Some people in my local group have been talking about wanting to try out 5E, so I picked up the PHB today. It bothers me quite a bit that the DMG/MM aren't out right now, since that pretty much forces people to get one of the premade adventures if they want to play the game or guess at how a lot of mechanics needed to DM will work. Once I've had time to read and digest the PHB I'll post some proper impressions. The artstyle is quite nice. Nowhere near the amazing paintings we have from the 2nd ed era, but a fair step up from late 3.5-4e dumbfuckery. It seems like a lot of stuff has been tweaked. I can't tell whether I like or hate the changes just yet.
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D&D 5E Discussion
- Thread starter Alchemist
- Start date
nikolokolus
Arcane
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I'm really not sure what the strategic reason for a staggered release is. I know TSR spread out AD&D 1st ed. over two years, way back when, but those were mostly written by one man in Gygax. What's WotC's excuse or angle?
J1M
Arcane
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Excuse: more editing time results in less errata.
Angle (Renegade): Restrict monster and DM information to sell more adventures.
Angle (Paragon): Not everyone can afford to buy all three books in one month.
haha Neither angle worked on me, I bought all available books together on pre-order sale hahaah
It was similar with 3e. The PHB was the first to debut (with a small GM's appendix), then the DMG and the MM. Might have something to do with the massive production runs these kinds of flagship titles have. I assume we are talking at least a hundred thousand PHBs and tens of thousands of the other two on the initial print run.
Alchemist
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Guys, I have some bad news...
Sources: http://www.androidcentral.com/new-dungeons-dragons-game-works-mobile
and GameInformer
Sources: http://www.androidcentral.com/new-dungeons-dragons-game-works-mobile
and GameInformer
nikolokolus
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I don't begrudge some small shop developer trying to make a buck or two, but one would hope that WotC has more in mind than MMOs and casual mobile games.
J1M
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Maybe you can convince inXile to make a pitch for a turn-based game to Hasbro. You know, emphasis on the FREE MONEY one can print by mentioning RPG or dice on kickstarter.
Things are looking grim, bros. me and a few friends rolled up some 5E PCs and had a go at each other (since no MM out). Initial impressions were the game is the worst parts of 3E and 4E combined. I'll run a oneshot for my gaming group Saturday, gather their impressions and do a full review.
There appears to be a lot less choice in the character building. And hp scaled way harder than damage in our tests. High-level fights are going to take forever.
There appears to be a lot less choice in the character building. And hp scaled way harder than damage in our tests. High-level fights are going to take forever.
Alchemist
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You can get some free monsters in the DM's basic PDF they released recently: http://media.wizards.com/2014/downloads/dnd/DMDnDBasicRules_v0.1.pdfThings are looking grim, bros. me and a few friends rolled up some 5E PCs and had a go at each other (since no MM out). Initial impressions were the game is the worst parts of 3E and 4E combined. I'll run a oneshot for my gaming group Saturday, gather their impressions and do a full review.
There appears to be a lot less choice in the character building. And hp scaled way harder than damage in our tests. High-level fights are going to take forever.
I'm curious to hear your group's impressions with a real adventure. A PvP match doesn't really represent the intent of the game.
There's a 256 hp adult red dragon right in page 8.
And this reminds of Monty Python:
And this reminds of Monty Python:
Awakened Shrub
Small plant, unaligned
Armor Class 9
Hit Points 10 (3d6)
Speed 20 ft.
STR 3 (−4)
DEX 8 (−1)
CON 11 (+0)
INT 10 (+0)
WIS 10 (+0)
CHA 6 (−2)
Damage Vulnerabilities fire
Damage Resistances piercing
Senses passive Perception 10
Languages: one language known by its creator
Challenge
0 (10 XP)
False Appearance.
While the shrub remains motionless, it is indistinguishable from a normal shrub.
Actions
Rake. Melee Weapon Attack: +1 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target.
Hit: 1 (1d4 − 1) slashing damage.
An awakened shrub is an ordinary shrub given sentience and mobility by magic.
Small plant, unaligned
Armor Class 9
Hit Points 10 (3d6)
Speed 20 ft.
STR 3 (−4)
DEX 8 (−1)
CON 11 (+0)
INT 10 (+0)
WIS 10 (+0)
CHA 6 (−2)
Damage Vulnerabilities fire
Damage Resistances piercing
Senses passive Perception 10
Languages: one language known by its creator
Challenge
0 (10 XP)
False Appearance.
While the shrub remains motionless, it is indistinguishable from a normal shrub.
Actions
Rake. Melee Weapon Attack: +1 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target.
Hit: 1 (1d4 − 1) slashing damage.
An awakened shrub is an ordinary shrub given sentience and mobility by magic.
nikolokolus
Arcane
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- May 8, 2013
- Messages
- 4,090
Things are looking grim, bros. me and a few friends rolled up some 5E PCs and had a go at each other (since no MM out). Initial impressions were the game is the worst parts of 3E and 4E combined. I'll run a oneshot for my gaming group Saturday, gather their impressions and do a full review.
There appears to be a lot less choice in the character building. And hp scaled way harder than damage in our tests. High-level fights are going to take forever.
Depending on how the first mini-campaign goes this fall, I'm seriously considering going old-school and capping Hit Dice after level 12 and give characters a flat +3 for warriors, +2 for Thieves and Cleric types and +1 for wizarding dudes. I'm sure that will take off like a lead balloon with some of my players.
Out of curiosity, what do you see as the worst parts of 3e and 4e and where do you see them applied to 5e? My first impression without playing. is that this game feels more like a mashup of Castles & Crusades, 2e and 3e, with just a few nods to 4e; e.g. when it comes to rest/healing, etc.
aleph
Arcane
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- 1,778
Yeah, that was my impression too. Honestly, 5e feels like they tried really hard to get a modern version of 2e going. The verdict is still out if they succeeded but at least they tried hard to get rid of a lot of BS from 4e and 3e
Not sure many are ready to switch per se, but there certainly seems to be a degree of optimism and willingness to try it out "in the field".
It's not that many are ready to switch.
Many just see the fighter and monk and rogue classes as ultimately broken and Paizo having no interest in trying to actually fix them.
Not sure about monk and rogue, but Fighter is unfortunately a bit static in Pathfinder. They had a real opportunity to create a rather interesting martial full BAB, but really just ended up with something that's stagnant and not very interesting with class skills and abilities. Some of the Archetypes are ok, others not so much.
The fighter is just ultimately lacking in terms of flavor and class options. And some Archetypes, like Weaponmaster, should have been awesome, but instead aren't because of the basic flaws in their design. And Paizo has shown no interest in actually fixing them either, which leads to a TON of frustration from the user base.
I had a half-orc two-handed fighter that required SO much by way of modification, etc, to make useful outside of combat. He ended up becoming the diplomat/intimidator, spoke a half-dozen languages, and was both insanely damaging and impossible to dominate, etc. But man, it took a TON of work, feat management, trait management, and planning. It bugged me that the fighter just has no real capabilities outside of combat without any real work, AND a lot of the archetypes have repeating flavors that just aren't up to snuff that often.
Many just see the fighter and monk and rogue classes as ultimately broken and Paizo having no interest in trying to actually fix them.
Not sure about monk and rogue, but Fighter is unfortunately a bit static in Pathfinder. They had a real opportunity to create a rather interesting martial full BAB, but really just ended up with something that's stagnant and not very interesting with class skills and abilities. Some of the Archetypes are ok, others not so much.
The fighter is just ultimately lacking in terms of flavor and class options. And some Archetypes, like Weaponmaster, should have been awesome, but instead aren't because of the basic flaws in their design. And Paizo has shown no interest in actually fixing them either, which leads to a TON of frustration from the user base.
I had a half-orc two-handed fighter that required SO much by way of modification, etc, to make useful outside of combat. He ended up becoming the diplomat/intimidator, spoke a half-dozen languages, and was both insanely damaging and impossible to dominate, etc. But man, it took a TON of work, feat management, trait management, and planning. It bugged me that the fighter just has no real capabilities outside of combat without any real work, AND a lot of the archetypes have repeating flavors that just aren't up to snuff that often.
Stompa
Arcane
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- 531
Monk in Pathfinder is broken due to its core design being broken in 3.5. It still has exact same problems it had before (poor feature synergy and MAD), making monk downright unplayable. Stealth nerfing through errata didn't help either. In comparison 5E monk seems way more attractive. Sure, 5E's martials are still a bit on the boring side, but at least they're not shafted as hard as in 3.5\PF.
*melee monk
nikolokolus
Arcane
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You just reminded me why I eventually became so disillusioned with modern D&D; all of those supposed options and choices and characters always end up feeling so narrowly defined and put into a box ... There's nothing wrong with skill/feat based systems per se, but the 3.x method just never clicked for me. If you want a skill based system, better to go classless like BRP, et al. I suppose?
Then again I loathe min-maxing and prefer "human" scaled, randomly generated, flawed characters that are forced to compensate for their weaknesses with teamwork. In other words, a grumpy old man.
Then again I loathe min-maxing and prefer "human" scaled, randomly generated, flawed characters that are forced to compensate for their weaknesses with teamwork. In other words, a grumpy old man.
LeStryfe79
President Spartacus
I remember how cool I thought Prestige classes were that first year...
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