Game News Oblivion article in PC Gamer

[Vault Dweller]

So, Seven and Patrick are idiots? What makes you so smart? I looked at your posts and, frankly, I don't see any positions, opinions, arguments, any traces of individuality and personality. That's actually sad and pathetic.

 

[Seven]

Not really. The audience that adore your shitty jokes are idiots like seven and patty patrick. If that's an accomplishment in your eyes, then all the power to you.

Lets take a stroll down memory lane:

lololololo

This game sounds very cool.

Hey, you're a fucking idiot.

LOLSA I R LAMAMA ODD I R FUNNY FUCK SHIT BITCH LOSLASALSLAOMG

Quit whining about other people whining.

So I take it, it won't be a present day rpg?

These are all of your posts taken in their entirety (except the one from gearhead where you paused to post coherantly because you needed help, and your posts made in this thread). From this body of evidence I can see where you can take a previleged position of legitimacy whereby you can pass judgements on others. I think the post where you said "lololololo" really crystalizes the superiority of your intellect and the quality of your posts. I should also point out that this "sample" represents about 50% of your post count; it's quite obvious that your intellect will continue to outshine us all, so long as you keep this up that is.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Yeah, I agree. "lololololo" was one of his best posts. It's an incredibly consistent and thought-provoking message. Does it consist from "lol"s or just "lo"s? What does the last "o" represent? Did the author's short attention spin run out before he had a chance to finish his post? We'd never know....

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Classic Codex right there, people. Long live the Codex!

 

[wolfen]

so dialogue will be kept as it is in morrowind?
no direct dialogue, just "subjects".
I didn't liked that way it is... it just feels kinda of out of character.

 

[Elwro]

so dialogue will be kept as it is in morrowind?

What? :shock: Really? Is that written in the preview in PC Gamer? That would be a shame. If there's one feature in Morrowind worse than its combat, it's its dialogue system.

 

[MrSmileyFaceDude]

The dialogue system is different from Morrowind's. Designers have a lot more control over what gets said & when, by whom, and under what conditions. Also, many generic topics like "Latest Rumors" are handled in a totally different way (you'll overhear townspeople talking about them).

 

[Seven]

So I get to play an eves dropper?

All kidding aside, this sounds different and new. The question is: what if I don't hear the gossip correctly how will I be able to clarify info, or how will I even know that I need clarification. So how do you intend to tackle these issues?

 

[Ortchel]

Yep. All of the same races as in Morrowind will be playable in Oblivion. Orcs, Khajiit, and Argonians included.

/dance

 

[Fresh]

The dialogue system is different from Morrowind's. Designers have a lot more control over what gets said & when, by whom, and under what conditions. Also, many generic topics like "Latest Rumors" are handled in a totally different way (you'll overhear townspeople talking about them).

Sounds promising. Thx for the info.

Another thing: will there be _significant_ advantages dialogue-wise in playing a very cerebral/charasmatic character? Ie can u be a smoothtalker bluffing, charming your way into getting things done?

 

[Jaesun]

The dialogue system is different from Morrowind's. Designers have a lot more control over what gets said & when, by whom, and under what conditions. Also, many generic topics like "Latest Rumors" are handled in a totally different way (you'll overhear townspeople talking about them).

Good to hear. Sound like you guys have addressed Dialogue and Combat for Oblivion. My only 2 gripes with Morrowind.

 

[Fresh]

...Another question for Bethesda:

Have you considered adding "random encounters" a la Fallout? With perhaps sum exclusive items, special npcs, fun references, etc.

 

[wolfen]

The dialogue system is different from Morrowind's. Designers have a lot more control over what gets said & when, by whom, and under what conditions. Also, many generic topics like "Latest Rumors" are handled in a totally different way (you'll overhear townspeople talking about them).

Ok, so if I understood clearly, the topic list on the right corner will stay.
The dialogue will animate the npc, such as he will talk with you with his voice and facial expressions?
Will you get dialogue options that do not match with topics, such as:
- "I'll do it."
- "I'll do it. For a price."
- "I have no interest to help a dumb orc like you."
- "I'm more interested in putting your ass out of misery, orc."

or still will be simple topics?

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

The dialogue system is different from Morrowind's. Designers have a lot more control over what gets said & when, by whom, and under what conditions. Also, many generic topics like "Latest Rumors" are handled in a totally different way (you'll overhear townspeople talking about them).

I didn't see the two words I wanted to see. Those two words are.. DIALOGUE TREES.

 

[Whipporowill]

The dialogue system is different from Morrowind's. Designers have a lot more control over what gets said & when, by whom, and under what conditions. Also, many generic topics like "Latest Rumors" are handled in a totally different way (you'll overhear townspeople talking about them).

I didn't see the two words I wanted to see. Those two words are.. DIALOGUE TREES.

Well, according to said article there will be "magic trees"... oooo.

 

[Elwro]

[I didn't see the two words I wanted to see. Those two words are.. DIALOGUE TREES.

I second that. It troubles me that makers of both Oblivion and The Witcher evade the issue.

 

[Brillo]

I didn't see the two words I wanted to see. Those two words are.. DIALOGUE TREES.

I wish the companies doing this would just go ahead and say start calling them monologues instead of dialogue. If the player isn't actually gonna respond and have some input on the flow of the conversation there isn't any actual dialogue. The NPC's might as well be some notes found lying around a building.

 

[Fresh]

:!: :!:
On the topic of DIALOGUE..

Heres two 2 posts from the ES Oblivion Forum who gives a different perspective of em dialogue trees, kinda interesting if u ask me. But then again, I LIKE different angles on any subject. Links:

"I'm also fond of the dialogue system in MW. The dialogue I make is never shown, only the responses, and thus it gives an extra RPG aspect as I have to make my own dialogue in my head. Many games that uses dialogue trees are limited to only a few choices, while in TES it's really endless as long the player have a decent amount of imagination."
http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/inde ... t&p=468224

"They didn't so much need to be told where the cave was as what they were "supposed" to do next--and what their motivation for doing it might be. Their idea of choice was selecting the option from a dialogue tree that best matched their character, not the wide-ranging freedom of TES."
http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/inde ... t&p=262984

Any1 care to comment?

 

[Balor]

I've posted this already in other thread, but I'll repeat:
The dialog system even of Morrowind DOES allow dialog trees, even with more then complicated dialog options and it's requirements and effects. (I'd say, not much worse then in NWN). SC does allow it, with right work and scripting... point is, NO ONE bothered to use it. It's very... pecular job, it require specific talents - writer's talent, for instance. And since MW was positioned like H&S Acton-RPG for caual RPG-gamer crowd mostly, no one tried or cared. This simple. So, the point is not in game engine - but in the will of devs to make the game real RPG, not some H&S on Daggerfall license. So far things looks promising... if not overmuch. I'd not keep my expectation high... just in case. Be pessimistic about everything - and all your surprises will be pleasant ones .

 

[Brillo]

I've posted this already in other thread, but I'll repeat:
The dialog system even of Morrowind DOES allow dialog trees, even with more then complicated dialog options and it's requirements and effects. (I'd say, not much worse then in NWN). SC does allow it, with right work and scripting... point is, NO ONE bothered to use it.

It's more than just that. The system and how Bethesda used it are on in the same. Sure you can set up dialogue trees in the CS, but it's a massive pain in the ass (leaving aside the writing talent and effort it takes) because of how morrowind's dialogue is handled. They've said the CS is only what they need to make the game, not everything that modders want, and so if we're gonna see the same style of dialogue (with no trees), the system is most likely going to be one designed to handle that, not one that makes setting up dialogue trees easy.

But I guess I'm still hopefull the dialogue system (both in game and the way it's set up in the CS) is better than in Morrowind at least. At least it's sounding like there's a better system for connecting all the dialogue/quests/scripting this time.

 

[Balor]

Yea, I agree. The fact that ti's possible doesn't mean that it's not a pain in the arse. However, even if they'll make it really easy, I doubt that there would be a lot of mods with quiality dialogs - not much more the it's now, if any, since many a developer failed to deliver quality plot/dialogs/roleplay, even when promising those... and it's rather naive to believe that, once there are handy tools for making dialogs, all of a sudden a lot of people will appear and start to write a lot of good, role-player's mods involving dialogs as sophisticated as in P:T. Well, SOME - perhaps, like Elegia and Excrucio Eternum mods author... those were SO kickass that I'd rank them along with P:T and Fallout (but, of cource, they are way too short ).
So, w/o organized (and, preferably, payed ) effort - there will be no quality dialogs, plot and stuff. *sighs* Captitalism has it's downfalls, as you see, and people are just way too unready for communism . (Only OS community, and that is not w/o it's underwater stones).

 

[Stark]

Yep. All of the same races as in Morrowind will be playable in Oblivion. Orcs, Khajiit, and Argonians included.

/dance

Hmm... Octchel you're planning a mod involving orcs right?

does playing a Khajit or a Orc yield radically different gameplay in MW? Other than NPC starting disposition (which is a linear bar in MW, open for exploitation) i didn't notice any other significant gameplay differences.

 

[wolfen]

I agree totally with Balor.

as for races,I really wanted dwarves, but I doubt they will exist, since they are always (with some exceptions, like arcanum) the race put in background.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Any1 care to comment?

I think what they're trying to say is that because they went over budget on engine programmers, no writing talent could be hired.

 

[MrSmileyFaceDude]

Any1 care to comment?

I think what they're trying to say is that because they went over budget on engine programmers, no writing talent could be hired.

I think our designers did a much better job with Tribunal and Bloodmoon, personally. And for Oblivion we have a couple folks back who worked on Daggerfall, as well as a guy who worked on Thief 2. We have a really sharp group.

As far as Dwarves go, in TES lore they're really another race of elves called Dwemer. Giants who encountered them long ago called them dwarves because of their comparatively diminutive stature, and the name stuck. Unfortunately, some long period of time before the Elder Scrolls games take place, "something" happened and the Dwemer all disappeared. I suppose a future game could go all KOTOR and explore that ancient time, or maybe they'll stage a triumphant comeback. Who knows.

Stark, the main differences between all the races & genders within each race centered around different starting values for attributes and skills, different abilities and powers (Argonians got a water breathing power, Khajiit got a night eye ability, etc.) I imagine it'll be similar for races in Oblivion. Disposition is calculated in a very different manner in Oblivion, and every character has a disposition towards every other character. Also the way you persuade, taunt, intimidate, etc. to modify an NPC's disposition towards you is TOTALLY different. So hopefully it'll be less exploitable.