Diablo 3 is a-coming?

[Hory]

Yeah, I played D2LOD recently and it still is fun. I don't see how hack&slash games are 'obsolete'.

They're not obsolete, they're as retarded as they've ever been.
On the other hand, maybe D3 is an opportunity for Blizzard to make some innovations in this genre.

 

[Brother None]

Then again, Boyarsky (originally said Jason Anderson, had to edit omg) was hired to work on a secret project, no? Hope its D3.

I'd hope he and Gary Platner would have quite an impact on Blizzard art.

Yeah, it figures that Leonard would be working on D3.

Or heck, maybe an MMO. Why not? Boyarsky, Cain, Anderson, all working on MMOs. Glorious world.

 

[sah]

Examples of what? Diablo-clones that failed to beat D2? Or examples of complex mechanics?

"complex mechanics that haven't been beaten to-date". I agree no clone is better than original D2, but what's so complex about it's mechanics? Choosing stats, skills and gear can be baffling at times, if that's what you mean.

 

[Saxon1974]

Im not sure I care about this, the diablo hack and slash click fest isn't really what Im looking for, but based on the lack of RPG's coming out now, I guess it's better than nothing.

 

[Shagnak]

it was the best game of the sub-genre

Sacred > Diablo 2

Saint agrees so I must be right.

:SGLF:

 

[Kingston]

Nah, Diablo 2 is better than Sacred. Diablo 2 multiplayer just sucks you in. Still gotta pimp that Codex crew D2 hardcore season last year, was great fun. Its a great multiplayer game.

 

[Vault Dweller]

it was the best game of the sub-genre

Sacred > Diablo 2

Saint agrees so I must be right.

:SGLF:

In what ways?

 

[Shagnak]

I admit I'm coming mainly from an SP perspective. I tried playing Diablo 2 SP again recently and by fuck was I incredibly bored very quickly. Exploring for the sake of exploring was zero fun.

Sacred is like Diablo 2 ++.
Oh, the UI is not as polished (e.g. skill screen presentation), but the there is massively more player freedom, more interesting environments, more interesting character classes, more stuff. MOAR!

Diablo 2 felt so ... constrictive.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Examples of what? Diablo-clones that failed to beat D2? Or examples of complex mechanics?

"complex mechanics that haven't been beaten to-date". I agree no clone is better than original D2, but what's so complex about it's mechanics? Choosing stats, skills and gear can be baffling at times, if that's what you mean.

- great char system that supports radically different builds within a class.
- great skill progression
- great item system. In D2 the items work with different much better than in any other RPG, including Sacred. In D2 equipment is vital, unlike in DS2, for example.
- incredibly robust crafting system. You have gems of various power, runes, jewels, crafting recipes, the Cube recipes, etc. For people who wants to create their own equipment, the game is a paradise.

I admit I'm coming mainly from an SP perspective. I tried playing Diablo 2 SP again recently and by fuck was I incredibly bored very quickly. Exploring for the sake of exploring was zero fun.
...
Diablo 2 felt so ... constrictive.

From that point of view, you're right. Sacred was fun to explore, but if we look exclusively at the action aspects - making a combat champion and kicking some ass, leveling up and collecting priceless items of great power, than D2 is still without equal.

Edit: To illustrate my point about items, compare D2 item system to that of NWN2. In D2 the gear and ways to improve it are vital, which makes tinkering with your stuff and finding a new great item fun. In NWN2 your gear is meaningless, upgrading is pointless and not necessary at all, and uber items make combat too easy and suck all the fun out of fighting.

 

[kingcomrade]

Blizzard

innovations

I wonder if they're going to put elf subraces into Diablo. Afternoon Elves, maybe.

 

[Shagnak]

if we look exclusively at the action aspects - making a combat champion and kicking some ass, leveling up and collecting priceless items of great power, than D2 is still without equal.

Even if Diablo 2 has the edge on those aspects (and I don't think it's as big as all that), ultimately the mix in Sacred is one that I certainly find preferable.

Another thing I prefer to Diablo 2 is that things appear to be a better mix of random vs placed. I just find that when you get a quest to find some bandit lord in his hide-out and you find *gasp* some bandit lord in what looks to be a bandit hide-out, well that is a shit load more preferable to going into "random-looking structure + random-looking spawns no. 58". That sort of thing is okay in a coffee break game (e.g. FATE), but not so much if I'm going to spend long sessions on a game.

To illustrate my point about items, compare D2 item system to that of NWN2. In D2 the gear and ways to improve it are vital, which makes tinkering with your stuff and finding a new great item fun.

Whilst conceding that Diablo 2 is likely to have the edge here, that does not mean that it is not a major component of Sacred. Collecting and tinkering with items are a big aspect. Edit: I think they cloned most of what you can do in Diablo 2 by the end of patchification and the expansion pack.

 

[HanoverF]

I hope they release D3 and grind Flagship to dust, offering everything they do for free.

It wouldn't even need to be better than a D2 clone to be better than Hellgate.

 

[kingcomrade]

Games Workshops' other major franchise besides Warhammer Fantasy and 40k is, I guess, the Lord of the Rings miniature game, so maybe Blizzard could find a way to rip that off in their next game.

 

[Dire Roach]

But isn't Warhammer Fantasy's setting a successful ripoff of Middle Earth? It would be like a double-ripoff for Blizzard, ripping off from the roots of that which they had already ripped off.

 

[kingcomrade]

I wouldn't say so, unless you consider all fantasy to be a ripoff of Tolkien.

 

[Lemunde]

The story is pretty much finished.

bah, the ending of d2xp left it open enough to go "diablo resurrected/had a son" and there is no reason not to have a new batch of heros try to kill it (no need for long explanations about how the old guys got involved and suddenly turned lvl1)

From what I remember of the story there were seven lords of hell. The three brothers and the four others who cast the brothers out of hell. Of those four two showed up in the game; Andariel and Duriel. It was suggested that the other four were somehow once again aligned with the three prime lords.

That leaves two that have yet to be seen or killed; Azmodan, the Lord of Sin and Belial, the Lord of Lies and I believe the unofficial ruler over hell in the brothers' absence. My guess is the story will continue with these two trying to resurrect one or all of the other lords, primarily Diablo.

Edit: Well I was trying to find the original mp3 file from diablo that mentioned Belial and Asmodan but I found this instead.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hO43UYJonRo

The video's an obvious fake but part of the story is played in the background and the music is kinda catchy.

 

[Dire Roach]

I wouldn't say so, unless you consider all fantasy to be a ripoff of Tolkien.

Hmm, at first I thought there were more similarities with both settings than most others in the generic fantasy category, but upon closer inspection there really aren't that many. Off the top of my head:

-Both settings are suggested to take place in our own world's distant past.
-Low/rare magic.
-Elves (who are tall supermodel warriors) are declining in population and leaving the fate of the world in the hands of men.
-Orks spelled with a k, Halflings with big hairy feet, Dwarf name conventions, etc.

It was one of the first popular settings to rip off Tolkien, that's for sure.

 

[kingcomrade]

Actually fantasy Orcs are spelt with a C, and Warhammer isn't supposed to be our long lost past, the geography was just based on the real world.

 

[Comrade Hamster]

...Azmodan, the Lord of Sin and Belial, the Lord of Lies and I believe the unofficial ruler over hell in the brothers' absence. My guess is the story will continue with these two trying to resurrect one or all of the other lords, primarily Diablo.

Okay, I will concede the point - that seems credible. I guess with the Worldstone destroyed, it is also possible that the world of Sanctuary (what a terrible name) could be easily flooded by either the forces of Heaven or Hell. Perhaps we might have to fight against invasion from both?

 

[sabishii]

I don't see how hack&slash games are 'obsolete'.

Maybe obsolete in that every new hack & slash game is crap. Hopefully Diablo 3 will introduce some progress in the genre, or at least some quality.

 

[Keender_surprise]

In my opinion, one of the key barriers to people getting into RPGs is that traditional RPGs often involve a disconnect between the game and the player. You have some stats, you click on the enemy and watch the scene play out. What made Diablo and its sequel so compelling was the degree to which everything centred around the player - no controllable party members, a screen that moved with your avatar, fluid movement and combat controls that responded immediately upon player input. What the game lacked was narrative interaction - choices and consequences, in Codex parlance. Both games were basically linear romps through tides of enemies, something that eventually gets tiring. If D3 is coming and they have any clue at all (and they likely do, given that what has been shown of Starcraft 2 seems to suggest their realisation that narrative and mission choice increases immersion) then D3 will be absolutely fantastic. They will have at least fixed the genre if not improved upon it, and in my opinion - made traditional RPGs completely obsolete if you're not a die-hard rollplayer.

 

[Kingston]

D3 will be absolutely fantastic. They will have at least fixed the genre if not improved upon it, and in my opinion - made traditional RPGs completely obsolete if you're not a die-hard rollplayer.

FANBOI ALERT!

"I don't know anything about the game but I know IT WILL BE AWESOME."

They could easily go warcraft 3 on the whole thing, you know, making it shit.

 

[Keender_surprise]

Learn to read. There were some 'ifs' in there, I'm quite sure. If Blizzard produces another rehash of what has come before then clearly I won't be bothering with my dollars. On the other hand, unless they have retarded monkeys working on the project I think that there is reason to be optimistic. They have the time and resources to create the kind of choice-and-consequences type of game that everybody here (including myself) want. The question is whether they do.

 

[Comrade Hamster]

They have the time and resources to create the kind of choice-and-consequences type of game that everybody here (including myself) want. The question is whether they do.

The problem is: What kind of choices, and what kind of consequences? It gets rather specific.

 

[Keender_surprise]

What do you mean? I don't quite catch your drift.