Fallout New Vegas is the best Obsidian game ever

[luj1]

KotOR was obviously the best. Outer Worlds was obviously the worst. Not sure how anyone can claim otherwise.

Best to worst:

KotOR II > NwN 2 > Alpha Protocol > New Vegas > PoE I-II > Outer Worlds

Coincidentally this is the same order in which they were released.

 

[Butter]

Except KotOR2 is irredeemable shit.

 

[Wunderbar]

FNV > AP > KotOR 2 > NwN2 > PoE 1-2 > TOW

 

[Curious_Tongue]

I'll defend the visuals and physical world design of Fallout 3. Plus the sound design and soundtrack. But the amateur writing drags the entire game into the shit category.

You claim disagreement and then write the same thing I did, just in a different way.

Visuals and sound don't make a great RPG.

 

[Ol' Willy]

Instant travel aka magickal teleportation is one of the hereditary diseases that ended up in New Vegas because of the mangled abortion of the engine provided by Shittesda. This, actually, completely removes the point of choosing the hardcore mode - when your supplies are running low there is nothing to stop you from teleporting to any city and stocking up. My take on this problem is:

- gameworld should be bigger. By bigger I mean not more content, but exactly more empty space - more deserts, canyons, roads, etc. Settlements should be farther away from each other.
- to spice things up, game needs more random encounters - aka Fallout 2.

To counter the trudging problem:

- global map quick travel, like in Fallout 2. It still takes time, it takes resources, not completely safe (see random encounters).

Or:

- focking vehicles! First several settlements should be quite close to each other, within the walking distance. There, you will be provided with the opportunity to get yourself a working vehicle to travel faster and farther. It's still possible in GameAbortion engine, proved by countless mods that add working vehicles. The ability to get yourself a bike would be a killer.

 

[Wunderbar]

To counter the trudging problem:

- global map quick travel, like in Fallout 2. It still takes time, it takes resources, not completely safe (see random encounters).

Or:

- focking vehicles! First several settlements should be quite close to each other, within the walking distance. There, you will be provided with the opportunity to get yourself a working vehicle to travel faster and farther. It's still possible in GameAbortion engine, proved by countless mods that add working vehicles. The ability to get yourself a bike would be a killer.

a better solution would be having an in-universe fast travel - an option to join trading caravans to get from one settlement to another, radio-calling NCR to pick you up, etc.

 

[Ol' Willy]

a better solution would be having an in-universe fast travel - an option to join trading caravans to get from one settlement to another, radio-calling NCR to pick you up, etc.

Add that to my second proposal and it won't get any worse, only better. New Vegas has monorail, caravans, now let's imagine NCR using vehicles which you can hop in, etc.

This opens up a lot of possibilities. Imagine the quest where you are poisoned, robbed and dropped in the middle of the desert to die: you have to get back to the nearest settlement with limited supplies and then find your wrongdoers.

 

[Wunderbar]

Now that Starfield has a vehicle system (it'd be foolish not to add vehicles into a space game with multiple landable planets), Bethesda can add them into Fo5 too.

 

[luj1]

I'll defend the visuals and physical world design of Fallout 3. Plus the sound design and soundtrack. But the amateur writing drags the entire game into the shit category.

You claim disagreement and then write the same thing I did, just in a different way.

Visuals and sound don't make a great RPG.

They can, look at Fallout. Or Morrowind or Arcanum. Anyway neither NV nor FO3 have good visual or sound design. Look at Stalker for how its done.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

Or Morrowind

Morrowind had four novels worth of in-game text. The writing gave depth to the world.

 

[luj1]

Well not just text, but also world-building, visual and audio design. They all gave depth. Ever heard the howl of a Silt Strider deep in the mist? Or the nicotine voice of Ordinators? They accomplished so much with so little.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

Well not just text, but also world-building, visual and audio design. Ever heard the howl of a Silt Strider deep in the mist? They accomplished so much with so little.

Without the writing it's just a walking simulator.
Fallout 3 is a good walking simulator, it's not a good RPG.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

NV nor FO3 have good visual or sound design.

New Vegas wasn't meant to be a "look at the scenery!" type game.

 

[Gordian Nutt]

And yet nobody walks across Arcanum ignoring the fast travel. Because that would be ridiculous.

I agree but that is a design problem - if there is nothing interesting to find and no point to exploring it is a wasted design effort

When making a game world you can freely traverse there should be a point to exploring it and fun things and locales to find otherwise it is empty desert

My point was F1 and F2 had a world map but I do not think that was what the developers wanted

Arcanum has the opposite problem - the developers made a walkable map that players had no reason to want to explore if that makes sense

 

[Gordian Nutt]

New Vegas wasn't meant to be a "look at the scenery!" type game.

I think there is value in making locales like this

I think the DLCs made an attempt but often it was poor - the first shot of the Divide in DLC4 is kind of underwhelming for example

While I fear to bring up Playstation titles, there are moments in most Playstation games (God of War, Horizon, Spider Man) where I would be very surprised if the players do not pause and look at the scenery - I admit I do

 

[Sigourn]

While I fear to bring up Playstation titles, there are moments in most Playstation games (God of War, Horizon, Spider Man) where I would be very surprised if the players do not pause and look at the scenery - I admit I do

Don't be afraid to be right. Any dev worth their salt that puts some effort into the scenery is a dev that expects players to appreciate it. No need to even mention PS4 games. This is something seen even in the original PlayStation, which had some gorgeous scenery. Vagrant Story is a visual masterpiece, it's hard to believe as a 3D game it looks better than Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas. It also goes to show voice acting is overrated when it's a "requirement" instead of something the devs felt imade the experience better (like it did in the Legacy of Kain series).

 

[Poseidon00]

Don't be afraid to be right. Any dev worth their salt that puts some effort into the scenery is a dev that expects players to appreciate it. No need to even mention PS4 games. This is something seen even in the original PlayStation, which had some gorgeous scenery. Vagrant Story is a visual masterpiece, it's hard to believe as a 3D game it looks better than Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas. It also goes to show voice acting is overrated when it's a "requirement" instead of something the devs felt imade the experience better (like it did in the Legacy of Kain series).

i would say Legend of Mana is an example of a great looking PS1 game. It has a unique art style that gives every screen loads of personality.

 

[DalekFlay]

Visuals and sound don't make a great RPG.

No idea what this has to do with anything, and I certainly never said Fallout 3 was a good RPG. FFS.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

No idea what this has to do with anything, and I certainly never said Fallout 3 was a good RPG. FFS.

It was developed and marketed as one.

 

[Gordian Nutt]

It was developed and marketed as one.

Unless I am misunderstnding, I don't see how F3 being marketed as a good RPG is Dalek Flay's fault.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

It was developed and marketed as one.

Unless I am misunderstnding, I don't see how F3 being marketed as a good RPG is Dalek Flay's fault.

He can't see the major differences between Fallout 3 and New Vegas. He doesn't understand why Fallout 3 is considered a bad game and New Vegas is considered good game.

 

[Flying Dutchman]

He can't see the major differences between Fallout 3 and New Vegas. He doesn't understand why Fallout 3 is considered a bad game and New Vegas is considered good game.

Death is too good for him.

 

[purupuru]

Instant travel aka magickal teleportation is one of the hereditary diseases that ended up in New Vegas because of the mangled abortion of the engine provided by Shittesda.

It's not an engine problem, if they wanted to go no fast travel they could totally just copy Morrowind and add varieties of in-universe transportation, even mark/recall could make sense with all those big MT super-tech, they just didn't feel like doing it. Or they could just turn off fast travel in hardcore mode, fallout 4 did that in survival mode without any in-universe transportation and it's actually not a big problem.

 

[Sigourn]

Unless I am misunderstnding, I don't see how F3 being marketed as a good RPG is Dalek Flay's fault.

He can't see the major differences between Fallout 3 and New Vegas. He doesn't understand why Fallout 3 is considered a bad game and New Vegas is considered good game.

There's a reason why people tend to love one and think less of the other, and this applies to both games. They are not really the same deal. It's more along the lines if the differences between both games are enough to justify loving one and disliking the other. And honestly, given that the gameplay is pretty much the same in two, and that New Vegas' writing is far from being great, I can definitely see why someone wouldn't think much of either.

 

[gruntar]

Are we going to ignore that New Vegas' mechanics boil down to "go around and kill stuff in bad combat, or talk to NPCs and pass pathetically easy skill checks"? It's hard to imagine someone loving New Vegas because of the gameplay and not because of the writing. Meanwhile, Fallout 3 placed a lot more emphasis on combat scenarios to elevate it beyond its awful mechanics (case in point, there are very few locations in New Vegas that lends themselves to fun combat situations).

F:NV greatly improved combat compared to Falout 3. It not only plays better thanks to gameplay improvements like iron sights and DT/DR armor system, it's also much deadlier. VATS was nerfed from godmode 90% damage reduction when you could fire fatman at your feet and survive to just 50% reduction. There is little of level scaling, deathclaws and cazadores north of Goodsprings caused endless butthurt of bethestards used to gameworld scaling around their characters. Vast amounts of weapons you can build your character around thanks to perk system that is interesting for a change.