Preview Develop on Alpha Protocol

[Thrasher]

"Parker said the aim was to make an RPG that was lighter and used shooting mechanics."

Uh oh. RPG-lite. I can only hope for mechanics as heavy as Deus-Ex / SS2 .

 

[Fat Dragon]

The only way to combine first person shooter and RPG is Deus Ex (Combine! Combine! It's not /just/ an RPG, get off my back!). We will see if the game will take much needed inspiration from it. It better.

System Shock 2, dammit.

No, not System Shock 2. As much as I love that game its weapon skills are not balanced at all. Energy weapons are useless, grenade launcher breaks the game completely with all other weapons in its category useless, exotic weapons are useless as well with the exception of the crystal which is also way overpowered. Standard weapons is the only one with good balance.

 

[Jasede]

It's true they are poorly balanced, but in an RPG I don't give a care. If my character wants to beat stuff up with a 1d4 dagger or a silly worm-gun he will; who cares. The game is easy enough anyway.

(Again, you are 100% correct though. The only good weapons in that game were the Grenade Launcher, the Crystal Shard, the Assault Rifle, and oddly enough, the Wrench.)

 

[bhlaab]

Re: The Indsutry...

The Industry is just now picking up on what made cRPG's amazing - Choice and Consequence. It's going to become another meaningless trademark, mark my words. (no pun intended)

It already is.

Anyway, I have faith in Alpha Protocol. (Which is a shame because almost every game I have faith in turns out awful)
While I would certainly appreciate a lot more hardcore rpgs in the vein of Age of Decadence hitting the market, esp. from Obsidian, what I've heard from AP makes it sound like an Action RPG that borrows elements from the genre better than the ones I've played so far.

 

[Thrasher]

The thing is we've heard this promise for years, and all we get is lousy or failed atempts at integrating RPG elements into action FPSs (Bioshock, Fallout 3, and STALKER come to mind).

 

[PrzeSzkoda]

"Colorful" villains (this must meant they'll be black of brown)

The Yiffster's back in black!

 

[denizsi]

The thing is we've heard this promise for years, and all we get is lousy or failed atempts at integrating RPG elements into action FPSs (Bioshock, Fallout 3, and STALKER come to mind).

STALKER? The only RPG element the hype machine murmured was "inventory", and there is nothing wrong with the inventory in STALKER. Don't be daft.

 

[Thrasher]

Wrong. Read the old news, do some research, before posting next time.

 

[MetalCraze]

Just since when inventory is an element exclusive to RPG?

 

[Thrasher]

Inventory has nothing to do with it.

 

[Rhalle]

"Parker said the aim was to make an RPG that was lighter and used shooting mechanics."

Uh oh. RPG-lite.

As will be every mainstream RPG henceforth.

 

[Foamhead]

Avellone promised that there will be plenty of romance, colourful villains, action, bullets, betrayals, and alliances.

Yep, pretty much as I thought - the game will be shit.
Parker and Avellone are going with a usual PR bullshit and considering that it is a multiplatform game half of that stuff won't be there and the other half will be dumbed down (plenty of bullets - yeah like infinite bullets)
Obsidian can't make RPGs right - and now they (the guys with absolutely no shooter experience) are making a fugly looking mainstream shooter on a shitty mainstream engine.

You keep is real Skyway, you keep it so fucking real it hurts this plane of reality. The codex does not deserve an RPG giant such as yourself and you should leave before we start taking advantage of your superior RPG-itude.

 

[Andhaira]

The ebst weapon in SS2 was the psi-amp power 4 which transformed your psi-amp into a melee weapon (like a sword or something). It was a basic one hit kill.

 

[Wyrmlord]

Seeing the gradual increase in Alpha Protocol news, I think the game is nearing release at this stage, yes?

 

[Hümmelgümpf]

Seeing the gradual increase in Alpha Protocol news, I think the game is nearing release at this stage, yes?

It's supposed to be out in June.

 

[Wyrmlord]

Avellone peaked with Torment, it's all downhill now. I enjoy combat very much, and first-person dungeon crawlers too, so maybe it won't be too bad, but there's something in my guts that tells me this game will be terrible. The only way to combine first person shooter and RPG is Deus Ex (Combine! Combine! It's not /just/ an RPG, get off my back!). We will see if the game will take much needed inspiration from it. It better.

A list of Avellone's first-person action RPGs.

Descent To Undermountain.

Not much hope inspired from this.

 

[Bluebottle]

The only way to combine first person shooter and RPG is Deus Ex (Combine! Combine! It's not /just/ an RPG, get off my back!). We will see if the game will take much needed inspiration from it. It better.

Well, there's also VtMB which, while it didn't get the shooter mechanics particularly right, was, in the end, a good game. Seeing as Mitsoda was involved with both that and AP certainly points in the right direction. Of course there are many things that point in the wrong direction too (the fact that SEGA are unlikely to give it more time in the oven if it needs it, the fact that Mitsoda left, some of the hype talk).

I'm sticking to this fence, for the moment. I hope it's good though. It certainly has potential.

 

[elander_]

What's wrong with Bloodlines combat? The targeting reticle ala DeusEx?

 

[Bluebottle]

What's wrong with Bloodlines combat? The targeting reticle ala DeusEx?

Not a huge amount, I just never felt it really exceled in that department. It's RPG elements were much stronger than its shooter elements, which made its transition to pure shooter later on all the harder to take. I tend to think that FPS/RPG hybrids do better when they owe more to Thief than they do Half-Life, as did Deus Ex. Bloodlines does this, at some points, but then it also adds boss battles and, well, that whole end section.

 

[Dionysus]

What's wrong with Bloodlines combat? The targeting reticle ala DeusEx?

It's mostly a combination of lame level, enemy, and weapon design. The levels are often corridor crawls and the enemies that aren't mindless meleeing monsters are generally restricted to the uninteresting weaponry featured in the game. It could be improved by adding standard weapons, like grenades. Area-specific damage would have been nice too. But the level design was probably the biggest problem, and the biggest challenge for Alpha Protocol.

 

[elander_]

That's sort of what i think. The bosses, the dumbed down maps like the sewers and the last part of the game. In DeusEx we can finish the game without using a single weapon. This was a conscient design decision and a great challenge to explore all secrets in the game. It doesn't have the c&c and dialogs of Bloodlines but it has few were it counts. AP should look at DeusEx for the maps and Bloodlines for the great characters and dialogs.

 

[MetalCraze]

Except nobody will look at Deus Ex and Bloodlines.
AP is a yet another "summer action game" that will come and go as a mediocre shooter.

One of the facts that proves it - part of Deus Ex challenge was that you didn't have enough bullets to simply shoot everyone on your path to the exit from the given level and thus you often have to seek other ways - AP on the other hand has the fucking "infinite bullets" special ability. No really think on it - bullets suddenly appear out of nowhere in your gun and you put down dumb and slow (due to gamepad) enemies en masse.

The other fact is that while Bloodlines and (to a lesser extent) Deus Ex had dialogue - AP has the retarded dialogue wheel yet again - which as shown by Fahrenheit and ME is a good way to railroad you by not actually letting you know what your character will say - well at least the exact same responses won't be "in your face" like they were in KotOR 2 (yes 2, hypocrites - not only Bioware can do that but the great Avellone too).

I can't believe some people still have faith in Obsidian after this and also their other three awful games.

 

[Fat Dragon]

I can't believe some people still have faith in Obsidian after this and also their other three awful games.

This is actually what I wonder too. MotB is their only game I'd personally consider calling good. And everybody seemed to be 100% sure their Aliens RPG would have been the shit even though they knew next to nothing about it.

Yeah, Obsidian has a few of the old guys on the team but they're still no Black Isle. Not anymore.

 

[elander_]

AP on the other hand has the fucking "infinite bullets" special ability. No really think on it - bullets suddenly appear out of nowhere in your gun and you put down dumb and slow (due to gamepad) enemies en masse.

It's only a special ability and it must be balanced by some cost. Anyway we will see how they do this.

AP has the retarded dialogue wheel yet again

What's the source of this info?

I can't believe some people still have faith in Obsidian after this and also their other three awful games.

Obsidian still have to prove themselves but they did a very interesting expansion, showing they can do good dialog if they want to.

 

[MetalCraze]

It's only a special ability and it must be balanced by some cost.

Balance is not something Obsidian does good.
I think they will just limit it with "special ability recharge time" after which you will go on a killing spree again.
Also you are forgetting who is the target audience - so I'm sure the combat will be the easiest solution - and I'm afraid it will be just like with that "melee vs. ranged combat" in Bloodlines. Except it will be "combat vs. everything else" this time.

What's the source of this info?

Obsidian themselves - just open AP's game page here on the Codex and read a few first reviews - where Obsidian clearly state that they will have a dialogue wheel heavily inspired by Fahrenheit and ME and there was even a screenshot showing it (there were three options described by a single (ME had more) word each.
Obsidian also said that every option you will choose will be rewarding.
(Now add the "you will bag all chicks in this game!" bit and you will perfectly see at what kind of audience Obsidian is looking - don't know what Codex really expects from this game.)

Obsidian still have to prove themselves but they did a very interesting expansion, showing they can do good dialog if they want to.

MotB alsol had terrible NWN2 combat and retarded "epic" levels without any balance that made melee characters overpowered while making mages useless. Not a good design choice if you'll ask me.
Which also shows that till this date Obsidian didn't make a single game with good combat - and AP is an action game want it or not.