New Fan Interview at TES Forums

[Solik]

Apparently you move the little pointer around until the charactor smiles at you then you click.

For the record, that's what the original version was like. The one demo'd at E3. What Bethesda spoke of here (and somehow created an uproar) were the upgrades they did to it -- wedges in different sizes and disposition slowly falling, designed to make it at least a little more of a "game."

I want to play a thief, but love the minigame: Sucks to be you. Instead of getting more challenging as you go, it gets easier.

Pretty much every RPG suffers from this, sadly.

 

[GhanBuriGhan]

It would be a lot nicer if you had to guage the personality of the NPC, and then if you had decent enough stats and chose the appropriate joke, bribe, persuade, bludgeon choice it would make them more friendly towards you.

Actually.. I think the concept is fundamentally flawed. Bribery is fine, but I don't like the idea of making NPCs like you more with a single action. Imagine that in Fallout instead of the speechcraft checks. The horror.

I'm all for player speed and dexterity when it is required, but in this case it just seems needed in order to compensate for poor design. Time will tell I guess, but I'm not really convinced by this one.

So am I, although we may differ on when it IS required. As in, I don't believe it is required in an RPG.

Actually it still is just a glorified speechcraft check, only with some player input. Also don't forget that persuasion is not the only thing that influences NPC's likes or dislike - at least I assume its still like MW's system: Personality, faction standing, race, favors (quests) for the NPC, magic effects, and a number of other factors influence disposition. I agree this doesn't sound like a great way to have player input, but without player input we'd all play this: http://www.progressquest.com/

 

[bryce777]

Wow. That's going into terra incognita mainstreaming, past the RPG Lite folks and into people who'd rather be playing Freecell and Minesweeper.

Weren't you the guy who accused me of hyperbole a few days ago? Spoken like a true part of the hivemind though.

OK, so I am not crazy about this solution either, but does that make it Tetris or a game for 5 year olds? No. The disparity between highly intellignet gneral RPG discussions and mindless Oblivion bashing on this site is baffling time and time again. And most of it is on no higher level than the hyping of the TES fanboys - both is just a pain in the butt.

Tetrish would be a step up. How you can meet this with anything but laughter is beyond me, and yes I think a 5 year old would enjoy the game a lot more than an adult. No stretch there....

 

[Zomg]

Weren't you the guy who accused me of hyperbole a few days ago? Spoken like a true part of the hivemind though.

OK, so I am not crazy about this solution either, but does that make it Tetris or a game for 5 year olds? No. The disparity between highly intellignet gneral RPG discussions and mindless Oblivion bashing on this site is baffling time and time again. And most of it is on no higher level than the hyping of the TES fanboys - both is just a pain in the butt.

You wound me, sir.

How is this distinct from Tetris? Map the timer to the fall rate of the blocks, facial expression recognition to pattern recognition, and block placement to picking the correctly-sized wedge to use to increase the influence-o-meter. What's the substantive difference in this compared to having to clear five lines in Tetris to unlock the NPC's next set of dialogue options, besides the minigame getting easier as the macrogame goes on? It's not hyperbole to call it Tetris, it's a pretty decent analogy.

Can you imagine doing this the two or three hundred times it will be necessary in the game? And to take the outcome of it seriously, from a roleplaying point of view? "That argonian trader doesn't like me, I had to answer the doorbell during the persuasion game." Or, alternatively, relying on a bribe mechanic that has survived its ridiculous implementation in Morrowind into the sequel?

If not mainstreaming, then what can explain this?

Incidentally, Tetris isn't a game for five year olds, at least not exclusively. Tetris is great.

 

[Micmu]

Now imagine that clicking minigame combined with grayed-off topics (magically indicating that you can learn more about a subject if you raise NPCs disposition). The whole dialogue is practically a game for itself. Play tetris untill you make all topics white.
As for stupid "Bribe" function (which made MW's persuasion a joke) I'm 100% certain that - again - it will be possible to click "Bribe" repeatedly until you succeed in rising disposition.

 

[Reconcilliation]

Oblivion sounds more and more like Morrowind 2. Seriously, there's no vast improvements over Morrowind aside from AI and Graphics.

If you're going to make a sandbox RPG like this, you can't do everything half assed. Which by the exclusion of simple things like different character meshes/animations, is what it seems like.

 

[pantheon]

Oblivion sounds more and more like Morrowind 2. Seriously, there's no vast improvements over Morrowind aside from AI and Graphics.

One other addition is skill perks which I like - but the graphics are going to look the same as MW (with new forests and graphics card enhancements) and I agree - it is MW 2 with some bethsoft mods.

 

[Claw]

Actually it still is just a glorified speechcraft check, only with some player input. Also don't forget that persuasion is not the only thing that influences NPC's likes or dislike - at least I assume its still like MW's system: Personality, faction standing, race, favors (quests) for the NPC, magic effects, and a number of other factors influence disposition. I agree this doesn't sound like a great way to have player input, but without player input we'd all play this: http://www.progressquest.com/

I guess I didn't really voice my real complaint. The impression I got in Morrowind was that the persuasion "trick" dominates the whole system, as you can quickly and rather easily cause large changes in disposition with it, and that's just lame.

 

[D&DRULEZ]

They reposted the interview to better reflect their design choices

Take a look!

:D

 

[dongle]

Next they'll be charging for patches, I bet. So, if you don't like your character being unable to complete a quest to do RAI bug - buy a patch. If you don't - don't buy it!

Consider how free patches worked for MW. As soon as the first expansion came out the vanilla game was no longer supported. Want the latest patch? Buy the new expansion. What if this carries over to the pay-for mods? Patches may be free downloads, but will you need to buy -all- the official mods to be able to apply them?
.

 

[dongle]

Bottom line: They made a good game and then made the game playable by anybody, at the expense of others.

Either way, they've got my money.

So you're saying you're perfectly happy playing a game designed for a pre-teen intellect?

Is the persuasion mini game even a real mini game? Because, in a mini game, one would expect a challenge of some kind.

Well, you'd expect some kind of challenge in the main -game- too, they don't seem to be providing that either. So, at least they're being consistent. . . .
.

 

[Chefe]

You know, if Bethesda hates the ruskies so much for posting those screens, they shouldn't go stealing their puzzle game ideas and throwing them in their own minigames.

New comic up. With Tetris.

 

[Twinfalls]

I can't even imagine what this would be. Slapping the npc around as you talk?

Haha! That sounds a shitload more fun than the supremely idiotic minigame they've put in.

You can't even bypass the dumbassed not-even-tetris persuasion circle with a basic 'try joke' or 'try to insult' option! Playing a diplomat character means you must become a master of timed clicking onto wedges, fuck me silly, these people call themselves RPG developers.

Let alone their failure to even bother to actually write some sensible persuasion dialogue. What a bunch of lazy fuckers - their artist, GT Nunan or whatever his name is, exemplified this attitude with his lame xeroxing of someone else's concept art and steadfast refusal to admit he did it and he's just lazy.

Oh and hey stargelman, ghanburigan - it looks like your favourite game is a load of shit, kthxbye

 

[dongle]

I really get the feeling Bethesda is actively discouraging modders.

It started this summer when Mr Epic Howard stated there would be even -less- official mod support for OB then for MW. Which, in case you didn't know, approached nil. This new interview bears it out. Why withhold info on whether a 3Ds Max exporter will be released? What possible spoilers or trade secrets could they be guarding? We know they have an exporter the devs use, we know they aren't going to modify it or provide support for it for modders, why not just release it? First they say they'll release what they used to make the game with to modders, then turn about and give the "we're not ready to talk about that" line. I wanted to mod for this game, but it gets harder and harder to get excited about.

I realize I speak as a graphics-whore Max modeler, but they've thrown up plenty of obstacles to RP quest modders too. All we seem to get is arrogant replies when those concerns are voiced. A common refrain on the TES boards is "just mod it in" when anyone points out a cool feature that's missing. Don't expect that to come true kiddies.
.

 

[z3r'0']

All these threads about oblivion on the codex are starting to fuckin' annoy me. Its always the same crap rehashed over and over. I reckon the only reason it has some interest here has to be because Batshitda Softworks has the Fallout license.

Are people really thinking this will be some great RPG?
I mean the fuckin' abuse-skill-level system is fuckin' broken.
All characters max all skills. WTF!
Meta-gaming for the win ... ooh look at the pretty forest!1!1?!
NO Dialogue trees -- fuck wiki-click dialogue(TM)








*ahem* ... As you were.

 

[Section8]

I can't even imagine what this would be. Slapping the npc around as you talk?

Haha! That sounds a shitload more fun than the supremely idiotic minigame they've put in.

You can rub their belly to complement them, and slap their face to insult them. Your skill determines what happens if you touch any of their rude bits, like lizard breasts.

Off topic somewhat, here's a bit of trivia. What album do the following track names come from?:

"I killed him like a dog...and still he laughed."
"Inconsolable widows in search of distraction."
"A woman with the skin of the moon."
"A lizard with the skin of a woman."
"Fix it so the bruises don't show."
"A leper with the face of a baby girl."
"The One Armed vs 9 Killers"
"Violence^5"

You could be forgiven for thinking it's the Oblivion soundtrack.

 

[Twinfalls]

Ha! More interesting quest concepts there than you'll find in the game I bet. Dunno who it is - having noted your tastes it's probably some wacked out alt-metal band.

For wacky song titles I've always liked the terrific Guided By Voices - examples from memory: 'Tractor Rape Chain', 'Kicker of Elves' (On topic!), 'You are not an aeroplane', ' Pimple Zoo', 'Twilight Campfighter', and 'Goldheart Mountaintop Queen Directory'.

One of my majorly favourite bands, Built to Spill (a song title of whom is my avatar's name here) also served up things like 'Virginia Reel Around the Fountain' and 'Randy Described Eternity' which I also rather like.

 

[dongle]

Nothin' beats "Girlfriend in a Coma"

 

[Jason]

My indie dork sense is tingling.

Boards of Canada has some purty titles: "beware the friendly stranger", "telephasic workshop", "rue the whirl", "the smallest weird number", "turquoise hexagon sun", "i saw drones", "music is math", and the greatest album title of all time - "Music Has The Right To Children".

 

[Levski 1912]

With a few exceptions, you can be sure all the codexers will be picking their copy of Oblivion up just like us. That's what makes their banter worth while. They don't criticize because they want things to be bad, they want them to be good. They just happen to criticize in a way unfamiliar to the masses.

We don't know it yet, but apparently we're all Bethesda's little bitches and we're going to buy the game like good little sheep.

 

[VenomByte]

Can you outline some of the most important additions to scripting?

Scripting is even better this time

Trust us, It'll...

 

[Jason]

What does that have to do with song titles?

 

[obediah]

I was actually thinking about picking Oblivion up for the 360 just so I have something to play on it (and if by chance I did like it, waiting for the game + 2 expansion pack for PC which should come out right when all the good mods are flowing), but the more I read, the more morally obliged I feel to make sure Bethesda gets none of my money for this game. Just as I feel obliged to give E5 my $50 game unplayedfor trying to do so many things right, I feel I need to withold my $50/60 from Bethesda for trying to fuck things up so bad. The design is so bad, If Oblivion ends up being a good game, it will be a testament to their inability to develop a game from their vision..

I will need to borrow the disc from a friend, just so I can particpate in the "what's your excuse now?" threads where the oh so vocal fanbois get all their shit kicked back in their faces.

 

[Qarl]

I really get the feeling Bethesda is actively discouraging modders.

It started this summer when Mr Epic Howard stated there would be even -less- official mod support for OB then for MW. Which, in case you didn't know, approached nil. This new interview bears it out. Why withhold info on whether a 3Ds Max exporter will be released? What possible spoilers or trade secrets could they be guarding? We know they have an exporter the devs use, we know they aren't going to modify it or provide support for it for modders, why not just release it? First they say they'll release what they used to make the game with to modders, then turn about and give the "we're not ready to talk about that" line. I wanted to mod for this game, but it gets harder and harder to get excited about.

I realize I speak as a graphics-whore Max modeler, but they've thrown up plenty of obstacles to RP quest modders too. All we seem to get is arrogant replies when those concerns are voiced. A common refrain on the TES boards is "just mod it in" when anyone points out a cool feature that's missing. Don't expect that to come true kiddies.
.

I totally agree dongle. If they don't give us an exporter, or cripple the one they give us in some way, I'm not buying the game. The redeeming thing about MW was you could mod the fuck out of it so much so that it barely resembled the original game.

But I get this sneaking suspicion that now that they plan on making their own mods for profit, they aren't going to be too happy about a whole bunch of modders putting out stuff which will most likely be better than there's and for free.

 

[stargelman]

Oh and hey stargelman, ghanburigan - it looks like your favourite game is a load of shit, kthxbye

Why, I'm sorry you don't like TES1: Arena, but that's your prerogative