Interview Chris Avellone is still pretty mad about Obsidian

[Delterius]

No you are dumb.

 

[Excidium II]

Perhaps you can elaborate on this. My impression of PoE was that even maxing essential stats results in pathetic, at most, 30% or so damage boosts, at which point you might as well just balance your stats in the hopes of making most dialogue checks. Even on the Path of the Damned difficulty I had no need of the small benefits one stat gave over the other.

And then you play BG2 and spend two hours rerolling so you can the perfect STR for that 5% increased hit chance and 1 whole damage over a decent 18/88 u got before lmao

 

[Excidium II]

No you are dumb.

Describe a good melee wizard build for poe then.

 

[Excidium II]

This nigga complains stats do too little on PoE but apparently thinks d20 system is fine, some top jesters ITT

 

[Fenix]

most dialogue checks

Who need these "dialog checks", like if PoE have fascinating and interesting plot, setting, dialogs and characters.

 

[Excidium II]

^ Better than BG games at least

 

[Fenix]

You are wrong.

 

[Azrael the cat]

Perhaps you can elaborate on this. My impression of PoE was that even maxing essential stats results in pathetic, at most, 30% or so damage boosts, at which point you might as well just balance your stats in the hopes of making most dialogue checks. Even on the Path of the Damned difficulty I had no need of the small benefits one stat gave over the other.

And then you play BG2 and spend two hours rerolling so you can the perfect STR for that 5% increased hit chance and 1 whole damage over a decent 18/88 u got before lmao

In fairness, BG2 very clearly realised (after BG1) that AD&D strength mechanics don't translate well to a computer system where there's no peer-imposed shame mechanic to stop you from rerolling to absurdity. It corrected the issue by providing enough str+ equipment that your front-line classes can quickly get to 19 str (and then improve from there) and balanced around that.

 

[Excidium II]

You are wrong.

Yes I apologize. PoE doesn't have Aerie

 

[Excidium II]

Perhaps you can elaborate on this. My impression of PoE was that even maxing essential stats results in pathetic, at most, 30% or so damage boosts, at which point you might as well just balance your stats in the hopes of making most dialogue checks. Even on the Path of the Damned difficulty I had no need of the small benefits one stat gave over the other.

And then you play BG2 and spend two hours rerolling so you can the perfect STR for that 5% increased hit chance and 1 whole damage over a decent 18/88 u got before lmao

In fairness, BG2 very clearly realised (after BG1) that AD&D strength mechanics don't translate well to a computer system where there's no peer-imposed shame mechanic to stop you from rerolling to absurdity. It corrected the issue by providing enough str+ equipment that your front-line classes can quickly get to 19 str (and then improve from there) and balanced around that.

Still beyond lulzy to see complaint of "only" 30% considering what he has no issues with

 

[Fenix]

Aerie

What's with her?

 

[Delterius]

Perhaps you can elaborate on this. My impression of PoE was that even maxing essential stats results in pathetic, at most, 30% or so damage boosts, at which point you might as well just balance your stats in the hopes of making most dialogue checks. Even on the Path of the Damned difficulty I had no need of the small benefits one stat gave over the other.

And then you play BG2 and spend two hours rerolling so you can the perfect STR for that 5% increased hit chance and 1 whole damage

Across the 18/00 spectrum and the attainable (in BG1) score of 19 there is +3 to hit and +7 to damage. The benefits scale down over time, but as you begin the adventure in either BG1 or IWD they are major. This is more than even Grandmastery proficiency gives you. Likewise for DEX for ranged to hit chance. Much more so for the CON HP bonus or the WIS bonus spells. I'd also argue that as ultimately pointless INT scribe chance is, for someone willing to bite the bullet the game does add something by making you drink Potions of Genius to increase your chances. But that's just for the characters you make, someone like Aerie changes a lot with a casting of Divine Might or Righteous Magic.

No you are dumb.

Describe a good melee wizard build for poe then.

Well, at the time when I played there was still an accuracy attribute that made overkill use of the cool Melf's Minute Meteors with random elements. The game's changed a lot. But I'd assume a melee wizard still focuses on MIG/DEX/INT to make smart use of conjured weapon and defensive spells like Mirror Image, Skins, the Veil and such.

The point I was trying to make is that the games are solid enough as they are. They are just games. The complexity argument is pointless. Unless its about documentation, of which PoE has in spades and is indeed a point in its favor.

most dialogue checks

Who need these "dialog checks", like if PoE have fascinating and interesting plot, setting, dialogs and characters.

PoE's writing was stretched thin and overambitious, but the dialogue checks did add a neat layer of customization. They gave your PC characterization that is sorely lacking in most CRPGs, even in writing wonder kids like Bloodlines (minus the Malkavian run). Plus there are some quests which can be resolved through them, which is already more than in most of the IE games which at best gave you some special boots for having godlike Charisma.

 

[Grunker]

Jesus niggas you fail at maths. The whole point of both the IE-games and PoE is that flat damage increases are very hard to come by. Mastery is really powerful in the IE games even though most increases are a flat +1 to damage. Because these games are not shitty weeaboo crap where you deal thousands of damage.

Hearing someone praise AD&D and complain over the minuteness of a 15% increase... jesus christ

 

[Excidium II]

Well, at the time when I played there was still an accuracy attribute that made overkill use of the cool Melf's Minute Meteors with random elements. The game's changed a lot. But I'd assume a melee wizard still focuses on MIG/DEX/INT to make smart use of conjured weapon and defensive spells like Mirror Image, Skins, the Veil and such.

Vague as hell and why Int?

The complexity argument is pointless. Unless its about documentation, of which PoE has in spades and is indeed a point in its favor.

maybe people ITT should go and read some of it instead of repeating memes from last year

 

[Fenix]

If I ever will play PoE it will be solo on hardest difficulty, Rogue or Ranger. I accept NPC there only for their quest, then I'll kick them out.

 

[Excidium II]

Playing solo is fucking banal but I'd like to see a solo Rogue om PotD lolz

 

[Azrael the cat]

Don't have time to read through the whole thread, just someone tell me: has Chris Avellone posted in it?

I guess that depends on what you think the odds are of MCA having a codex alt for when he wants to say shit without harming his career.

BTW I haven't completely ruled out Roguey being a Sawyer alt, despite the update to her sign.

 

[Lurker King]

They seem similar.

Sawyer school of design: cRPGs need to be "balanced"; every build deserves a chance; every roleplaying preference should be supported by the character system; every skill should be useful; every player should feel rewarded.

Vault Dweller school of design: cRPGs need to be balanced; poor builds have no chance; only sensible roleplaying preferences should be supported; skills should be useful only when they are supported by the setting and common sense; only alpha players that master the system should feel rewarded.

Both use the word "balance", but they represent extreme opposite doctrines. The first one is designed for causals who can't get into cRPGs, while the second one is designed for grognards.

 

[Delterius]

Vague as hell and why Int?

As I said I haven't played in a long time and the weight of attributes may have changed since then.

I don't think there's much of a point in making a melee Wizard that is great at interruptions. Instead, I think we'd be better off using INT to boost the duration of your conjured weapons and spells, DEX to cast them more quickly and MIG to deal more damage. Gimping CON/PER/RES shouldn't be much of a problem for your survivability if your defensive spells come through. My traditional wand waving Wizard could survive (though not tank) with those on PotD. Besides, most of your Accuracy is derived from your character's level anyways.

As I remember it, there were two conjured weapons of note. The early game quarterstaff and the late game lance. Relying on the wiki a bit more, seems like they added another conjured quarterstaff in the expansion. Well, there's no weapon focus or specialization that includes both proficiencies and the late game lance had a blast radius. So I'd be inclined to invest in proficiencies for both with no extra feats to make the Veil any harder, plus the two handed damage bonus.

 

[Grunker]

Respeccing is dirt cheap. Starting with staff-talent and going with another talent later is a non-issue.

I haven't played around with Wizards much myself, but isn't one of the absolute best builds currently a melee one that relies on the superstrong Tenser's Transformation-ish buffs in their catalogue? Some of them lasts for ages.

Come to think of it it's odd I didn't go with that myself, gishes are my fave fam

 

[Delterius]

Respeccing is dirt cheap.

Oh yeah, I didn't remember the expansion added respeccing. That does change things, freeing up 2 feats for the Veil.

 

[Fenix]

Playing solo is fucking banal

No, it is fucking classy, and opposite of boring, which in turn is a definition of PoE's combat.

 

[Roguey]

Hearing someone praise AD&D and complain over the minuteness of a 15% increase... jesus christ

+3 to hit? Pssh, that's nothing.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

And there I thought it was possible to avoid yet another PoE thread by staying out of the Obsidian subforum

There is no escape

 

[Sensuki]

+3 and 15% are not the same.