Game News Jagged Alliance 2 - Reloaded Ditches Turn-Based Combat

[VentilatorOfDoom]

Tags: Jagged Alliance 2

<p>BitComposer Games, developer and publisher of this <a href="http://www.jaggedalliance.com/index.php" target="_blank">Jagged Alliance 2 remake</a>, decided that realtime combat is where it's at, <a href="http://www.4players.de/4players.php/spielinfonews/PC-CDROM/24218/2040698" target="_blank">reports 4players.de</a>.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>If you're not afraid of the horrors of a google translation: <a href="http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=de&amp;sl=de&amp;tl=en&amp;u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.4players.de%2F4players.php%2Fspielinfonews%2FPC-CDROM%2F24218%2F2040698" target="_blank">for your pleasure</a>.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Otherwise I have some human-translated parts to offer:</p>
<blockquote>
<p><span class="postbody">The turn-based strategy system will not be implemented. Tactical battles will not be fought in TB mode but in realtime - it will, however, be possible to pause at any time or to configure an automatic pause. (for instance: when a merc runs out of ammo. </span></p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p><span class="postbody">Advantages of the Plan &amp; Go-system, when compared to the original TB summarized: <br />-It is more dynamic, because it allows realtime battles <br />-It introduces timing as a gameplay element: Due to transparent and foreseeable enemy movement, it will be possible for the player to sneak dextrously past them or wait for a good opportunity for an attack. <br />-It makes it impossible to stumble into a fight while the mercs are far from the front lines. In JA2 it was very time-consuming to move all mercs to the front line, because you had to split their movement over several rounds. <br />-Battles with many enemies are faster. A turn took a long time in JA2, when many mercs and enemies were involved in a fight. <br />-The new system supports new AI features as suppression and flanking, which only work when the actions take place simultaneously - not in sequence.</span></p>
</blockquote>
<p><em>This newspost, including the translated bits, is a courtesy of Needles.</em></p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>

 

[Yeesh]

Oh dear. I expect this will make we fans of the original very, very pleased, and more so each time we consider it.

 

[thekdawg21]

Fuck That Shit

Aim a remake at the fans of the original and then fuck it all up with stupid bullshit? Eat a dick.

 

[MetalCraze]

Is that it?
JA2 - Reloaded will be shit. Now there is no doubt about it.

Squad tactical combat is impossible in real-time - as proven by oh so many real-time squad games. Because in JA2 a single turn took about 0.5 secs of real-time but how the fuck will you be able to stealth and not get caught with 6 guys (and it's possible to have up to 18 in JA2) in real-time? And that's only a single question.

-The new system supports new AI features as suppression and flanking, which only work when the actions take place simultaneously - not in sequence.

But they were in JA2 too. Not that other points are any less of a bullshit

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

Oh dear.

 

[good little toastboy]

Wow, I'm amazed how their reasons sound.

 

[puppyonastik]

FFFFFFFF-
Hopes tanked. Well, either this one takes a shit and they make JA3 turn-based after learning from their mistakes, or they dump the series.

It is more dynamic, because it allows realtime battles.

Relative bullshit. They better have something equal to or better than Men of War or Close Combat. Call me a fool, but combat in JA2 with the 1.13 mod is pretty fucking complex and evolutionary.

The new system supports new AI features as suppression and flanking, which only work when the actions take place simultaneously - not in sequence.

Excuse me?

Edit: I'm amused by how real-time with pause is now called "Plan & Go".

 

[nFn]

So whats next? an Evony style ad campaign?

 

[janjetina]

Fallout 3d FPS where you can max all stats and skills - already done
Real time Jagged Alliance 2 - in plans

and in that spirit:
Planescape Torment written by Torr Howard?
Arcanum as a linear QTE interactive movie?

Is that what future brings?

Real time Jagged Alliance 2 remake must be the most insane thing I've heard of in my gaming career. Jagged Alliance 2 IS tactical turn-based combat. What are they going to replace tactical combat with, Bioware romance between the laptop guy and Ira?

Nobody will play that piece of shit.

 

[puppyonastik]

http://www.ja-galaxy-forum.com/board/ub ... Post265365

Apparently, BC was asking what the community wanted, but went ahead and ignored it.

Full translation by Shanga:

Dear Community,

Many thanks for your many proposals and suggestions. This has obviously sparked off heated discussions that have provoked a wide range of opinions about how we could change the combat system, if we should change it and, if so, what changes would be best suited to the game.

To ensure that Jagged Alliance 2 makes a successful transition into 2011 and that the remake is as attractive as possible to players who know the Jagged Alliance series and to those who have yet to play it, we will simply make a few changes to the existing JA2 combat system. We are calling the new combat system the “Plan & Go” system. It is based more on real time, and represents a departure from the original combat system in Jagged Alliance 2. We would like to outline the significant changes below, and hope that you, the official JA2 community, will be as excited as we are about them.

Basically, the overall strategy in the combat system remains the same! The player has to identify strategically advantageous positions on the map to minimize losses to his own side as far as possible.

In the “Plan & Go” system we have omitted the “Fog of War”, which covered most of the map in JA2. Enemies positioned outside buildings are permanently visible, which enables the player to establish a strategy from the outset without having to constantly save and load. In addition, the world looks much more animated and lively as the hostile forces patrol in the meticulously detailed 3D backdrops.

The “Plan & Go” system removes the turn-based structure. If the player wants to react to an incident, he can pause the game at any time or allow the game to pause automatically by carrying out a particular activity (e.g. if a mercenary has run out of ammunition).

The real-time elements in the “Plan & Go” system also add new and exciting features such as “Timing” for example. As the enemies are patrolling all over the map, the player must time his movements very precisely to defend himself against his enemies. Here, the need to quicksave/quick load is greatly reduced, as the risks and challenges are more easily identified and the effect of the risk is reduced to a much shorter time (e.g. a character is sighted before he has reached his target, so the shooting starts earlier than anticipated).

The “Plan & Go” system also enables players to specify the conditions under which his units can attack independently; they can therefore open fire when enemies enter their range of vision. This offers players the same tactical depth in terms of decision-making, and also intensifies the combat experience, because more experienced players have to pause much less frequently and, for the most part, can let the game progress in real time. In particular, this speeds up battles with large numbers of fighters and which seemed like they would never end in the original game!

The advantages of the “Plan & Go” system opposed to the turn-based original are:

• It is dynamic, as it allows combat in real time.
• It introduces timing as a new element: it enables the player to spot and assess enemy movements, so he can either cleverly sneak past, or lie in wait and choose the right moment to attack.
• It avoids the situation where you get mixed up in a battle while your mercenaries are some distance from the front. JA2 was very time-consuming in this respect, because players had to lag behind for several turns while they moved all their mercenaries to the front.
• Combat with large numbers of enemies happen more quickly; in JA2 it took ages for the round to finish when numerous mercenaries and enemies were involved in the battle.
• The new system also allows us to incorporate new AI functions such as cutting off and flanking enemies, that only work when actions are carried out simultaneously and not one after the other.

Your bitComposer Team

 

[Multidirectional]

Fucking idiots.. Why call it a "remake" then? Term "reboot" works for marketing purposes just fine.

 

[chzr]

can someone explain this to me?

imagine you have rights to make a sequel to game with one of the best combat system ever made and what you do is ditch the combat and create a 'remake' at the same time.



mind = blown

 

[Hobo Elf]

Where do these developers get their horrible ideas from?

 

[MetalCraze]

Now consider that combat was the single most awesome thing in the game, a combat which was the main selling point of JA2, and wasn't topped by any game before or since - and they ditch it for a real-time shit with, apparently, some kind of QTE as seen in the quote above.

What. The. Fuck.

 

[bhlaab]

L.o.l.

 

[KalosKagathos]

The real-time elements in the “Plan & Go” system also add new and exciting features such as “Timing” for example.

 

[Bakemore]

can someone explain this to me?

imagine you have rights to make a sequel to game with one of the best combat system ever made and what you do is ditch the combat and create a 'remake' at the same time.



mind = blown

Because programming a turnbased combat system takes time.

 

[phanboy_iv]

Jagged Alliance 2: Not At All Like Jagged Alliance 2

 

[SerratedBiz]

It's pretty stupid that they'd make a JA2 remake and turn it into real-time, like X-Com into FPS. It's really. Really. That fucking difficult to understand what made a game good? Did they really think 'shit, it must be the natives because TB sure pisses me off'.

On the other hand I was pleasantly surpsied by 7.62 or whatever that game was called and what I can only assume is the system they're basing this pause and go stuff on. It's not bad for a tactical game, I found, but why couldn't they call it 7.62.2?

 

[CrimsonAngel]

Well that is one less game i have to buy.

 

[CrimHead]

For us, role playing games are about riding a cornugon around the lower planes killing things
--Planescape Torment 2: Electric Boogaloo developer Todd Howard

 

[Andyman Messiah]

Strategy games are dead.

 

[humorguy]

Would have preferred turn based. But pause & go is better than realtime, where all games seem to be going...So I can live with it!

Us PC gamers can't be too fussy anymore. Even though most of us still act as though we get 50 cRPG's a year when it's 1 or 2 if we're lucky, and 50 deep strategy games a year when we get 1 or 2, if we're lucky!

 

[Casus belli]

FFS. Can't believe this shit, this has actually got me quite mad. And they still have the nerve to call it a "Remake". I hope the developers die the worst deaths imaginable. Seriously. They have messed with my god, drawing stupid little dong drawings on its forehead and making it look retarded.

 

[JarlFrank]

I don't mind the no FOW too much, but fuck... RTwP? Okay it worked in 7.62, but this is supposed to be a JA2 remake. The turn based combat of JA2 was so fucking awesome, any real-time replacement just isn't going to cut it. And they're using stupid arguments, too... more dynamic, faster? Sure, turns did take a long time - but more recent TB games, like ToEE, have solved that problem, too, by making enemy animations play simultaneously.

This will be shit. They even say that those measures are taken to make it more viable to sell in 2011. If that doesn't say dumbing down, I don't know what does.