Grand Strategy Noob plays Dominions 5

[Trash Player]

Very likely rainbow. Any worthwhile incarnate bless wouldn't suffer casualties against PD.

 

[Galdred]

He took a very light bless:
I suspect he went with something like that

Spoiler

I have obliterated his second army (out of 3 or so) while he was sieging me:

Spoiler

I probably sent too many, but I managed to get the Helhirdings not killed this time!

Here are the defenders of the fortress in Ubar:

Spoiler

It is not much, but probably enough to avoid storming with 4 vanjarls (moonblades) + 5 Helhirdings...
I think I'd rather wait one turn for Air elementals.

 

[Malakal]

How is this not a heavy bless? Its heavy AND bad.

 

[AgentFransis]

What's your kit and script on the Helkarls?

 

[Galdred]

The helkarls were just spamming D2D with no gear (I had them gear up to fight jinns before, but I have transferred everything to vanjarls).

3 vanjarls were heavily thugged as in the last battle.
Stinger, vine or charcoal shield, weightless scale mail or chainmail of displacement, dragon helmet, burning pearl, and amulet of resilience or girdle of might.
They would have been to rout the army by themselves, but probably not to kill the mage.

The other spammed lightning bolts.

His scales are really disgusting so I need to siege his 3 forts now to halt all recruitment, even though my siege stack is not done in Ubar, or take eveyrthing else?

If I were to just siege each with 4 Vanjarls equiped with a few gems (5 slaves for sabbath/recuperiation + 6 Air gems for Elems), to get Air elementals, what would be his most probable counter?

 

[Infinitum]

Helkarls are wasted casting d2d on skeleton horsemen; it's a unresistable damage spell you want to counter buffed elite undead (ie wights) and thugs you don't want to or can't counterthug otherwise. 160 gold for a D1 incurring 5 extra fatigue per cast (because of its armor) to kill a total of what, 10 horsemen before it fatigues out (if it hits, is in range and the spellcasting AI doesn't stroke out) is not efficient. Likewise for lightning bolts and evocations in general. Unless you're specifically need to counter something not lightning resistant you get a much better damage dealt/fatigue ratio by either summoning elementals or buffing and thugging.

 

[Galdred]

I was one turn away from Conjuration 5, and had geared as many guys as I could.
But I suppose my kits are too expensive(25 to 30 gems per kit, after hammer discount).
Should I just slap a weapon + warrior ring (I use these kits to raid, but not to fight large battles) on as many Vanjarls as possible?

 

[Johannes]

Using Helkarls to DtD horsemen isn't that bad. Maybe not the most efficient thing ever, but how do you even measure that? Killing 10 horsemen can be framed as doing 4-5 gems worth of damage, is that really less valuable than sitting in the lab to get a few research points? Or compared to fighting on the frontline, definitely you won't kill the same amount of troops fighting unkitted, though you would be helping the other melee fighters take less hits(but killing the enemy can also help with that).

But most of all you care about winning battles - if it takes a few gems or mage turns more, winning a battle of that size, even in an arguably inefficient way, is way better than the risk of losing it.

 

[Infinitum]

Risk. I'm all for overkill, but it isn't like kitted jarls or helhirdings would struggle killing the extra skellies assuming a somewhat fatigue neutral bless though, and Helkarls wouldn't stop anything Ermor could've brought to win that battle. Inefficient mages is what pads out those awful wipeout battles everyone gets once something unexpected shows up. Granted not very likely that a mass mindburn play or similar would show up in this case but still.

 

[Galdred]

Risk. I'm all for overkill, but it isn't like kitted jarls or helhirdings would struggle killing the extra skellies assuming a somewhat fatigue neutral bless though, and Helkarls wouldn't stop anything Ermor could've brought to win that battle. Inefficient mages is what pads out those awful wipeout battles everyone gets once something unexpected shows up. Granted not very likely that a mass mindburn play or similar would show up in this case but still.

Regarding mindburns, the most efficient way to avoid it would be to bring chaff with lower MR to eat them, correct?
But what kind of chaff would do the trick without tying en masse to Hastati?
I find militia, and corpse constructs struggling with the latter part (maybe because I don't use enough of them?).
Heavy Infantry seems more promising actually.
I found Air elementals to be relatively disappointing so far. They inflict large casualties, but usually fail to rout the enemy before my own troops rout (probably still because I use too low quality chaff).

What would be the good number of Air elementals to deploy against a group of 100 hastati + 30 Equites of the sacred shroud?

 

[Trash Player]

Mindless are immune to most S Thau, so quite a few options are out, like corpse constructs.
At Conj 5, you do have some options but those are costly in gems or mage turns. I would pick the wyverns.
They are disciplined, have decent MR, and can fly. They are summonable by jarls but quite mage turn intensive.
Indie infantries are probably still better if you can get good numbers of them.

 

[Galdred]

Mindless are immune to most S Thau, so quite a few options are out, like corpse constructs.
At Conj 5, you do have some options but those are costly in gems or mage turns. I would pick the wyverns.
They are disciplined, have decent MR, and can fly. They are summonable by jarls but quite mage turn intensive.
Indie infantries are probably still better if you can get good numbers of them.

Mindless are immune to most S Thau, so quite a few options are out, like corpse constructs.
At Conj 5, you do have some options but those are costly in gems or mage turns. I would pick the wyverns.
They are disciplined, have decent MR, and can fly. They are summonable by jarls but quite mage turn intensive.
Indie infantries are probably still better if you can get good numbers of them.

Which indie infantry are good?
Other than light infantry/militia, I have acess to cavemen, Cynocephalians, lizards(fort), heavy infantry(fort), heavy cavalry, barbarians and a few tribes (wolf, horse, bear, deer)

 

[Johannes]

Risk. I'm all for overkill, but it isn't like kitted jarls or helhirdings would struggle killing the extra skellies assuming a somewhat fatigue neutral bless though, and Helkarls wouldn't stop anything Ermor could've brought to win that battle. Inefficient mages is what pads out those awful wipeout battles everyone gets once something unexpected shows up. Granted not very likely that a mass mindburn play or similar would show up in this case but still.

There's a lot of things Ermor could bring to that fight (maybe not in reality of the specific game but in the abstract) that the helkarls could save the day against. More skelespam being the obvious, or any kind of damage spell setup too, where killing the longdead horsemen asap would help finish the battle asap so limiting the amount of time you're taking damage. And casting DtD is generally a faster way to kill skeletons than thugging. The Helkarls did as many kills per head as the jarls, even if they hit the skeletons and not the equites.

Already here, how did the one vanjarl die? If the battle had went on for longer, would more of them have went down? If more of the longdead horsemen had gotten to use their lances instead of being crushed by spells.

 

[Trash Player]

Which indie infantry are good?
Other than light infantry/militia, I have acess to cavemen, Cynocephalians, lizards(fort), heavy infantry(fort), heavy cavalry, barbarians and a few tribes (wolf, horse, bear, deer)

Volume and timing, imho. Ideally the heavy infantries or anything decently armored are best but if you have spare gold, may as well recruit anything that are disciplined. Remember to recruit indie commander in unforted provinces to ferry troops.
Btw, Antimagic is available from not just lizard shaman but also the Cynocephalian ones, just 1 out of 3 though.

 

[Infinitum]

Which indie infantry are good?
Other than light infantry/militia, I have acess to cavemen, Cynocephalians, lizards(fort), heavy infantry(fort), heavy cavalry, barbarians and a few tribes (wolf, horse, bear, deer)

Good is such a relative word. Just go for the cheapest possible. Preferrably recruited close to where you want to use it, no sense slowing down your elite horsemen and costing upkeep. Halfling Militia would be ideal since they stealth and are cheap as sin, and I guess Wolves could do in a pinch ifyou're rolling in nature gems (undisciplined pretty much guarantees them being a one of though, and it's not as if upkeep matters that much). Mercenaries if you can get them on the cheap (people ten to gorget about them). Mind the relative HP of chaff/actual warriors and make sure not to mix squads to avoid HP routs and whatnot.

 

[Galdred]

Ermor wailing winded me first...
I should be able to do the same next turn, but how can I make my guys not rout first?
Earth quaking the caster could work.
Which units are immune?

 

[Infinitum]

Does he have mindburn support? If not, feel free to tart up a scout with 4 cheap/useless items on a retreat script and run it into his stack repatedly to burn gems. You could try something like Growing Fury + Bloodletting, but WW is a big reason why freespawn nations eclipse elite sacred nations lategame. Or just ignore the stack and raid all his stuff.

Floating/flying untis ignore EQ (unless the battle takes place in a cavern, in which case it hits everything due to rockfalls). It does combo with mass flight. It's defense saves, so Vans generally don't care overmuch either way.

 

[Galdred]

He uses most of his casters in the communion to get wailing winds out.
I will get wailing winds next turn, but his hero had inspirational 2(5 with items).
Is there a reliable way to not rout first (berserk commander)?

 

[Malakal]

Your commanders should be mostly safe though, dragon helmet plus already high morale. The real problem are troops but you can either stack morale items on a good commander or use undead and summons.

 

[Johannes]

Which indie infantry are good?
Other than light infantry/militia, I have acess to cavemen, Cynocephalians, lizards(fort), heavy infantry(fort), heavy cavalry, barbarians and a few tribes (wolf, horse, bear, deer)

Good is such a relative word. Just go for the cheapest possible. Preferrably recruited close to where you want to use it, no sense slowing down your elite horsemen and costing upkeep. Halfling Militia would be ideal since they stealth and are cheap as sin, and I guess Wolves could do in a pinch ifyou're rolling in nature gems (undisciplined pretty much guarantees them being a one of though, and it's not as if upkeep matters that much). Mercenaries if you can get them on the cheap (people ten to gorget about them). Mind the relative HP of chaff/actual warriors and make sure not to mix squads to avoid HP routs and whatnot.

Hoburg militias for doing what? They're cheap and stealthy but that doesnt really matter when they cant do anything useful.

 

[Infinitum]

I was going to say dying, but now that I think of it I'm not sure they even have the hp density to eat scripted evocations. Hmm.

 

[Johannes]

They have the same hp per square as 10hp humans, but die to evocations much faster due to lower individual hp and the same AoE spell hitting twice as many guys when it hits.

 

[Galdred]

I have made peace with Ermor to vulture in peace, and secure a T3 throne before someone else did.
Now, the game has reached the endgame stage. What are my best research options to wrap it up (I need 4 more throne points out of 8, so I need to secure them and claim them very fast before I get ganged up)?
I am at Ench 7, Const 7, Conj 6 and Evo 6 (other are at 2-4).
I was thinking on switching to Blood for 3 red seconds, Vampire Lords, and good rank and file summons (my Helhirdings are too few in number by now, and I don't really have good all around troops to replace them) or alteration might work too (for wizard tower, iron walls, crumble, and the mass buffing troops).
I could also make a detour to Ench 8 for lich (and dragon master to get a jade sorceress mass produce ice drakes? )

 

[Trash Player]

Just curious, what is the turn count? That is some serious research, even with a pretender designed around that.
My five-cents: you have a very good chance of throne rushing without any serious resistance.
Players who are out of the contending circuit might just get it over with and the contenders not necessarily have the right tools.
Are the thrones close? How many do you need?

 

[Galdred]

Just curious, what is the turn count? That is some serious research, even with a pretender designed around that.
My five-cents: you have a very good chance of throne rushing without any serious resistance.
Players who are out of the contending circuit might just get it over with and the contenders not necessarily have the right tools.
Are the thrones close? How many do you need?

It is turn 53. I am churning out 4 lanterns/turn.
I need 4 points of thrones, and I have 2 on my borders (worth 3 points together), and 2 2 provinces away. But only 2 commanders able to claim there.
Can I put an amulet of the fish on a bishop priest, or is he forced to stay in the water?
1 of the throne owners is not NAPed with me, and both other are. I hate having to give a 3 turns warning, but I suppose it has to be expected...
I'll try to incite 2 of the remaining players to kill each other to buy some time.