Game News Obsidian hired Sam Fisher's little brother

[Azrael the cat]

meh

Meh, as much I genuinely would love a new old-school RPG, frankly I'm not too bothered if this isn't it. When I heard 'spy-RPG' I didn't go 'oohh PS:T or Fallout' - I went 'oohh Deus Ex'. Obsidian don't seem to be the type of company that wants to confine themselves to one genre, and good on them for that. If they want to make a shooter-rpg then great - Deus Ex is one of my favourite games of all time, and I'd love to see them give a good go at it. You can't shit on a company for not doing the genre you want them to - there is a BIG difference between saying (a) I wish that there were more companies doing old-school isometric rpgs and saying (b) I want THIS particular company to ONLY make old-school isometric rpgs. Amongst other things (b) probably condemns said company to bankruptcy in todays brain-deficient market.

Obsidian needs to make money: they need to make money to pay their investors, pay their staff and fund new projects. In their position they are even MORE tied to having to get a profit than companies like Bethesda - one false move and they're out Troika-style. Now of course that is why we need small indie projects that can be done for the love of it, as they aren't hindered by that. But frankly Obsidian needs to pay its biils, you can't expect them not to go for safe projects, unless maybe they have a couple of megahits to bankroll them. But that's not specific to them, it's just the product of a publisher-dominated market.

Having said that, within the action-rpg and FPS-rpg model some games are clearly better than others, and some are...gasp...'good'. E.g. the Witcher. Frankly I'd also say eg Bioshock - yes I know it isn't a tenth of what the gaming sites hyped it, yes it was probably the most overhyped game after Oblivion and Mass Effect, but if you never read gaming reviews and just found it lying on an unlabelled CD never having heard of it first, you'd end up saying it was a good FPS, and, well, a good GAME.

Frankly I think the comments about all the screenshots having a gun in them etc are simply a case of genre-error. I spent pretty much the entirety of Deus Ex running around in a gun in my hand. Same with System Shock 2 - I'm not even sure SS2 gave me the OPTION of not having a weapon out! So I'm still pretty positive about this game - a FPS-RPG along the lines of Deus Ex would suit a spy game really well, and frankly if it is James Bond style spy stuff then it suits a Deus Ex style game much better than a true RPG. And on what I've seen so far I'm looking forward to it.

 

[Maia]

Re: meh

there is a BIG difference between saying (a) I wish that there were more companies doing old-school isometric rpgs and saying (b) I want THIS particular company to ONLY make old-school isometric rpgs. Amongst other things (b) probably condemns said company to bankruptcy in todays brain-deficient market.

I don't even like turn-based isometric unless there is a fully controllable party of 4+, but I find it a bit strange that it is supposed to be a kiss on death on the PC, but is universally accepted and sells well on Nintendo DS. One would have thought that owners of hardware-weak laptops, who can't play games with phat graphix could be converted, too.
Not to mention, that various variations of turn-based still appear in AAA titles on consoles and that's apparently totally OK.

But yes, I am also interested in a Deus Ex-like game. I only hope that there is enjoyable stealth gameplay and climbing. I just can't take any stealth mechanics without climbing seriously.

 

[Pegultagol]

There will be no climbing because the game is based on Mass Effect engine, probably.

 

[Maia]

Though I agree that most of the "New Russia" movies are crap, but there are still several notable examples of the opposite: "1612", "12", "My iz budushego", "Daun Haus", "Ostrov", "Grozovye Vorota", "Ya ostayus'", "Kuka"...
Hell i even liked the teen romantic comedies like "Ot 180 i vyshe" and "Piter FM"
That's quite a lot for the "dark times" of Russian cinema, I mussay.

Oh and Goblin will soon release his documentary about Afghan war (Правда о девятой роте).

Hm... should check this stuff. I hated Nightwatch, though - are these movies any better?

 

[Atrokkus]

Hm... should check this stuff. I hated Nightwatch, though - are these movies any better?

I didnt' really like Night Watch either.
Are you Russian or speak Russian fluently? If so, then be sure to check those movies out, they're very good. Or you could go for subtitles but it's pretty hard to find subs for some of them.

 

[kingcomrade]

ALPHA PROTOCOL ENGAGE
TACTICAL FORMATION DELTA

 

[Dementia Praecox]

The dialogue system is a huge turnoff for me. It's easily more retarded than the Mass Effect talky wheel could ever hope to be, and with the focus seemingly on spy-powah action, we'll be lucky to get a Deus Ex-like, much less a good RPG.

I don't quite get this critique. I always thought of the Mass Effect system (note: I haven't actually played the game) as a good idea, but with really shitty implementation. I mean, I love traditional dialogue trees which are written out in full (e.g. I read each sentence and I know exactly what my character will say). This works perfectly fine, and is a perfectly good system, especially in old-school RPGs where dialogue isn't fully voiced. Today, it's retarded to expect a major developer to release a game without voice-overs. Now the single most annoying thing about voice-overs (except shitty actors) is when you have fully written dialogue options which takes about a nanosecond to read and understand, but half a fucking hour to speak out aloud. I know what they're going to say, so I really couldn't care less about the slightly awkward presentation by some no-name too-ugly-for-television shit actor. IMO, this system (referred to as the ME-system) can potentially do away with that problem. I don't need to read the fucking script to enjoy a movie either, so as long as we're stuck with fully voiced dialogue, I definitely prefer not knowing what the hell my character is going to say next. Combine with subtitles and skippable audio so I can skip those to shitty to bear-actors, I'm a happy camper.

Everything I've heard till now about the Alpha Protocol dialogue system seem to be improvements over ME's. But I can still easily come up with several ideas to improve on this system to make it more challenging as well as entertaining. Off course most of them probably would depend on having a shitload more dialogue than what's standard in modern RPG's and that's one hell of a budget killer if you're at least trying to get some half-decent voice-talent.

Andhaira, so far as I have been able to tell has been using reverse RPG Codex psychology since his/her "arrival".

Codex-regulars, so far as I have been able to tell has been over analysing Andhairas posts, posting patterns and intentions, ever since it became popular to hate on him.

Basically they started off by purposely posting things they knew would raise the collective ire, pretentiousness, and most importantly attention of this community.

Basically they started spamming his topics with inane shit, one failing more than the other, and realizing this, Andhaira gears up and go on an all five-for-one spam-spree of basically the same topics, most probably for own lulz.

I tested it out myself and found I got more of a response and connection with people on this forum by lambasting one of their most beloved games in this thread.

You are a retard, who foolishly admitted to not wanting his RPGs wordy and got called on that. Now you're ashamed of your inner retard and are trying to backpedal by presenting it as a troll-attempt.

People came out of the woodwork to notice me. Hilarious.

It's like the RPG-geek counterpart to that really fat kid in the school yard whit those glasses thicker than his waist. Just too god damn easy to pick on.

People are far too predictable

Fixed. The codex unique in many ways, but that ain't one of them.

and Andhaira's smart enough to realize that. Your apparent expectations are a witness to that effect.

Not following you here, what's the retard-responses to Andhaira-spam got to do whith the Alpha Protocol-fanboyism?

So I salute Andhaira. You are a professional attention whore.

Now you're not just making sense, you're speaking the truth.

There will be no climbing because the game is based on Mass Effect engine, probably.

You mean Unreal Engine 3?

Though I agree that most of the "New Russia" movies are crap, but there are still several notable examples of the opposite: "1612", "12", "My iz budushego", "Daun Haus", "Ostrov", "Grozovye Vorota", "Ya ostayus'", "Kuka"...
Hell i even liked the teen romantic comedies like "Ot 180 i vyshe" and "Piter FM"
That's quite a lot for the "dark times" of Russian cinema, I mussay.

Oh and Goblin will soon release his documentary about Afghan war (Правда о девятой роте).

Hm... should check this stuff. I hated Nightwatch, though - are these movies any better?

If you hated Nightwhatch you suck and should shoot yourself. (Read: I loved Nightwatch and I don't think you'd like any of the recommendations if you didn't like Nightwatch. ). Anyway, Ostrov is pure awesomeness, and Grozovye Vorota (Stormgates in English, right? and 1612 is alright. I've downloaded My iz budushchego, but so far I haven't been able to find subtitles for it. Been a while since I looked though so I guess I'll have another go later today. It looks good. I haven't seen any of the others mentioned though, but they're now officially on my list. Also you should check out The 8th squadron (or something) as well, no idea what the original name is, IMDB gives me about every thing else than that movie so I've probably spelt the name wrong or something. It's a lot like Stormgates, but IMO better.

 

[Atrokkus]

The 8th squadron (or something) as well, no idea what the original name is, IMDB gives me about every thing else than that movie so I've probably spelt the name wrong or something. It's a lot like Stormgates, but IMO better

You're talking about "9 rota" here (9th company) here, i guess. It may be well-staged, but it's full of shit (historically). Bondarchuk at his worst.
There's going to be a nice little documentary on that particular company soon enough.

 

[MetalCraze]

There will be no climbing because the game is based on Mass Effect engine, probably.

Unreal Tournament 3 is based on Mass Effect engine too you know

 

[Dementia Praecox]

You're talking about "9 rota" here (9th company) here, i guess. It may be well-staged, but it's full of shit (historically). Bondarchuk at his worst.
There's going to be a nice little documentary on that particular company soon enough.

Ah, yes, that's the one. I'm know it's full of shit, but as a movie it's awesome (Like in a Oliver Stone-kind of way).

 

[Maia]

Are you Russian or speak Russian fluently?.

Yes, I am an ex pat, so comprehension isn't going to be a problem.

Well, I have seen the trailer for 1612 now and it could be interesting, but could also be a bit of heavy-handed propaganda. The unicorn looks rather pretentious. Was it Nikita in the beginning? After his Csar cameos he is now playing a mitropolite bit ?

Ostrov trailer looks very interesting

Grozovye Vorota - I dunno, trailer seems a bit generic.

My iz budushchego - no trailer, alas.

Well, something to look ito, thanks.

 

[Maia]

Are you Russian or speak Russian fluently?.

Yes, I am an ex pat, so comprehension isn't going to be a problem.

Well, I have seen the trailer for 1612 now and it could be interesting, but could also be a bit of heavy-handed propaganda. The unicorn looks rather pretentious. Was it Nikita in the beginning? After his Csar cameos he is now playing a mitropolite bit ?

Ostrov trailer looks very interesting

Grozovye Vorota - I dunno, trailer seems a bit generic.

My iz budushchego - no trailer, alas.

Well, something to look into, thanks.

 

[DiverNB]

ALPHA PROTOCOL ENGAGE
TACTICAL FORMATION DELTA

It's about fucking time we had your 40k reference in here. I can't believe it took you 4 pages KC, you're slacking



And am I the only one that isn't pissed off about the goggles? I mean, really, it seems kind of odd to worry about aesthetics when we have the potential of the RP aspects of the game being fail. I see it as a double edged sword. On the one hand, futuristic technology in games can be fun. On the other hand, however, it could be horribly contrived and just have the advanced technology cyber soldiers every spy movie/novel pumps out just for the hell of it, causing the game to go from a cool themed RPG to 3rd person shooter in seconds.

Really, this is quite crucial for Obsidian not to fuck up. Their first game that isn't the offspring of some previous Bio game. If they can't make an interesting setting on their own, I fear they'll lose any standing they currently have.

 

[Atrokkus]

Well, I have seen the trailer for 1612 now and it could be interesting, but could also be a bit of heavy-handed propaganda. The unicorn looks rather pretentious. Was it Nikita in the beginning? After his Csar cameos he is now playing a mitropolite bit ?

It's a fantasy/historic kind of movie. Generally the events are mostly true (at least the ending is true to history), but the story of the lead characters are all fictious. The movie's got a lot of good humor, very well choreographed fights (on par with hollywood stuff, really), some nice actors (including foreign -- spaniards, italians and pollacks). OH, and it has some nice boobs too.
Oh and yeah, the unicorn is like a haunting ghost of the movie, i really don't know what kind of purpose does it serve in the movie... But oh well, you kinda get used to it after a while.

 

[Azrael the cat]

Re: meh

there is a BIG difference between saying (a) I wish that there were more companies doing old-school isometric rpgs and saying (b) I want THIS particular company to ONLY make old-school isometric rpgs. Amongst other things (b) probably condemns said company to bankruptcy in todays brain-deficient market.

I don't even like turn-based isometric unless there is a fully controllable party of 4+, but I find it a bit strange that it is supposed to be a kiss on death on the PC, but is universally accepted and sells well on Nintendo DS. One would have thought that owners of hardware-weak laptops, who can't play games with phat graphix could be converted, too.
Not to mention, that various variations of turn-based still appear in AAA titles on consoles and that's apparently totally OK.
.

I don't think the problem is a lack of potential consumer-base, but rather death by lack-of-publisher, a lack of publisher-funded investment into marketing , bad reviews by game 'journalists' who were ADD-addled 12 year olds when FO was released and an inability to get a decent place (or a place at all) on the retailers displays and shelves. The gaming market seems to be stuck in a pre-mature market phase, wherein the main players seem to be completely oblivious to the fact that almost all successful mature markets evolve into a segmented marketing model, where companies succeed by having different divisions or subsidiaries each targetting a different market segment, rather than trying to flood the market with lame attempts 'appeal-to-everyone' mass-market rubbish.

Seriously, I think it's a pity that LucasArts seems to have caught a terminal case of the cretin-virus, because a solid Hollywood entertainment company would utterly devour the gaming market if they had the creative and technical talent to make ok games. For all the crap it produces, Hollywood realised years ago that you make more money (and dominate the market share) by making, say 1 summer blockbuster, 1 art movie, 1 kids film and 1 adult drama than you do by trying to make 4 summer blockbusters. Partially because the 4 films are targetting different markets, rather than competing with each other, but also because a product aimed directly at a particular market segment will almost always beat a product that is aimed at the mass market 'in general'. Yet gaming companies don't seem awake to that - they are still just trying to cram as many blockbuster games as they can, all trying to have as wide an appeal as possible. A solid hollywood-style company would have one massively funded division producing a blockbuster dumbed-down FPS, one division producing a game specifically for female gamers, one division producing an old-school adventure game aimed at people over 35 with weak compute sytems, another division producing a FPS-RPG, another one producing a hardcore rpg - you get the picture. That kind of model would actually make companies like EA a force for good - especially if, like Hollywood these days, they produce their 'indie' games through independent subsidiaries (very low risk and cost to the owner company, but potential for decent extra profits and a loyal market following who don't even realise their beloved indie film company is owned by the hollywood moguls they hate).

That's why I don't think we've seen the last of hardcore RPGs. They'll be back - but it might be a long long wait in the interim. Just need to wait for the market to reach a mature phase where there is no more money to be made by expanding the mainstream, and companies will have start segmenting their target markets in order to grow.