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Development Info InXile consults academics to create Wasteland authenticity

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,034
What the hell?!

This is Wasteleand we are talking about here, which was built on top of Gamma World! The point is not to be realistic, it is to be as fucking absurd as you can. Even in Fallout this wouldn't fit that well, as the 50s theme was much more important than the things happening there being plausible. ..
Not about hard science fiction.
Pretty much. We want to see some crazy shit out there, not what's scientifically "possibly" possible. And the comment about Oblivion is spot-on. Nobody gives a fuck about such things in games. Not about soil erosion, not about alien languages in Mass Effect that Bio paid some linguists to develop (what a waste of money that was), not about real star data in that recently announced KS.

Considering that "paying consultants to make a realistic gameworld" was not one of the stretch goals, it would have been real nice if Fargo asked the fans if that was a good idea. You can take a man out of the mainstream business, but you can't take the mainstream business out of him.
 

Haba

Harbinger of Decline
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Codex 2012 MCA Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
I am sure they can bring nice ideas to the project, but I want something that feels like a continuation of Wasteland out of this game. While this certainly is not enough to "spell doom over the entire project", it just seems like the complete opposite direction they should travel. Heck, hiring a bunch of pre-schoolers to brainstorm science fiction ideas after watching a bunch of 70s and 80s movies seem more in line with the basic premise of Wasteland, I guess.

I dunno, my microbiologist and nuclear physicist friends have pretty dope ideas, especially if you get them drunk. In a way experience in the area can open your mind to Science! applications that you'd normally never think of. Lets way "weird" in ways that are... uncomfortable.

Though I do agree that doping up some preschool kids on LSD and writing down their hallucinations after forcing them watch some quality retro Sci-Fi would sure produce good material too.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
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Messages
28,034
Apparently, yeah. Look at Fallout 2. It was retarded when compared to Fallout 1 and while not as retarded as Fallout 3 there were fire Geckos, magicians and other shit. With scientists looking over inXile's employees shoulders such epic ideas are less likely to be implemented.
Do you have potato for brains? They didn't add that stuff to Fallout 2 because they thought it was plausible, they added because they wanted more wacky stuff in an already wacky setting.
Exactly. I don't think they added ghosts, yakuza, and gangsters with tommy guns because they thought it was scientifically plausible.
 

Captain Shrek

Guest
Though I do agree that doping up some preschool kids on LSD and writing down their hallucinations after forcing them watch some quality retro Sci-Fi would sure produce good material too.

You just found out how the Matrix Plot was conceived.
 

Kron

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Messages
642
Location
The dark throne in Algalord
This is fucking retarded. Scientists do not have the mind set to create videogames.
They think like fucking robots, and whenever these science men talk about mixing science with creativeness or art, we get some serious shit.
SERIOUS SHIT.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
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Messages
28,034
Fargo: We'll have more scienc-ey shit in the game
Codex: Wasteland 2 is ROOIND!
Fargo: another pointless bit of info about the game
Codex: sounds dumb
Apologists: Oh noes! The Codex thinks that the game is "ROOIND!"
 

Alex

Arcane
Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
8,752
Location
São Paulo - Brasil
I am sure they can bring nice ideas to the project, but I want something that feels like a continuation of Wasteland out of this game. While this certainly is not enough to "spell doom over the entire project", it just seems like the complete opposite direction they should travel. Heck, hiring a bunch of pre-schoolers to brainstorm science fiction ideas after watching a bunch of 70s and 80s movies seem more in line with the basic premise of Wasteland, I guess.

I dunno, my microbiologist and nuclear physicist friends have pretty dope ideas, especially if you get them drunk. In a way experience in the area can open your mind to Science! applications that you'd normally never think of. Lets way "weird" in ways that are... uncomfortable.

Though I do agree that doping up some preschool kids on LSD and writing down their hallucinations after forcing them watch some quality retro Sci-Fi would sure produce good material too.

You are right here, Haba. People who have worked with science can have some insights into wonderful ideas that might fit very well in this kind of science fiction. It is just that, I don't know, it seems to me that it also requires a certain humility, naivety and simplicity that sometimes experts in this or that area aren't always fond of. Now, I am not saying these guys can't do it, I am just talking in generics trying to justify my surprise at this decision.

Pretty much. We want to see some crazy shit out there, not what's scientifically "possibly" possible. And the comment about Oblivion is spot-on. Nobody gives a fuck about such things in games. Not about soil erosion, not about alien languages in Mass Effect that Bio paid some linguists to develop (what a waste of money that was), not about real star data in that recently announced KS.

Considering that "paying consultants to make a realistic gameworld" was not one of the stretch goals, it would have been real nice if Fargo asked the fans if that was a good idea. You can take a man out of the mainstream business, but you can't take the mainstream business out of him.

I do think there might be ways of making very "realistic" games that are fun to play too (well, to some people at least). But yeah, you gotta keep gameplay in focus. Soil erosion when terrain doesn't even affect your combat in any meaningful way is just a big waste.
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I think the key is this - it's not about realism, it's about authenticity.

Fargo: We'll have more scienc-ey shit in the game
Codex: Wasteland 2 is ROOIND!
Fargo: another pointless bit of info about the game
Codex: sounds dumb
Apologists: Oh noes! The Codex thinks that the game is "ROOIND!"

Vault Dweller: another passive-aggressive quip about Wasteland 2 and Brian Fargo
Codex: *snore*
 

Albers

Educated
Joined
Jan 2, 2011
Messages
172
GammaWorld_Manual_InsideCover_300px.jpg
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,034
I think the key is this - it's not about realism, it's about authenticity.

Fargo: We'll have more scienc-ey shit in the game
Codex: Wasteland 2 is ROOIND!
Fargo: another pointless bit of info about the game
Codex: sounds dumb
Apologists: Oh noes! The Codex thinks that the game is "ROOIND!"

Vault Dweller: another passive-aggressive quip about Wasteland 2 and Brian Fargo
Codex: *snore*
When I joined the party, it was already in full swing.

As for quips, I'm still waiting to hear something specific about gameplay. You know, these are the combat mechanics, this is how the crafting system is going to work, this is our quest design example, etc.

If Fargo mentioned that sci-fi consultants thing while talking about the world or quest design, nobody would have said anything. But when once again it's only news item, what reaction do you expect?
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
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Messages
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
As for quips, I'm still waiting to hear something specific about gameplay. You know, these are the combat mechanics, this is how the crafting system is going to work, this is our quest design example, etc.

If Fargo mentioned that sci-fi consultants thing while talking about the world or quest design, nobody would have said anything. But when once again it's only news item, what reaction do you expect?

Fair enough. If they're really on schedule, preproduction should be wrapping up any day now, so maybe they'll have something for us soon.
 

OSK

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Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
I'm ok with this.

A little bit of authenticity can be a good thing. For example, I'm pretty sure Bioware romances were written by people who have never experienced romance.
 
Joined
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Messages
997
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Dreams, where I'm a viking.
Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera
The expending precious resources concern seems a bit overblown. Since Thwacke appears to be a bunch of PhD students' and postdocs side gig while they get their degrees, I seriously doubt it will be much of a resource drain.

On the other hand, when money is spent on lore, there is a temptation to shoehorn it in. I can't wait for NPCs to explain how evolution amidst the unique environmental stresses of a post-apocalyptic wasteland has plausibly led various animals to become monster-ish before asking me to kill ten of them.
 

felipepepe

Codex's Heretic
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I just hope they don't turn this into a in-game "Science Codex" or something... developers need to understand that lore/science/explanation are cool things, but integrated in the game, not in a massive wall of pointless text you reach via menu; leave that for the Wiki, or the manual ("lol what manual", I know)...
 

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