Last Epoch - time travel action-RPG

[Tacgnol]

Massive

Really? There is 10x more customisation here than D2 or D3.

Each class has three massive mastery trees and every ability in the game has it's own huge skill tree.

This is the skill tree for the summon skeleton mage ability:

The game has one of these for every SKILL in the game. There are further customisations in each character mastery tree.

Edit: Sykar explain how the game has less customisation than D2/D3 rather than hiding behind your ratings.

 

[Tacgnol]

Also I'm not sure what Peachcurl is talking about there not being any skill trees?

This is the necromancer skill tree for instance:

 

[Peachcurl]

Also I'm not sure what Peachcurl is talking about there not being any skill trees?

This is the necromancer skill tree for instance:

That's a misunderstanding. I was trying to make a clear distinction between "tree of skills" and "tree of skill modifiers". Probably not as clear as I intended.

Diablo 2 has a "tree of skills": skill selection at the root / branches of the tree affects what you can select down the line.
Last Epoch does not have that, at least not for skills. Skills are unlocked linearly based on level (and mastery class investment in your example). But, for example, getting Dread Shade does not in any way depend on whether or not you also select/invested into Summon Skeletal Mage.

 

[Tacgnol]

Also I'm not sure what Peachcurl is talking about there not being any skill trees?

This is the necromancer skill tree for instance:

That's a misunderstanding. I was trying to make a clear distinction between "tree of skills" and "tree of skill modifiers". Probably not as clear as I intended.

Diablo 2 has a "tree of skills": skill selection at the root / branches of the tree affects what you can select down the line.
Last Epoch does not have that, at least not for skills. Skills are unlocked linearly based on level (and mastery class investment in your example). But, for example, getting Dread Shade does not in any way depend on whether or not you also select/invested into Summon Skeletal Mage.

Fair enough, I probably misread what you said.

tl;dr regardless - LE has an awful lot of build customisation.

 

[Tse Tse Fly]

Are they going to make the playable characters look and move less like decrepit drug addicts? There isn't anyone on the roster whom I would want to play, all of them appear rather repulsive (not in a positive way).

 

[Tacgnol]

Are they going to make the playable characters look and move less like decrepit drug addicts? There isn't anyone on the roster whom I would want to play, all of them appear rather repulsive (not in a positive way).

Dev did say on steam forums that they'd like to have some character customisation in the future but it was low prio.

I wouldn't expect too much.

Then again they are promising art passes, so it's possible the PCs may end up looking better.

 

[covr]

Refunded. Each of the D2 skills is unique and fun. LE is bland and boring. Adding new subskill with +2 damage to the main skill is just a joke. But is the gameplay was fun I would accept this.

Last couple of years were simply terrible for arpgs/diablolikes. Wolcen, LE, Chaosbane and that WH:40k slasher were really bad.

 

[Sykar]

Massive

Really? There is 10x more customisation here than D2 or D3.

Each class has three massive mastery trees and every ability in the game has it's own huge skill tree.

This is the skill tree for the summon skeleton mage ability:

The game has one of these for every SKILL in the game. There are further customisations in each character mastery tree.

Edit: Sykar explain how the game has less customisation than D2/D3 rather than hiding behind your ratings.

Because it is not just about customization. PoE has far more customization anyway and still offers 7 skills plus bar swap. Even D3 has 6 slots at least. This is about FUN. The less skills the less fun. Ergo a game with 5 skills max is shite to me which is why D2, TQ and Grim Dawn are played to this day by me while games like D3 I have not touched in years desite trying to find a nugget of joy in it but to me a big part of the reason it is not is the tight restriction in skills I can pick for a build. It is also why I gave up on Marvel Heroes once Brevik left because the new head honcho was a fucking retard who thought that going D3 is best even though they had just worked hard for over a year to update every single of the roughly 50 older champs to catch up with the recently relesed ones. So in essence that dumbfuck forced ANOTHER revamp only to get the game closed down because players were leaving in droves because many hated the change though of course you have the usual braindead fuckwits trying to defend that travesty.
Summa summarum, games like D2, TQ, GD, MH, etc made it right, you could opt to play with few skills or a lot, your choice and that was pure .
Crap like this game or D3 castrated this kind of customization and therefore are utter .
Customization is also not as great as people make it out to be. A good chunk of skill modifiers are stuff like more damage or cost reduction. /yawn.

Lastly I don't hide behind ratings I just do not want to always spell shit out.

 

[Tacgnol]

I find builds with tons of active skills are rarely that fun to play in these ARPGs, but fair enough LE probably isn't for you. The game is balanced around choosing 5 skills which you specialise deeply into.

I disagree that the uh skill skill trees (for want of a better term) are all passive bonuses, a lot of them change skills massively. They pretty much serve the same purpose as links do in Path of Exile.

Either way, at least you responded and didn't just leave it at a rating.

 

[Sykar]

I did not say that they were ALL just a passive bonus.
Being able to CHOOSE to specialize in a few or having a broader selection is also a form of customization one in which LE is utterly shite in.

 

[Reinhardt]

5 skills is too many. 1 movement, 1 single taget, 1 aoe. everything else is just auras and long buffs. enough for me.

 

[Sykar]

Well engame PoE is perfect then for you, though you will probably be able to take out even the single target skill and just AoE derp through maps.

 

[Reinhardt]

yeah, enjoyed it but didn't touched in a few years. waiing for poe2

 

[Hobo Elf]

Are they going to make the playable characters look and move less like decrepit drug addicts? There isn't anyone on the roster whom I would want to play, all of them appear rather repulsive (not in a positive way).

No. The game's main monetization scheme will be the cash shop so anything that looks good or interesting will be sold there. Base effects and armor will be rudimentary, or total shit if what's already in the game is anything to go by.

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

Excuse me can I kill an entire screen of enemies in 0.5 seconds and then do this over and over and over again while a gay lightshow goes on every time I press a button?

This is a deal breaker.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

death to poefags

 

[I'm Big Into Anal]

5 skills is too many. 1 movement, 1 single taget, 1 aoe. everything else is just auras and long buffs. enough for me.

pretty much this; the only decline in the h8ters is in their PENIS SIZE

Spoiler

haha owned

 

[1451]

Joke's on them. In PoE of exile I enjoy creating a bucket wearing half naked dude who's smashing the creatures of darkness with an oar he found on the coast after his shipwreck.
Still a bad move for a buy to play game to have mictotransactions. It's been in early access for years and will be for another one from what it seems.
I'm not saying to pirate it but they make it a damn attractive choice with their behavior.

 

[Tacgnol]

I care more about the performance than the artwork right now.

I'm still not convinced about the wisdom of using Unity for a game that requires decent performance. Even POE with its shitty engine and coding can maintain 144 fps on non crazy juiced maps and outside of towns with all the MTX.

They've made a lot of improvements since release, but I doubt performance will ever be amazing due to Unity.

 

[Hobo Elf]

They've made good strides with the optimization imo. It used to be unplayable, now it's playable with some of my choice Primalist builds that spam a lot of thunder effects. MY main issue with LE is that the campaign is long and boring as shit because there is zero challenge to it as all the effort is being put into the rifts or whatever they were called in LE. This hyper focus on end game hamster wheel systems is the death knell of ARPGs for normal gamers as it only attracts people with gambling addictions.

 

[Peachcurl]

The campaign is too easy, that is true. But so far, I am not sure how the endgame content really will be balanced in relation to that. The next patch might give a better idea of that. Not sure it's going to end up like in PoE.

 

[Tacgnol]

They've made good strides with the optimization imo. It used to be unplayable, now it's playable with some of my choice Primalist builds that spam a lot of thunder effects. MY main issue with LE is that the campaign is long and boring as shit because there is zero challenge to it as all the effort is being put into the rifts or whatever they were called in LE. This hyper focus on end game hamster wheel systems is the death knell of ARPGs for normal gamers as it only attracts people with gambling addictions.

They're doing a big pass on earlier campaign content apparently as they get closer to 1.0. I guess it's another "wait and see" issue.

That said, I doubt the campaign will ever get as much focus as the end game content as that's the thing that gets people to stick around for long leagues/seasons (w/e you want to call them).

 

[Hobo Elf]

They've made good strides with the optimization imo. It used to be unplayable, now it's playable with some of my choice Primalist builds that spam a lot of thunder effects. MY main issue with LE is that the campaign is long and boring as shit because there is zero challenge to it as all the effort is being put into the rifts or whatever they were called in LE. This hyper focus on end game hamster wheel systems is the death knell of ARPGs for normal gamers as it only attracts people with gambling addictions.

They're doing a big pass on earlier campaign content apparently as they get closer to 1.0. I guess it's another "wait and see" issue.

That said, I doubt the campaign will ever get as much focus as the end game content as that's the thing that gets people to stick around for long leagues/seasons (w/e you want to call them).

Yep, I'm probably just gonna refund LE once it leaves EA (if it ever does). I'm just not very thrilled with the direction this game is going in. I expected more of a non-linear and fun campaign when they marketed heavily the main gimmick of the game being the different epochs, but it's a pointless and underutilized gimmick. Oh well.

 

[1451]

Can you even refund a game if you've played for longer than two hours.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Can you even refund a game if you've played for longer than two hours.

You have a grace period to refund a game on Steam after it leaves Early Access regardless of the hours you put in. That's why many scam games refuse to leave EA: they can't be refunded en masse then. I played KF2 for a lot of hours and refunded it on release because it ended up being a POS.