Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Jasede]

Not this shit again; I love Vancian magic. It's very rewarding having to plan your spells ahead of time in P&P - that's where the Intelligence of a wizard comes in. I wish every game had Vancian magic; fuck you.

Vancian magic might not be everyone's favorite but it works. I don't know about using it in a single-player CRPG, though, unless you somehow control resting or have respawning monsters.

 

[Excidium]

Vancian magic is p. cool in P&P. Specially in pre-d20 stuff with all the crazy spells and descriptions and material components and what not. It's always terribly streamlined in video games and technical limitashuns ruin a lot of what makes it special.

 

[Infinitron]

I didn't say I didn't like it. I just said that, if we weren't used to it, if it hadn't been an RPG staple for decades, it would seem fucking ridiculous.

 

[Grunker]

Sometimes you're a weird motherfucker Shrek.

 

[evdk]

How can something that has its origins in a books series be gameist? Riddle me that.

 

[Grunker]

Sometimes you're a weird motherfucker Shrek.

o_O

Infinitron is just saying that the idea of memorizing spells is sortta, well, weird and it's sort of odd that they became a staple of magic-design. What you should be doing is telling him how that has no bearing on them as a mechanic. Instead you're going off telling him to keep his private opinion to himself... on an internet forum where 99% of everything we do is just throw our opinions out there. That's kindda... weird.

 

[Excidium]

I don't even know what's being argued here anymore

At least I am not complaining that the grimoire slam makes no sense, 'coz that'd be retarded because it's magic and hey grimoires accumulate magical energy that can be released with kinetic force, it makes enough sense to me.

What I'm saying is that it is boring and you just fucked up something fundamental with magic it it's described by that term.

 

[evdk]

Welcome to 4E.

 

[Jasede]

That's like saying "anything to avoid Hitler, even if it means supporting Stalin".

 

[Captain Shrek]

That's like saying "anything to avoid Hitler, even if it means supporting Stalin".

Haven't played 4E .

 

[Grunker]

That's like saying "anything to avoid Hitler, even if it means supporting Stalin".

No it's not. 4E would make for a pretty good turn-based RPG, even if it was horrible as D&D P&P product.

Also, I still fail to see how Project: Eternity so far is similar to Dragon Age. But then again, I also fail to see the connection between Dragon Age and World of Warcraft which is made constantly.

 

[Captain Shrek]

That's like saying "anything to avoid Hitler, even if it means supporting Stalin".

No it's not. 4E would make for a pretty good turn-based RPG, even if it was horrible as D&D P&P product.

Also, I still fail to see how Project: Eternity so far is similar to Dragon Age. But then again, I also fail to see the connection between Dragon Age and World of Warcraft which is made constantly.

Rogues blinking in combat:

 

[Grunker]

Saying that it is like Dragon Age 2 because rogues are blinking in combat is as stupid (well, more stupid actually, since you're just concluding this based on a single mechanic) as saying that 6 party-members and isometric view makes it and IE-like.

Dragon Age 2 is a retardedly fast-paced action-game with very little need to pause, less party members, 3D and third-person camera.

You're going nowhere taking an isolated mechanic like a rogue blink and claiming this game is suddenly like DA2.

There's a certain rogue-archetype in Pathfinder that can blink. Does that make my P&P Pathfinder campaign a DA2-campaign?

 

[Roguey]

DA2 is not an action game unless you define action as "kill a lot of things."

 

[Grunker]

^lol

Saying that it is like Dragon Age 2 because rogues are blinking in combat is as stupid (well, more stupid actually, since you're just concluding this based on a single mechanic) as saying that 6 party-members and isometric view makes it and IE-like.

Dragon Age 2 is a retardedly fast-paced action-game with very little need to pause, less party members, 3D and third-person camera.

You're going nowhere taking an isolated mechanic like a rogue blink and claiming this game is suddenly like DA2.

There's a certain rogue-archetype in Pathfinder that can blink. Does that make my P&P Pathfinder campaign a DA2-campaign?

Dude that was a joke.

 

[hiver]

A +1 longsword is a magic item, you still need someone who knows how to use it to hit something.

I have no idea what is that even supposed to mean, context wise - and dont even try to explain it to me.

Likewise, I think while the Grimoire is a magic item on it's own to charge the capacitor, the wizard needs proximity to it.

there is no presented difference in the actual description provided between a magic item and magic capacitor.
grimoire - per sawyer explanation - is both!
AND IT IS THAT - WITHOUT WIZARD USING IT OR FUCKING CHARGING IT!

Thats. what. he. said.

Dudebro, all concepts of magic are absolutely stupid -- some are, subjectively to each person, more conducive to certain gameplay styles than others. If we accept that people can fart fireballs and flick lightning then they can magic-book or whatever the fuck.
=
Makes more sense to charge a book with magic than a stick anyway.

How the fuck does it "make more sense" if your first assertion is true, you stupid shit?
Truth, only simpletons such as yourself are absolutely stupid.

Not this shit again; I love Vancian magic. It's very rewarding having to plan your spells ahead of time in P&P - that's where the Intelligence of a wizard comes in. I wish every game had Vancian magic; fuck you.
Vancian magic might not be everyone's favorite but it works.

The feature of planning spells in advance is fine. Having magic written in "spells" - in books - is basically stupid.
It is stupid because it creates unintended bad consequences and questions about those that just cannot be answered except by handwaving. In the context.

The restriction of "spells" and fucking magic books was used as a crutch of providing the player with a simple straightforward visual representation of this "magic stuff".

 

[Murk]

Yeah bro, you totally made me want to treat you like human being.

Notice the part that I said "some are, subjectively to each person, more conducive..."

Yeah, that means it's an opinion.

Books contain words and magical concepts and are representative of scrolls, tomes of lore, knowledge (which is what arcane magic is based on in many settings) and all the usual shit. Wands are also representative of that, but less so because of the disconnect of "words of power" which is often what magic is. Magic has a lot of somatic waving around and what not but one can do that with their hands as much as a wand.

The idea that a book, with its powerful arcane words contains actual kinetic power makes as much or more sense than placing magic in a crystal that has a set amount of uses.

Having said all that, I don't give a fuck if it's "book slam" or "wand burst" -- as long as it mechanically functions in a manner that allows for creative and reactive gameplay.

 

[Roguey]

^lol

I hope that was in regards to the latter definition because Dragon Age 2 is not an action game.

 

[hiver]

Yeah bro, you totally made me want to treat you like human being.

Im not your bro. Go fuck yourself and your treatment. mkay?

Notice the part that I said "some are, subjectively to each person, more conducive..."

No, you said "more conducive to certain gameplay styles than others."


And, to explain to you your own words, which apparently youre not capable of understanding - you said "all concepts of magic are absolutely stupid".
And if all concepts of magic are absolutely stupid - stupid, then you cannot say that a magic book makes more sense then a stick because thats an oxymoron, MORON!

 

[Murk]

... riiiiiiiiiiight.

 

[Infinitron]

http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/431494289055313164

 

[Excidium]

There's a certain rogue-archetype in Pathfinder that can blink. Does that make my P&P Pathfinder campaign a DA2-campaign?

There's likely something that explains that rogue archetype having that sort of ability, it's a completely different situation.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

Kind of bizarre that Sawyer thinks its bizarre to view Grimoire Slam as potentially pulpy and slapsticky in tone. Since using a book as a weapon is pretty silly. Not bad silly necessarily, but definitely lighthearted and highly stylized. Even the name is reminiscent of goofy fighting games. Grimoiiirrrree SLAAAAAAAAAAAAAM!

Also I got the impression that the Grimoire slam was the wizards primary (or only) ability for exiting engagement, so, although technically optional, is pretty stupid to not take. So the argument that the player who doesn't like it doesn't have to take it is pretty weak.

 

[Infinitron]

Also I got the impression that the Grimoire slam was the wizards primary (or only) ability for exiting engagement, so, although technically optional, is pretty stupid to not take. So the argument that the player who doesn't like it doesn't have to take it is pretty weak.

He says in that conversation that it isn't the only ability. "Primary" maybe (whatever that means)

 

[Excidium]

stuff

Oh God, I now think Grimoire Slam is great design just so I don't get associated with people that retarded.