneeded system good I will give them that. Only when you start to run out of stuff to spend silver skills on you understand that no matter what you pick TW is made in such way that it force-feeds you the only correct way of developing your character.

 

[DefJam101]

Still, The Witcher is a nice Interactive Story Book and I'm enjoying the very linear and railed main plot (sorry, I don't get carried away by false illusions of "choice" that ultimately result in no significantly different consequences). I couldn't call it a True RPG™ though.

Again, you act as if there is no middle ground between a BioWare game and Fallout.

 

[Mic Turner]

No, nice strawman but there's an easier solution. Have Attack, Block, Parry as three separate move options for both Steel and Silver. Then have skills appropriate to each. So you can focus on your "Attack Skills" for extra damage (which applies to Steel and Silver because it's still a fucking sword) but will get hit a lot yourself. Alternatively, you could mix up your play style by going for a lot of "Block Skills". Those skills allow you to block different attacks and mean you won't get hit, so you rely on wearing an enemy down. Alternatively, focus on "Parry Skills" to increase attack speed or mix and match between all of them. Throw in some combo moves you get from stringing together a bunch of moves in sequence and weyhey, you're done.

Looks a bit like Rise of the Argonauts, doesn't it? Trouble is, if the dev team focuses so much on combat, something is going to give.
Oh, and there is a lot of difference between 1-h and 2-h swords.

Except there's nothing in the lore that prevents you from using Bombs earlier, right?

You mean besides being hard to make and handle?

So no, it's like complaining about a game that holds your hand the entire way through. Each Chapter is conveniently handed to you and you grind you way through it before you get to the next one. Mommy is there to hand out the skills only when you need them so that you don't get too confused. And you only open up the appropriate other skills when Mommy says it's okay. Whoop, you're fighting level 3 monsters now so here, you can now choose some level 3 skills.

Yeah sure, go fight wyverns in the swamp when you first get to Vizima.

sorry, I don't get carried away by false illusions of "choice" that ultimately result in no significantly different consequences

You say you can't even use bombs (silver talent: middle game, you get one at the end of Act 1 for free), but you can say the game offers "no significantly different consequences"? It's a slow game, it gets better and it branches pretty much during chapters 3 and 4.

So far, only Blizzard and Swallow have saved my hide. A few of the sword oils have come in useful but haven't been entirely necessary. I don't know if that changes significantly later in the game (I guess I could be using Bombs but apparently I'm not allowed to choose them yet. I suppose it would break the game if I had the option to focus on that as a style instead of using Swords everywhere) but for now, Blizzard == Win.

I never ventured out without a couple of Cat potions; Bindweed is really useful in the swamps, against those annoying exploding monsters; other useful ones are Thunderbolt, Willow, White Raffard Decotion and of course White Honey.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Yeah sure, go fight wyverns in the swamp when you first get to Vizima.

Been there. Done that. They're tough but I didn't even need a Blizzard. You can just lure them out one-by-one and take them that way without too much difficulty. If you get more on your tail, just run around in circles casting fireballs at them until they die. Better yet, lure them into other monsters and they'll attack each other. You get to sit back and watch then and pick over the dead remains. Your reward is a Steel sword that's better than that waste of money meteorite bullshit. I'm playing on Hard by the way, in OTS mode.

I never ventured out without a couple of Cat potions; Bindweed is really useful in the swamps, against those annoying exploding monsters; other useful ones are Thunderbolt, Willow, White Raffard Decotion and of course White Honey.

Yeah, that's another thing that annoys me. Given you never bother with those secondary weapons, I grabbed a torch for the dark areas thinking it'd save me some Cats potions and a bit of toxicity. Only problem is, Geralt keeps putting the fucking thing away! I pull it out, wander around seeing what there is, a monster pops up so I switch to my sword and kill it (easy to do as in the dark, the red monster health circle stands out nicely and makes it easy to target). Once things are dead, pull out the torch again. But then whenever you loot something like a barrel or corpse, Geralt puts the torch away. Then you take it out again to wander around and a few seconds later, Geralt puts the torch away. This is also the same problem if you're running around a combat area with swords drawn (just because it's faster running that way). Eventually, Geralt puts the sword away. If I wanted to put my weapons away, I'd fucking put my weapons away. You have to keep switching combat styles to keep his sword in his hand.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

Holy fucking shit not another "What is RPG" discussion! This leads nowhere, because the definition of RPG can be stretched farther than goatse-man's anus.

Why must you mention him? I was beginning to have erections again, now the memories will haunt me forever. Damn you Jarlfrank!

 

[hiver]

Trouble is, if the dev team focuses so much on combat, something is going to give.

Thats bullshit. Combat is what this game and 99% of others hinges on and as such it should be made as best it can be made.

What DU suggested is similar to what many have suggested and apparently CD sees it also.

 

[Desslock]

It even baffles the mind that old-school gamers like Desslock, whom you would assume as authoritative people on RPGs, have said that stats should be completely removed from RPGs, and that Bioshock is the ideal RPG.

As I mentioned in another thread, I never said either of these things (and actually feel the opposite), and never even played Bioshock.

 

[Wyrmlord]

I am sorry about that Desslock, please forgive me.

I will not slander you ever again in my life.

 

[Jason]

Little known fact: Desslock can't get an erection without first strangling a toll booth attendant.

 

[MetalCraze]

Oh yeah! More womyn cards to collect and more generic villains to kill while following railroaded plot!

CDP still rocks

 

[Dionysus]

The Witcher struck me as a 10/10 effort put into creating a 7/10 game. I hope that CDP is more ambitious with the next installment. And they should cut out the filler. You could probably trim 25% of the Witcher and only improve the game.