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Incline How to properly enjoy an RPG

luj1

You're all shills
Vatnik
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
13,742
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Eastern block
I realised that trying to make a perfect character is not important

Much more important is to create a distinct character spontaneously
 

__scribbles__

Educated
Joined
Jul 5, 2022
Messages
328
Location
The Void
Playing blind is the only way to enjoy an RPG, if you read guides beforehand you're NGMI
This x1000.

I've never been able to enjoy a game that I used a walkthrough for beyond one or two particular sections. Far too often becomes just checking things off of a checklist, and that can really hurt the sense of adventuring that many RPGs benefit greatly from, Ultima IV being a prime example.
 

luj1

You're all shills
Vatnik
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
13,742
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Eastern block
I think years of playing RPGs have made us metagame too much, but that can be addressed

Whenever I go in blind, such as during the times when we were kids, I had tons of fun

And I can still do it, most importantly
 

CHEMS

Scholar
Joined
Nov 17, 2020
Messages
1,575
I can't stop hoarding shit in RPGs, i feel the need to collect every single item in the game, i have always been like that

In Arcanum i'd rather kill Gilbert Bates just so i could use his mansion to hoard crap lmao
 

Shaki

Arbiter
Joined
Dec 22, 2018
Messages
1,588
Location
Hyperborea
Metagaming/minmaxing is great, it's a way to squeeze more fun out of the game after you've already played it. I enjoy using uber hard difficulty (with mods if the game doesn't have one), adding some self imposed challenges if necessary, and trying to break the game, use my meta knowledge to overcome the insane obstacles.

But ofc, it's retarded to do it on your first playthrough, because you don't have any meta knowledge at this point. If you want to minmax first playthrough, you have to use guides, and if you use guides, you're not playing the game, you're just checking stuff off the list, it basically turns an rpg into a visual novel with one predetermined route.
 

Denim Destroyer

Learned
Joined
Mar 20, 2021
Messages
442
Location
Moonglow, Britannia
I know someone who insist on optimizing the games he plays. What this means is he will try to experience everything in a single playthrough, if possible, which also means he frequently plays with guides. Never seems like he enjoys the games as he treats them as something to finish instead of an experience.
 

Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
Patron
Joined
Jul 22, 2019
Messages
14,264
Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
Don't seek tips

Use your wit and intelligence to overcome obstacles.

Don't metagame

Obsessing over perfect builds can ruin the fun. Flawed builds are cool. However it turns out makes it special. Picked the wrong feat by accident or made a bad call? Don't worry, it might prove useful after all.

Don't save-scum

Obvioiusly, ruins muh immersion. Stick with what you get.

Increase difficulty

The greater the challenge, the more rewarding gameplay will be.

Be spontaneous, not completionist

Don't try to visit every location. Don't try to complete every quest. Leave something for other play-through. I'm not advocating role-playing strictly speaking. But tend to do stuff which makes sense. Clearing five dungeons in a row doesn't.

Don't binge on dialogue options (by eXalted)

Don't exhaust all conversation options if you don't find them interesting. And yes, there could be a quest hidden there, who cares?

Keep cycling savegame slots

Try to save less often. Certainly don't spam the quicksave button. Continuity of experience is key to immersion.

Live with your consequences.

Failed a skill roll? Attacked someone by accident? Jammed a chest? Try this experiment and don't reload. That liberates you from OCD and made my runs much more memorable and distinctive e.g. that time when I was caught stealing, that time when I drank the wrong potion etc.

Role playing

Obviously a subject which can be widely interpreted however just making consistent dialogue choices works.

Play it like it was meant to be played (by Wayward Son)

Sure, you COULD look up that dungeon map or use screenshots to take notes, but the game was built around the lack of easily accessible internet and/or screenshots, so this can ruin the gameplay. Ultimas are a good example of this, they were built around you taking good, concise but accurate notes or you were up Shit Creek without a paddle.

Spontaneity is king

This is where all the fun and good gaming memories stem from.








Do you have any suggestions? I wish more games would encourage such behavior.
Ah, youth
 
Joined
May 31, 2018
Messages
2,573
Location
The Present
My biggest problem these days is that I think I need to understand the game mechanically first before playing it. I am a snob when it comes to RPG systems. If the system is original or unique to the game, I need to pick it apart and see its guts before deciding if it's worth my time. I generally only have time to play maybe 2-3 RPGs a year, so it pains me if I've made gross errors. :autism:
 

Chimera

Augur
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
113
Location
A fallen nation...
luj1
I disagree with your statement in that it does not provide adequate leeway for exceptions. Anecdotally, I've played myriad games wherein certain companions were frustrating, deplorable or grotesque. I might also point to the Dragon Age: Inquisition thread, wherein the most recent posts bemoan Sera as a character that isn't even worth recruiting, much less employing due solely to her quirky ("retarded" is the most commonly used term) personality.

By way of personal examples and entirely off the top of my head...
  • Mass Effect 2 --- Jacob Taylor / Miranda Lawson
  • Dragon Quest XI --- Sylvando
  • Divinity Original Sin 2 --- Sebille Kaleran
  • Knights of the Old Republic --- Jolee Bindo
  • ELEX --- Caja
  • Persona 5 Royal --- Sumire Yoshizawa
  • Jade Empire --- Sky
The time I have spent with any of the above inevitably led to a mounting sense of annoyance and enmity.
Could you argue that such a thing constitutes an emotional bond? Certainly, but it would be facetious as this wasn't a motivating factor nor one that inspired me to reassess my perspective, merely to find the swiftest means of removing them from my party, whether by killing them outright, sidelining them permanently or simply skipping every interaction in which they were involved.

I'd also confess to having physically walked away from a few tabletop sessions over the years, spotting someone in the group whose play-style would inevitably sour the experience. Some were fond of stirring up unnecessary interpersonal drama, one was simply unhygienic to a repulsive degree and one, in particular, was an utter narcissist involved in an exceedingly toxic relationship with the DM who would accommodate not only her political rants but invariably allow her to create ludicrously imbalanced characters.

Whether for ideological or philosophical reasons, behavioral patterns, shallow characterization or just poor writing, there will always be exceptions to so strict a rule as "You will grow a bond with any character or party in time, no matter their imperfections." I'm quite certain anyone, even yourself, if pressed would acknowledge at least a few characters whose personality is in such stark contrast to your own that no amount of leniency could convince you to form a party.
 

KainenMorden

Educated
Patron
Joined
Aug 19, 2022
Messages
903
Codex Year of the Donut
one was simply unhygienic to a repulsive degree

Was this someone that just didn't bathe or what? Tim Kask has relayed stories about the persistent stereotype of war gamers/pnpers being smelly was fairly accurate in his hey day and this lead to posted signs at conventions reminding/encouraging attendees to bathe. My family members and their close friends that played Dnd in the 80s and beyond certainly didn't fit this but I have read many horror stories on the internet.
 

Chimera

Augur
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
113
Location
A fallen nation...
one was simply unhygienic to a repulsive degree
Was this someone that just didn't bathe or what? Tim Kask has relayed stories about the persistent stereotype of war gamers/pnpers being smelly was fairly accurate in his hey day and this lead to posted signs at conventions reminding/encouraging attendees to bathe. My family members and their close friends that played Dnd in the 80s and beyond certainly didn't fit this but I have read many horror stories on the internet.
Not to derail the thread, but I will briefly elaborate: the individual in question had grown up in some sort of New Age household wherein he was taught to avoid contemporary products in favor of more "natural" or "organic" methods. Consequently, rather than employ deodorant or antiperspirant of any discernible kind, he favored the use of crystals. Not so called crystal-based deodorants (potassium alum), but actual crystals that he would rub across his body. Couple that with the significant number of cats that shared his apartment and you'll grasp the essence of my earlier remark.

Mind you, this fellow was neither a simpleton nor a fool, merely so indoctrinated into a lifestyle that he saw the alternatives as abnormal. Consequently, however, he had a perpetually sour musk about him that was sufficiently pronounced to turn the stomach and dissuade you from enjoying a meal in his presence. For my part, we spoke on friendly enough terms but I wouldn't take a seat beside him voluntarily. I should, perhaps, also mention this was in a private group among friends; he was a university-mate of someone else in the group and hosted us at his place for one session. For obvious reasons, no one was inclined to request that he host again.
 

Chimera

Augur
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
113
Location
A fallen nation...
Basically every companion except Mordin in this is useless, could've named all of them (except the pandering to fans with inclusion of Garrus and Tali)

What do you have against Jolee?
I'm inclined to disagree with you regarding the companions, as some have redeeming factors though they are admittedly outweighed by the glut of pointless or pandering ones: Jacob is a chronic bore and hypocrite, with a one-dimensional arc that embraces stereotypes to a ludicrous degree; Miranda is an unduly arrogant child, obsessed with her own "perfection" yet seemingly possessed of the wit of a stump and, subjectively, the face of a cat that repeatedly ran into a glass door; Zaeed is a walking encyclopedia of tough guy tropes, though not necessarily poorly portrayed; Grunt is a simultaneous red herring and macguffin where krogan lore is concerned, but primarily a lackluster substitute for Wrex; whilst Jack amounts to little more than a girl-power and misunderstood-bad-girl fantasy who proves dramatically less useful the moment she's outside a cutscene.

Having said that, Kasumi has a sufficiently interesting backstory and motivation, particularly for a DLC addition, rendering her the most intriguing of the human characters by far; Thane is a zen archetype that divulges some interesting bits of universe-specific lore, with particular attention to hanar society, salvaging his own paltry characterization as an assassin; Legion was a unique, if fumbled attempt at contributing some personality to the otherwise bland concept of a hivemind AI nemesis; whilst Samara is, in my opinion, the ideal foil for a Renegade male Shephard and, arguably, the best asari companion in the franchise given how stark a tonal shift Liara underwent in 2 and 3.


As for Jolee: he's consistently struck me as an overt mouthpiece for the developers to wax verbose regarding the flaws inherent in a binary system such as the Force. I wouldn't label myself a Star Wars fan, quite the opposite, but I enjoy the campy antics of the KOTOR series as a dark side adherent even if their concept of maniacal or devious evil seldom ventures beyond "I killed him because I could, ahahahaha! Now, pay me..." Still, Jolee's shtick of "senile, cranky old man" is a wearisome one and I find his lecturing more condescending than insightful. The concept behind his character had merit, a demonstration of nuance in what had become a thoroughly rigid system of moral conduct, but I find the execution sorely lacking.
 
Joined
Dec 18, 2022
Messages
1,847
Location
Vareš
Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
I'm inclined to disagree with you regarding the companions, as some have redeeming factors though they are admittedly outweighed by the glut of pointless or pandering ones
I didn't say they don't have some nice qualities, I mean they're useless to the game & story as a whole. Mordin is really the only one and Miranda if you want to consider her as someone TIM mandates to be there to oversee things. Everyone else has no real, established reason for being picked up.

Having said that, Kasumi has a sufficiently interesting backstory and motivation, particularly for a DLC addition, rendering her the most intriguing of the human characters by far
Kasumi has no motivation for doing anything. She got her box that she wanted but what makes her terrible is the fact that she does not fit the setting at all. Add on her "quirky" personality that's there to appease the degens who fanboy over this game and you have one of the most disgusting companions in the series.

Thane is a zen archetype that divulges some interesting bits of universe-specific lore, with particular attention to hanar society, salvaging his own paltry characterization as an assassin
Most of Thane's screen time is there just for women to swoon over....He's okay though, a couple of interesting tidbits here and there but just mediocre overall. Everything remotely interesting is overshadowed by dramatic scenes that feel like they come out of some shit written for preteen girls.

Legion was a unique, if fumbled attempt at contributing some personality to the otherwise bland concept of a hivemind AI nemesis;
Legion is the beginning of the end of what was some of the only decent sci-fi writing in the entire trilogy in the Geth Especially when you know that higher ups essentially forced writers to make it into a Shepard fanboy for no reason other than "it's funny".

whilst Samara is, in my opinion, the ideal foil for a Renegade male Shephard and, arguably, the best asari companion in the franchise given how stark a tonal shift Liara underwent in 2 and 3.
Agreed
 
Last edited:

quaesta

Educated
Joined
Oct 27, 2022
Messages
152
I'm thoroughly disappointed that not even any of the replies here linked to this http://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Roleplaying
Only travel in good weather. If you must travel in poor weather, wear appropriate attire. Consider running to find a camp or cave to wait out the storm.
Most game's armor equipping system is so tedious that when I TRIED to do this it took too long. In real life I have bins for clothes group, in Oblivion I get a menu and some values to sort by. it takes too long for me to properly take off my armor in town/forest, and then put it on for dungeons for realism.
 

NecroLord

Dumbfuck!
Dumbfuck
Joined
Sep 6, 2022
Messages
9,652
Location
Southeastern Yurop
I drink perhaps way too much coffee when playing rpgs.
But it does make things go smoother.
 

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