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Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

Grunker

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yeah, deus ex is a class a example of developers focused on gameplay

motherfucker every decision made in that game was about introducing deus ex to a console environment

abstract systems

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! NOT ABSTRACT SYSTEMS, PLEAAAAAAAAASE
 

tuluse

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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
yeah, deus ex is a class a example of developers focused on gameplay

motherfucker every decision made in that game was about introducing deus ex to a console environment

abstract systems

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! NOT ABSTRACT SYSTEMS, PLEAAAAAAAAASE
You should be more sensitive, abstraction killed Draq's dad.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
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Josh said:
the overwhelming majority of RPG developers i talk to have minimal interest in designing interesting combat mechanics and/or content and it is unfortunate.
:what:

Then what the bloody fuck do they *DO*?

Josh said:
well what are they interested iwait dont answer that please dont
story and cleverness

He's clearly not talking to anyone from Bethesda.
 

Roguey

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http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64...onger-well-i-sure-hope-so/page-6#entry1407354
Josh said:
There are markets within markets. We are making an RPG that has no claims to being "mainstream", but it's also not designed to be intentionally confusing or just plain obtuse. I know Gfted1 has concerns that he's going to get annoyed with the mechanics after a few hours and quit the game, but I'm confident that this will not be the case. We have taken (and continue to take) great pains to maintain a challenge for players without being oppressive or frustrating in the ways that the original IE games could often be. And of course, we are also providing a lot of options for people who want to adjust their level of challenge, as this is a very personal thing.

If something does turn out, in practice, to be thoroughly unenjoyable for players, we'll change it. But challenge isn't something you inch toward, IMO. It's something you put out for people to deal with and pull back from based on feedback. If you like the idea of exploration, a reactive story with cool characters, and party-based tactical combat, I want to find a way for you to enjoy this game, whatever your specific preferences (and personal time constraints) may be. We won't be able to accommodate everyone, but we should be able to accommodate a lot.

Josh continues to be the best ever. If he wasn't around, I probably would have given up on RPGs as a genre already. Unfortunately for you guise.
 

mindx2

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Codex 2012 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire RPG Wokedex Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth

Arkeus

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Josh continues to be the best ever. If he wasn't around, I probably would have given up on RPGs as a genre already. Unfortunately for you guise.
Sometimes i wonder if you aren't actively trying to make us hate him. You won't succeed!
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64...onger-well-i-sure-hope-so/page-6#entry1407354
Josh said:
We have taken (and continue to take) great pains to maintain a challenge for players without being oppressive or frustrating in the ways that the original IE games could often be.

Is he serious?! :retarded: In what ways were any of the IE games' challenge "oppressive or frustrating" unless he's talking about pathfinding.

He's probably talking about the ability to construct broken/useless character builds. In this answer to a Spring.me question, he said what he was changing from the IE games:

Is PE going to appeal to people who have never played fantasy adventure games etc. because I would be a new comer to these sorta games. If I buy this game with no experience with this genre, will I still be able to enjoy it? Thank you

I hope you will be able to enjoy it, but you may find it difficult. You're managing an entire party of characters and the combat will be tuned for a tactical mindset. However, I am doing my best to remove non-viable build options from the character system and I'm trying to keep the core mechanics consistent.
 

Grunker

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http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64...onger-well-i-sure-hope-so/page-6#entry1407354
Josh said:
We have taken (and continue to take) great pains to maintain a challenge for players without being oppressive or frustrating in the ways that the original IE games could often be.

Is he serious?! :retarded: In what ways were any of the IE games' challenge "oppressive or frustrating" ...unless he's talking about pathfinding. :troll:

Dude. It's been established multiple times that Josh agrees with retards that buying equipment is teh hard. He's an idiot when it comes to that aspect. The fact that he's developing a hardcore mode with, according to him, more satisfying difficulty than the IE-games, is enough for me.

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64...onger-well-i-sure-hope-so/page-6#entry1407354
Josh said:
We have taken (and continue to take) great pains to maintain a challenge for players without being oppressive or frustrating in the ways that the original IE games could often be.

Is he serious?! :retarded: In what ways were any of the IE games' challenge "oppressive or frustrating" unless he's talking about pathfinding.

He's probably talking about the ability to construct broken/useless character builds. In this answer to a Spring.me question, he said what he was changing from the IE games:

Is PE going to appeal to people who have never played fantasy adventure games etc. because I would be a new comer to these sorta games. If I buy this game with no experience with this genre, will I still be able to enjoy it? Thank you

I hope you will be able to enjoy it, but you may find it difficult. You're managing an entire party of characters and the combat will be tuned for a tactical mindset. However, I am doing my best to remove non-viable build options from the character system and I'm trying to keep the core mechanics consistent.

Nah, bro. Don't you remember the sixteen times we debated his quotes about Icewind Dale being too difficult to newer players (i.e. "we have to buy equipment at Pomab because some guy told us the roads would be dangerous?") and "RPG players suck, IE-games were insanely difficult for them" (yes, my 12-year-old, non-English speaking self truly must have been a master of gaming)?

Sawyer is full of sympathy for those who found the IE-games tricky, sadly. However, I'm not too worried about that, since he has made more than enough comforting statements on the nature of the harder difficulty levels.
 
Last edited:

tuluse

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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
He's probably talking about the ability to construct broken/useless character builds. In this answer to a Spring.me question, he said what he was changing from the IE games:
That and hard counters you can only learn by save-reload and then memorize the right spells.
 

AMG

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The only game with this kind of encouters is BG2, not IE games as a whole. Also after a while you just run around with few breaches and rays of reversal or whatever memorized and problem is solved. Also useless character builds argument doesn't even apply to BG since even if your guy is complete dogshit, the 5 other guys can carry him no problem. People who have trouble with IE games on default difficulty are retards and appealing to them will lead to nothing good.
 

tuluse

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Messages
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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
The only game with this kind of encouters is BG2, not IE games as a whole. Also after a while you just run around with few breaches and rays of reversal or whatever memorized and problem is solved. Also useless character builds argument doesn't even apply to BG since even if your guy is complete dogshit, the 5 other guys can carry him no problem. People who have trouble with IE games on default difficulty are retards and appealing to them will lead to nothing good.
BG1/2 is what most people think of when they think of combat in IE. Everyone hates combat in PS:T and about 1/10 of the people who bought BG2 bought an IWD game.
 
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PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Serpent in the Staglands Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
The only game with this kind of encouters is BG2, not IE games as a whole. Also after a while you just run around with few breaches and rays of reversal or whatever memorized and problem is solved. Also useless character builds argument doesn't even apply to BG since even if your guy is complete dogshit, the 5 other guys can carry him no problem. People who have trouble with IE games on default difficulty are retards and appealing to them will lead to nothing good.
BG1/2 is what most people think of when they think of combat in IE. Everyone hates combat in PS:T and about 1/10 of the people who bought BG2 bought an IWD game.

"Hate" is a strong word. There's a fine line of difference between something not being good and hating it.
 

hiver

Guest
He is probably talking about how confusing the mechanic systems and nomenclature were in IE games, mindx2.
No need to worry anyone might have found IE games actually hard in terms of combat challenge.


 

ZagorTeNej

Arcane
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Dec 10, 2012
Messages
1,980
A game that has no claims to being mainstream shouldn't go out of its way to cater to casual players (it's a waste of time and resources as far as I'm concerned), plenty of games out there for people who can't find Caius Cosades and/or those who go into panic mode when a vampire in BG2 level drains them. However, I do remember Josh saying something akin to how it's easier to design the game for a higher difficulty level initially and then scale it down for easier modes than the other way around, hopefully that's the way they'll do it.
 

Monad

Learned
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Jun 24, 2012
Messages
192
You're right zagor, it does seem somewhat pointless to try to cater to people that probably will never play the game anyways.
 

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