Official Codex Discord Server

  1. Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.
    Dismiss Notice

In Progress Odin demands blood! Let's revive the Viking Age in Crusader Kings 2!

Discussion in 'Codex Playground' started by Kayerts, Mar 19, 2012.

  1. Luzur Prestigious Gentleman Good Sir

    Luzur
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2009
    Messages:
    34,254
    Location:
    Swedish Empire
    accurate, the coastal parts around Uppland, Hälsingland and up to Sundsvall was viking country, atleast dozens of graves have been found in that area.
     
    ^ Top  
  2. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    It's accurate alright. Swedes didn't expand North until later. Here's Swedish primary area in the 12th century, a few hundred years later:

    [​IMG]

    However, smaller viking settlements started to appear in the area of these "Skrithfenni" in late 9th and early 10th century, but the area didn't become "Norsified" until later on.


    Actually, come to think of it, Norway is the most inaccurate in Scandinavia, being a couple of hundred years early in the Northern coastline and Finnmark.
     
    ^ Top  
  3. Phelot Arcane

    Phelot
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2009
    Messages:
    17,916
    Thread successfully ruined by Finnish people. Also, where is update?
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  4. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    [​IMG]
     
    ^ Top  
  5. Phelot Arcane

    Phelot
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2009
    Messages:
    17,916
    Odin has no room for vile Ugric hordes!
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  6. mondblut Arcane

    mondblut
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2005
    Messages:
    17,740
    Location:
    Ingrija
    Weird. When I played CK1, I was Erik af Munso, a duke of Uppland and a son and heir apparent to the king of Sweden (and inherited the throne just a few months into the game). In CK2, some other guy is the king, who somehow snuck into Erik's sister bedroom *and* made it grounds for stealing Erik's rightful throne from Erik's father, now mysteriously dead. Worse yet, Erik is suddenly pagan and unplayable. WTF?

    Okay, who of the rulers bordering the vast expanses of free pagan booty is closest to 18/18/18/18/18/18 now? I plan to play it shortly, but I am not bothering unless I play as the bestest guy ever and with the tastiest expansion opportunities to boot. A grey eminence elusive shadow brilliant strategist would be a good place to start.
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 1
    ^ Top  
  7. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    Well, as far as historical sources go the two Eriks in the game were both claimants of the Swedish crown (though no real information on whether or not they were sons or anyway related to King Stenkil who died either before or soon after game-start), both named Erik, one of them a pagan, and Uppland was still largely pagan at this point so it's probably he'd be based there. In fact, the Eriks in the game start managed to kill each other within a year of the game start historically. So actually CK2 is more accurate here compared to CK1.
     
    ^ Top  
  8. Kayerts Arcane

    Kayerts
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    880

    Working on it, should have it within the next day or two. The next two updates after those will have . . . many things to write about, and should follow more quickly.

    You only get one "vocation" in CK2 (shadow / strategist / eminence gris). The "genius" perk is a good substitute; I don't think any of the starting rulers are geniuses, but you can breed one. Here's a rival that our Norsemen will be facing a few decades down the line:

    [​IMG]

    In terms of starting choices, Harald Hardrada or Sweyn II of Denmark are both very strong; Hardrada starts with an invasion in England (which you can win, albeit with some difficulty), and Sweyn is the Midas-touched ruler of the richest lands in northern Europe.
     
    ^ Top  
  9. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    Hell, richest lands in most of Europe. Denmark's core territory is ridiculously good.
     
    ^ Top  
  10. Kayerts Arcane

    Kayerts
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    880
    Yeah, despite its relatively small starting size, Denmark is by far the scariest of the three Scandinavian kingdoms. Their unending wealth means they can and will spam you with mercs, if you fight them, and they usually end up carving out good-sized Baltic empire, unless the HRE demolishes them.

    In this game, Denmark is most threatening early on because it's an unknown; we won't ever be directly going to war with them, but they have the potential to back either of the other two Scandinavians in a war against us. We absolutely cannot fight a Dane-backed kingdom, so we may have to add some brutal cunning to our existing cunning brutality.
     
    ^ Top  
  11. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    Don't forget that thanks to their massive holdings (Denmark is more valuable than huge swathes of France or Germany) they also can wield huge levies.
     
    ^ Top  
  12. Saark Arcane Patron

    Saark
    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,511
    A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
    Its amazing how different some games turn out. That screen of yours shows Norway still being independant, while in my game norway already was part of the HRE around that year. Denmark took over most parts of sweden, making it pretty hard for me to actually gain some valuable land, since converting those finnish girly like creatures to true vikings takes a shitload of time. The pagan Erik got assassinated a week into the game. :/ The hardest part for me now is to get some valuable claims, since there is nothing norse left in the north, so no one really wants to join my court, and recruiting proper personnel is pretty much impossible. Right now I have about 4 new spymasters per year since 3 countries want to assassinate me.

    Can't wait for your update though, gave me a new challenge to work on. ;)
     
    ^ Top  
  13. Luzur Prestigious Gentleman Good Sir

    Luzur
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2009
    Messages:
    34,254
    Location:
    Swedish Empire
    they never hired a single merc against me, while i hired one against them, just in case.

    in the end it was like a walk in the park after i got my army over to Köpenhamn, when i was expecting to be rolled back while in Skåne early on, but they just sent small stacks against me over and over.
     
    ^ Top  
  14. Kayerts Arcane

    Kayerts
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    880
    I think the God-King's ascension to the Norwegian throne is part of the reason why Norway stayed independent. Beyond his absurd diplomacy score, he's a crusader, which gives a +30 relations bonus to other crusaders. His imperial majesty is all about crusading, so he's too busy high-fiving Torfinn across the North Sea to invade. They hang out on weekends and swap stories about sending unbelievers into Christ's light.

    Claims are indeed one of the hardest parts of being pagan; though you can employ Brutal Cunning to help in a few key cases, which I'll show off when we get there.
     
    ^ Top  
  15. Kayerts Arcane

    Kayerts
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    880
    II. THE TERROR OF THE GULF

    1. Terrorizing the Gulf

    Show Spoiler

    We left off with Thord's forces storming Lappland, uniting all the Norsemen under his banner. Shortly thereafter, Chancellor Dan pulls another god-given right to rule out of his ass, this time for the Kvenish county of Kemi. (The Kvens rule the brown land to the east in this pic.)

    [​IMG]

    Well-done! In fact, it's so well-done that I'm going to give him a chance to work his magic on Pohjanmaa, the other Kvenish county, before we try to seize the territory.

    The rationale for this is that Thord's still rebuilding the military after the unification wars, and we need him to win decisively when he fights the tribes. If he wins any future war but loses most of his men, then he actually lost that war, because he'll most likely be immediately invaded by Christians who smell blood. Our grace period is over; the Christians WILL kill us if we let down our guard.

    Beyond that, Thord's going to have to fight the Kvens and probably siege both provinces before they surrender anyway. Ideally, we'd like to take both their territories in one war. If we don't, not only do we have to fight them twice, but there will be a mandatory truce between wars that will slow expansion for years.

    (We are going to be honoring our truces. Vikings in CK2 are an honorable people who always keep our word. Our motto is "death before dishonor," or more accurately, "death immediately following dishonor," because there are half a dozen powerful nearby factions that want us dead, and dishonorable behavior will cause them to actively pursue that wish. The only reason they aren't hitting us now is that we're laying low and waiting for someone else to make the first move. The odds are good that it'll be one of the cocks around us attacking one of the other cocks, which will start a long, bloody cockfight that we can exploit.)


    2. Family Matters

    Show Spoiler

    Anyway, we wait. Thord spends most of the time hunting and raising his children. There are two components to child-rearing in CK2: stat growth, and events. Stat growth occurs automatically each year; there's a chance that the kid's score will be incremented, which is increased if he's got a good guardian. As for child-rearing events, they usually come in the form of a "choice," the various options of which confer different traits, which yield benefits or penalties. "Choice" gets scare quotes because choices typically take the following form: "As a teacher, would you like to teach your pupil, or would you prefer to piss on his face as more of an object lesson about how the world works?" Which is to say, in most choices, one option is obviously superior. There's one event where you see your kid outside a tower window, climbing it from the outside, and you have to decide whether to praise him for his bravery, or chuck his tiny ass to the ground to teach him a lesson. I'm not sure what the lesson is. "Sucks to be crippled," I guess.

    Anyway, Thord's stats are good but not great; his wife Gisla's are truly great, but she's kind of an asshole, and she's likely to raise asshole kids if we let her. We work out a compromise whereby Thord tutors the kids until they're smarter than him, which happens when they're 10-12, and then he hands them over to mom. This works pretty well. Our heir Gungnir is shaping up to be a little badass, by the way:

    [​IMG]

    "Knight." Sure.

    [​IMG]

    Thord subscribes to the "snakebite is awesome" school of parenting. You probably haven't heard of this school, because most of the families who followed it mysteriously died out.

    [​IMG]

    WHAT. Thord's Viking son is getting into book-learning? Fuck that. Thord's changing the succession laws; if his heir's going to be a pussy, it might as well be someone with an anatomical excuse for it.

    [​IMG]

    We adopt elective succession. That may seem like an odd decision, considering that Gungnir is our only male heir, and barring his weird penchant for reading, he is completely awesome. But right now, we're the only elector in our realm. That means we can unilaterally declare a new heir. This is handy for a few reasons, the most immediate of which is that when our current heir gets married, we can collect a wedding tax across our realm. It also lets the heir marry higher than they otherwise could. Consequently, our daughters are both going to be heirs for the month immediately preceding their weddings.

    I wasn't kidding when I said Gungnir was awesome, by the way. Here's a quick peek at what he's going to become:

    [​IMG]

    Three traits to make his underlings love him, plus the best martial and diplomacy scores in our realm. And he's only 16. I can't wait for Thord to die. In the meantime, we'll be having him take over most of Chancellor Dan's duties.


    3. Vanguard of the Pagan Peoples

    Show Spoiler

    I'm getting ahead of myself with the family history, though. Let's rewind a few years. Shortly before Chancellor Dan gives us a claim on Pohjanmaa, I see a strange battle taking place in my lands:

    [​IMG]

    Hot damn. The Bjarmians are fighting Norway!

    This is fantastic news. The Bjarmians are the strongest pagan tribe in the North right now, with the united power of five fully militarized baronies backing them. Their home turf is the northeasternmost territory on the map, far beyond the Baltic. They never come west this early unless it's to defend their fellow Finns against Christian aggression.

    [​IMG]

    In this case, they're fighting a war of religious defense against Norway. It seems Norwegian King Olaf tried to claim the lands of the Kola Sami, thinking the two-county tribe would be easy pickings for his twenty-county kingdom. He'd have been right, except half of Finland rose up in defense of their brothers, and now he's fighting not just the Sami but also the Karelians, the Kvens, and the Bjarmians. All three of those, as you can see in the last two screenshots, are capable of single-handedly defeating Norwegian armies in the field.

    [​IMG]

    The eastern Sami are safe. The Finnish alliance will not only stop the invasion, but will turn it back until all of Trondelag, the duchy comprising half of mainland Norway, is under Finnish occupation. Norwegian expansionism will die an early death, and in Trondhjem, Olaf's disastrous war will foster anger against the Norwegian crown for years to come.

    Thord, leading the Norsemen in their capacity as Vanguard of the Pagan Peoples, courageously responds to these developments by declaring war on the Pagan Peoples.

    [​IMG]

    Not really the move you'd expect, but Thord is subtle.

    Basically, the Kvenish army already did its job against Norway, and their war is now mostly a matter of sieges. The Bjarmians and Karelians can handle that on their own. Moreover, we've been planning this war for over a decade; I'm willing to give the Kvens a few months to fight one or two more battles against the Norwegians, but we need the land. And most importantly, the war gives us an excellent cover to conquer the Kvens: The Finnish Neighborhood Watch has its hands full just now, and thus is likely to let me fight the Kvens one on one. You might point out that it's now technically one on zero, since their army is off in Trondhjem. Your fixation on niggling details is frankly quite tacky.

    Don't get me wrong, I'd love to join in the pagan party going on next door, but we weren't invited. And Thord does not react well to being snubbed.

    [​IMG]

    With the Kvenish army depleted and in Norway, taking their lands is just a matter of winning sieges. We lose a fraction of our forces to siege events, but resistance is minimal. Victory comes swiftly, and the Kvenish lands are ours. We now rule the inner Gulf of Bothnia.

    [​IMG]

    This does raise the question of what we should call ourselves now, though. "Vikings" works, but isn't totally accurate; "Norsemen" is closer, but half our realm is now Finnish. Wait, I've got an idea!--

    [​IMG]

    Much better.

    Dan had suggested "Valhalla" back during the war with the Kvens, and he ended up having to fight a duel to defend his retarded naming decision:

    [​IMG]

    We accepted his bribe. Tyr smiled on Dan, who fought and won the Duel To Make The World Safe For Stupid Names. Now all we have to do is amass a mountain of skulls so high that our realm reaches to its namesake in Asgard.


    4. A Mountain of Skulls

    Show Spoiler

    On that note, you will recall our army made it through the Kvenish war mostly intact. This turns out to be important, because our other Christian neighbor has been faring no better than Norway:

    [​IMG]

    Denmark has declared war on Sweden, seeking to claim Smaland as their own. As discussed earlier in the thread, Denmark is the powerhouse of Scandinavia; it's no surprise they're winning the war.

    On the triumphant march home from the Kvenish war, news of the war in the south spreads throughout Warchief Thord's camp. One day later, he has an unexpected meeting.

    With their entire army in the south, facing a stronger foe than either of us, and with the Danes guaranteed not to come to the Swedes' defense, this was as good an opportunity to take Swedish land as we were going to get. So I ponied up the cash to have Thord proclaimed jarl, which gave him a claim on Medelpad, one of the Swedish possessions within his de jure jarldom, thereby providing us with cause for war. (If that sounded like gobbledygook, see the next section.)

    Attacking Sweden was still a pretty debatable move. Thord just committed to be King Stenkil's enemy for the rest of his life. First, Stenkil will hate him for declaring war. (In this case, King Stenkil died during the war, and young king Anund won't bear a grudge, but I didn't know that'd happen going in.) Second, now that there's a jarldom of Norrland, the king may decide he wants it. (Since Norrland is part of the de jure Kingdom of Sweden, and CK2's kings want to control all duchies in their kingdoms.) Add to this the Christians' innate hatred for all things Norse, and we'll probably be fighting wars off and on until one of us is destroyed.

    Still, it's not like the option of peaceful coexistence was ever on the table. The land was good, and the plunder was better, and both will serve us better than they did Sweden, I am sure.

    For the moment, the Swedes lack an intact army large enough to contest our advance, so this war goes easily enough. The king tries to raise levies to rush to reinforce the war against the Danes, but we cut them down when they appear, taking many scalps. The raid spreads south, and we gather much plunder.

    [​IMG]

    King Stenkil dies young, his kingdom sacked and burning, invading armies in his lands. Soon, with a boy king on the throne and gnawed by foes from both ends, the proud Swedes surrender. Countess Birgitta of Medelpad becomes Thord's vassal. The Herald of the Viking Age is cheered by all his people, even the Kvens. Rage boils within young King Anund . . .


    5. GAME MECHANICS: Pagans and conquest

    Show Spoiler

    Since it came up in the thread and in this last war, we should talk about casus belli. In CK2, you need a moral or perhaps immoral justification for declaring war. Pagans in CK2 have very few options here. We have a nigh-on impossible time marrying into any bloodline that will give us a decent claim on land, so our initial options were all based on fabrications. Chancellor Dan was good to us, but fabrications get increasingly expensive, and even when they're fast, they're slow.

    The war against the Swedes was founded on a different sort of claim, a ducal claim. CK2 has this weird concept of de jure territories, which are regions indelibly etched on the map by the hammer of Thor himself, and which do not change with respect to such trivialities as who rules there. The point of proclaiming Thord jarl was to give him a claim on all territory within the de jure duchy of Norrland, which he may then press in a war against any other ruler with land there.

    And that's about it for pagan expansion options right now. Christian rulers get every option we do, plus holy wars, which let them start a war with any pagan or Muslim, at any time. If they win, they get all the land in a duchy of their choice. This is a problem for us, because all our Norse counties are in the same duchy. That means that losing a single war to the Christians will leave us with only our Finnish possessions. Since the Finns are still upset about Thord conquering them and pillaging their lands and burning down their homes, that will leave us without a military, which will probably spell the end of the Second Viking Age. So if we get into a war, I guess we should try to win it!

    Beyond holy wars, Christians can get invasions (which let them war for another Christian ruler's primary title), and Catholics get crusades (which grant huge bonuses to relations with clergy and fellow crusaders, allow you to raise levies indefinitely without upsetting your vassals, give a military perk to every general who participates, yield retarded amounts of prestige and piety if you take the target, offer valuable land, and will very likely make your grandmother proud of you). Pagans get fucked.*
    __
    *Actual fucking not included.

    There is a reason this game is called "Crusader Kings": crusaders are kings. And we are mere warriors. Still, we'll do our best, and if the Allfather favors us, we will prevail.


    6. Our Light Left Hand

    Show Spoiler

    As mentioned earlier, Gungnir is a badass. In our continuing quest to make him better than Thord in every way, we married him to this goddess in mortal form. She makes Thord's own brilliant wife look like a dopey pile of dumbs:

    [​IMG]

    The best way to pursue the genetic superiority strategy like we are is to scan the list of baby noblewomen when your heir is 2-3. The AI is more willing to accept a betrothal to a pagan lord than it is a marriage, since selling your daughter for an alliance with brutal Norsemen sounds better before she's old enough to cry about the idea. Also, young children are largely wildcards, with no telling whether they'll survive to adulthood, or (among subgenius untermenschen) how their stats are going to turn out.

    Gungnir's superb diplomacy score means we immediately had him take over most of Dan's duties as chancellor once he came of age. This ended up being a good decision; during the war with the Swedes, he gave us a claim on Uusimaa.

    [​IMG]

    (That's the county directly to the right of the event pop-up, on the north side of the Gulf of Finland.)

    You'll notice I skipped over Hame, the province between the conquered Kvenish lands and Uusimaa; that's because Uusimaa is more important. It has a city, which will mean marginally more taxes to send back to Jamtland. Of significance, this city has a fleet. We Vikings love our longships, and sea travel is by far the fastest way to get around in CK2. It even makes the ridiculous travel time in the north somewhat bearable. In future wars, having ships should allow us to start hitting the Swedes' coastal provinces before they are fully mobilized, intercepting their armies before they can muster. This should confer a substantial strategic advantage.

    Ideally, we'd like to have claims on both of the Tavastian-controlled counties before we start our heroic war to liberate the Viking lands from the non-Vikings who have inexplicably been its sole inhabitants since the dawn of man. So we wait a few years.


    7. International News

    Show Spoiler

    Two wars ago, we received this global announcement:

    [​IMG]

    I screwed up the screenshot, but the text in the center popup is saying that the Pope called all Catholic lords to a crusade for Ascalon. This didn't have immediate consequences for us, but crusades generally mean that the more powerful Catholic rulers will be occupied over the next few years. Short-term, crusades are nice, because they usually mean Catholic attention is focused on the godless infidels of NotUs-istan. Long-term, they're bad, because crusaders consider each other best bros; this solidifies diplomatic relations among Catholics and pushes them to turn their military ambitions elsewhere. Worse, there's a small chance after every crusading battle that a ruler gains the "zealot" trait, which turns them into fearsome warriors bent on scouring the infidel scum from the earth. You would not believe how annoying that is for infidel scum.

    In this case, they were fighting the "Shia Caliphate," which at this point is sort of the historical Fatimids. (Politics in the Islamic world around this time were weird.) At the game's start, the caliphate is tied with the Eastern Roman Empire for the status of most powerful nation in CK2, so they'll give a good fight, but the Catholics are putting their backs into this one. Half the kings in Europe, plus the fearsome kaiser of the Holy Roman Empire, will join in on the first crusade. In the end, the caliphate capitulates:

    [​IMG]

    And William the Conqueror takes the glory. Hey Norway, how does that feel? Not only do you get hit by the Finnish Freight Train, but remember that Norman bastard who took England after Hardrada failed? He beat you at crusading, too, and now he's the coolest kid in all of Christendom. The Pope probably calls him "dude" and stands up a little straighter when he walks into a room. Haha! But yeah, that's gotta suck for you, Norway. Hey, remember back when Knut the Great was your king, and you were sort of important? That must have been nice. And brief.

    (I'm bitter at Norway. They're generally a lot more functional than Sweden is, and they crushed a few of Thord's alternate timeline predecessors before I figured out how to deal with them.)


    8. On to Uusimaa

    Show Spoiler

    That brings us up to the present. Not much of note happens over the next few years. Gungnir's Russian wife (who's pretty and smart and hard-working and would probably think I was really cool if she got to know me) converts to the True Faith, though she shows a curious fondness for the stories involving Loki. Odd. In other family news, we had betrothed our daughter to the son of High Chief Mielus of the Tavastians when both of them were infants, because the boy was a genius. He still is, and now he's marshal of the realm, and his dad keeps pestering us about when we're going to send Frigg over for the wedding:

    [​IMG]

    We don't have a good way of telling him that we're actually planning to send a war party instead of a wedding party, but the old chief is persistent. Thord gives Gungnir a little longer to try to put together a claim on Hame, but it's taking him years, and the boy king of Sweden is growing into a strong and very angry young man, and we need those ships. Eventually, we give up and declare war:

    [​IMG]

    Mielus calls upon his alliance with the Kola Sami, who answer the call. It doesn't matter; we've got over three thousand bloodthirsty Viking warriors, and we're smarter than they are. We ambush the Sami in the forests of Kemi before they can join forces with the Tavastians:

    [​IMG]

    Divided, they're no match for the Allfather's champions. We make quick thanks to honor Tyr for the victory. Then we cleave through the Tavastian army at Hame and lay siege to Uusimaa. As tales of our onslaught spread, our thralls in Pohjanmaa see that the Finnish gods have abandoned their people, and they resolve to return the favor. They kneel before Odin and arise not thralls but proud Viking brothers. ( :bro: )

    [​IMG]

    From Jamtland, our spymaster sends word that Countess Birgitta of Medelpad has hatched a plot to overthrow us and become Duchess of Norrland. The idea of a Christian woman at the head of the Viking warhost is so ridiculous that at first, Thord greets it with silent contempt. Does she imagine our people as honorless as her own? On reflection, though, Thord realizes that he has many enemies in Christendom: dukes and kings so craven they would back such a plot, even if it meant falling in line behind a woman. Thord resolves that he cannot suffer this treachery to fester further. He orders would-be Duchess Birgitta's arrest.

    [​IMG]

    The countess is a sly one, though, and she not only escapes capture but now calls forth the two hundred men of her comital guard to stand in open rebellion. Thord snorts. As soon as Uusimaa is his, he will cross the gulf at the head of a Viking army ten times that number and grind the traitors beneath his heel. He will turn the berserker cult loose inside Birgitta's castle and lock the doors, that the strongest might become the new chief of Medelpad, and the weaklings might cease to be. This is what he tells the skull of his former spymaster as he sits beside it in his siege camp.

    [​IMG]

    But soon, far more dire news arrives: the day he came of age, Young King Anund vowed vengeance on Thord. He swore by Prince Borkvard's blood that he would burn Valhalla to the ground. He is marching north with a vast Swedish army to see that vow fulfilled, and he does not just want Medelpad back--he wants the whole of Thord's jarldom.

    With his army bloodied and three wars raging around him, Thord stares silently at the spymaster's skull, hoping it has some counsel to see him through the dark days ahead . . .
     
    • Brofist Brofist x 2
    ^ Top  
  16. Azira Arcane Patron

    Azira
    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2004
    Messages:
    8,209
    Location:
    Copenhagen, Denmark
    Codex 2012
    :thumbsup:
     
    ^ Top  
  17. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    Optimally, you should wait for the Swedish army to split up, which it's wont to do after the initial border province is taken, and then take it out piecemeal.

    You've got money, so sending your spymaster after the Swedish king is a solid option, it could destabilize Sweden enough to give you an edge.
     
    ^ Top  
  18. Kayerts Arcane

    Kayerts
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    880
    Nah, bad news there. The border province is Angermanland / Valhalla, our capital. And at least in my version (1.04c, basically no mods), the AI won't split its stack once it's gathered, provided we're still using relatively small, attritionless, early game armies.

    Our spymaster's a pretty big gamble; he's not likely to succeed, and even if he did, it's questionable how much impact killing Anund would have. Remember, Anund's been ruling a relatively stable Sweden as a boy king for ten years now; it'll be hard for his successor to be too much worse than a child, and even so there've been no revolts. Also, since he's already in a war with us, I believe his successor may get the massive "defending against the infidels" boost to vassal relations, even though he's technically attacking against the infidels.

    There are few problems in CK2 that you can't murder your way out of, but I think this might be one of them.

    NEXT TIME:
    * We finally have ourselves a right 'n' propa waaaa'!
    * Even more foes dive into the Great Norrlander Clusterfuck!
    * Many clever stratagems to save Norrland! Many failures!
    * Valhalla burns!
    * Thord's darkest hour!
    * Yelling!
    * It will be metal as fuck!
     
    ^ Top  
  19. Phelot Arcane

    Phelot
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2009
    Messages:
    17,916
    Awwww! I liked the name Angermanland! Thord the Anger Man of Anger Man Land! Sounds very angry.

    Nice update BTW
     
    ^ Top  
  20. Luzur Prestigious Gentleman Good Sir

    Luzur
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2009
    Messages:
    34,254
    Location:
    Swedish Empire
    it means Remorse Man Land actually.
     
    ^ Top  
  21. Phelot Arcane

    Phelot
    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2009
    Messages:
    17,916
    :( Gee thanks for ruining my fantasy of a country populated by enraged men.
     
    ^ Top  
  22. Luzur Prestigious Gentleman Good Sir

    Luzur
    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2009
    Messages:
    34,254
    Location:
    Swedish Empire
    but to give some comfort Anger is old norse for fjord or gulf, popular pathway for vikings.

    so to detail it up abit its Bay Men's land.
     
    ^ Top  
  23. Kayerts Arcane

    Kayerts
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    880
    Yeah, renaming it was dumb. One of the cooler things about CK2, particularly in the early phases, is that it retains enough fidelity to real history that the points where it diverges can be actually interesting. (As opposed to, e.g., the more gamey Civilization's "lol Gandhi's invading America in 700 A.D.! With tanks!") It's still not a realistic historical simulation by any means, but it's close enough that you can get an uncanny valley effect between the game and what really happened. And that can make it more fun to see, e.g., the Muslims winning the Reconquista, or the grand dukes of Rus unifying behind some 12th century proto-Ivan the Great. So inasmuch as the historical regional names contribute toward that, I shouldn't run around renaming everything Buttopia and Retardoland.

    By the way, thanks to all y'all who live in the general vicinity and are sharing your historical and linguistic knowledge. My own medieval northern history's decidedly patchy, so this is p. interesting and keeps me from referring to Finland as "Russia's little buddy."
     
    ^ Top  
  24. Vaarna_Aarne Notorious Internet Vandal Patron

    Vaarna_Aarne
    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2008
    Messages:
    33,387
    Location:
    Cell S-004
    MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    I haven't actually kept count on how much it takes for Swedes and Russians to conquer Finnic tribes in this game. Historically it took them over 200 years from game-start, and not due to lack of trying (House of Munsö died out when prince Anund was killed by Finns in a failed invasion of Western Finland in 1050-1060, and Sigtuna was once razed by Karelians 1187).
     
    ^ Top  
  25. kazgar Arcane

    kazgar
    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2008
    Messages:
    2,163
    Location:
    Upside Down
    Loving the explanations of both game mechanics and your plans/ideas. Keep it up.
     
    ^ Top  

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.