Incline Path of Exile 2 - now available on Early Access

[Israfael]

You know, when you have to limit your game to "only" allow 35.8 MILLION damage per second...

It could have been 6 gorillion, but the problem would still persist - non-dot melee skills have greater sustain and scaling than dot builds (which include many elemental and chaos minion builds)

 

[Gerrard]

What the fuck is a dot cap?

https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Damage_over_time#DoT_DPS_limit

You know, when you have to limit your game to "only" allow 35.8 MILLION damage per second... it's time to re-evaluate the math and mechanics underlying your fucking game system.

When enemies can have hundreds of millions of effective HP from various multipliers, 35 Million DPS isn't much.

Yes. That's exactly the point. You understand this shit is all relative and framing it differently can include offsets to avoid such retarded inflation right?

Here you go:

Yes retard whose brain is hurt by big numbers, you are smarter than the game devs for sure and have a better oversight over the game's systems.

 

[Sweeper]

I reinstalled Path of Exile a few months back after years of not playing it, despite promising myself I'd never play it again.
Log in, go into standard league, open up my stash, get depression from seeing all the shit I have to sort through from all the previous leagues I played, uninstall.
The thought of going through the same shit all over again in PoE 2 fills me with dread.

I'LL BUY YOUR FUCKING COSMETICS CHRIS, YOU FUCKING KIWI JEW, JUST LET ME HAVE AN UNLIMITED STASH FOR FUCK'S SAKE!

 

[ArchAngel]

I reinstalled Path of Exile a few months back after years of not playing it, despite promising myself I'd never play it again.
Log in, go into standard league, open up my stash, get depression from seeing all the shit I have to sort through from all the previous leagues I played, uninstall.
The thought of going through the same shit all over again in PoE 2 fills me with dread.

I'LL BUY YOUR FUCKING COSMETICS CHRIS, YOU FUCKING KIWI JEW, JUST LET ME HAVE AN UNLIMITED STASH FOR FUCK'S SAKE!

You solve that problem by never opening your standard characters but only playing current league characters. Those always start with empty tabs.

 

[Jaedar]

What the fuck is a dot cap?

https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Damage_over_time#DoT_DPS_limit

Huh, never knew about this. I'm happy to hit one million dps, so a theoretical limit of 36 has never come closer to bother me. But I can see how this would be annoying to the people who hit really big dps numbers with other skills.

You know, when you have to limit your game to "only" allow 35.8 MILLION damage per second...

It could have been 6 gorillion, but the problem would still persist - non-dot melee skills have greater sustain and scaling than dot builds (which include many elemental and chaos minion builds)

One big (potential) advantage of dot skills is that you don't lose dps while dodging, since you (theoretically) don't need to attack every 200ms to keep full stacks up on the enemy.

 

[Perkel]

What you're playing isn't considered "true/actual melee" by the critics. Literal Heavy Strike without splash or ancestral call is what they want.

Literally yes. I want to move around the mob, hit him with my actual weapon, defend and so on. Instead of AOE one click spam which you consider "gameplay".
I also want normal mobs to last longer than one hit. In fact i want very varied mobs that actually you need to adjust to.

Crazy no ?

 

[Israfael]

One big (potential) advantage of dot skills is that you don't lose dps while dodging, since you (theoretically) don't need to attack every 200ms to keep full stacks up on the enemy.

You can do all of that with many non-dots skills like various brands (like PBoD), traps, ballistas, totems, mirror archer etc, there are literal 0-button builds that have things crit autocast or other was of triggering attacks without your actual input or need to aim (also a big plus of melee - I can literally stand still and press right button on my FBOK slayer on boss arenas or maps and kill everything on it without even moving mouse at all thanks to autoaim)

 

[Israfael]

But I can see how this would be annoying to the people who hit really big dps numbers with other skills.

Well, while 36 mil is enough to do all the current content in the game, including ubers, it's still not hard to reach in trade or even in SSF (for builds like balormage's necro holy nova), so you are put in a distinct disadvantage in terms of possible clear / difficulty of content you can do (also for sanctum it's best to have 50M+ dps to comfortably do all realatively sane combos of negative effect, so this also doesn't help much).

In fact i want very varied mobs that actually you need to adjust to.

You should have played Zizaran's challenge then, you'd fear certain mobs (like cannibals with extra projectiles and extra ele damage, those proximity shielded templars, spider things in acts 4 and 9), kill them sequentially and you wouldn't probably even finish the campaign (I tried four times and died in a8/a9)

 

[Kjaska]

"Melee build" according to people who think melee is strong:

He is literally standing inside her ass. How is that not Melee?

Is this better?


inb4 some retarded excuse about "uhm ackshully no" too much dps or something.

If you want to gimp your own ass and play dark souls simulator in PoE, you have that option. Equip Heavy Strike and never look back. Just don't come crying afterwards that you can't deal with certain content. It was you who decided to limit yourself to auto-attack.

This entire argument is like playing Magic the Gathering and using only creatures that have no abilities and then complaining you can't compete against anyone else who doesn't gimp themselves. Just play Soulslop, it caters to your self-handicapping fetish.

 

[Kjaska]

I'LL BUY YOUR FUCKING COSMETICS CHRIS, YOU FUCKING KIWI JEW, JUST LET ME HAVE AN UNLIMITED STASH FOR FUCK'S SAKE!

You literally have that on Standard. The "remove only" tabs stay there forever until you take everything else out. You can still use your regular tabs for storage.

Besides, only weirdos and people who buy currency with real money play on Standard. Completely meaningless mode. Only good for testing out builds before committing in a real League.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Is this better?

Actually, yes. Lightning strike isn't melee because it fills the entire arena- standing on the same screen as the boss wasn't even necessary. I mentioned before elsewhere that having single, massive damage strikes solves many of the problems with melee by making all the time spent dodging less of an issue. Dunno when that skill was added, but it looks like a good one. Though I'm guessing that just like with the dual strike example, it wasn't actually used for 99% of the time, and just swapped in to fight the boss. Unless it's got some proliferation nonsense that fills the entire screen. Or required a kings ransom to be viable at all.

If you want to gimp your own ass and play dark souls simulator in PoE, you have that option. Equip Heavy Strike and never look back. Just don't come crying afterwards that you can't deal with certain content. It was you who decided to limit yourself to auto-attack.

Except you can use the equivalent of heavy strike with a bow and be totally fucking fine. The point of wanting true melee to be viable is that actually needing to stand near enemies to hurt them makes the gameplay more interesting. Do you find minion builds where you don't need to cast a single thing after setting up fun? If you can understand why people find that boring, the same applies to all these skills that cover the entire screen. The difference is, GGG nerfed the ever loving shit out of minions (rightfully so) to balance that so there's a reason to play with other skills without 'gimping your own ass' as you put it.

Edit: I think people got the wrong idea from me posting a maven fight there- that was just the first video that wasn't half an hour long that came up when I typed in 'lightning strike POE.' Dealing X amount of on paper dps has obviously never been a problem for melee, and getting any skill to the point it can curb stomp a boss is meaningless without context. I'm sure someone has an endgame fucking bear trap video out there too, I don't think anyone is going to make the argument that bear trap is a totally viable skill or par with everything else.

 

[ArchAngel]

Is this better?

Actually, yes. Lightning strike isn't melee because it fills the entire arena- standing on the same screen as the boss wasn't even necessary. I mentioned before elsewhere that having single, massive damage strikes solves many of the problems with melee by making all the time spent dodging less of an issue. Dunno when that skill was added, but it looks like a good one. Though I'm guessing that just like with the dual strike example, it wasn't actually used for 99% of the time, and just swapped in to fight the boss. Unless it's got some proliferation nonsense that fills the entire screen. Or required a kings ransom to be viable at all.

If you want to gimp your own ass and play dark souls simulator in PoE, you have that option. Equip Heavy Strike and never look back. Just don't come crying afterwards that you can't deal with certain content. It was you who decided to limit yourself to auto-attack.

Except you can use the equivalent of heavy strike with a bow and be totally fucking fine. The point of wanting true melee to be viable is that actually needing to stand near enemies to hurt them makes the gameplay more interesting. Do you find minion builds where you don't need to cast a single thing after setting up fun? If you can understand why people find that boring, the same applies to all these skills that cover the entire screen. The difference is, GGG nerfed the ever loving shit out of minions (rightfully so) to balance that so there's a reason to play with other skills without 'gimping your own ass' as you put it.

Edit: I think people got the wrong idea from me posting a maven fight there- that was just the first video that wasn't half an hour long that came up when I typed in 'lightning strike POE.' Dealing X amount of on paper dps has obviously never been a problem for melee, and getting any skill to the point it can curb stomp a boss is meaningless without context. I'm sure someone has an endgame fucking bear trap video out there too, I don't think anyone is going to make the argument that bear trap is a totally viable skill or par with everything else.

My guess is both. It was just used for bossing and character costs an arm and a leg to work.

 

[Perkel]

"Look melee skill was used to kill omega boss. Melee is fine, there are no issues."

lol

 

[Cohesion]

I'LL BUY YOUR FUCKING COSMETICS CHRIS, YOU FUCKING KIWI JEW, JUST LET ME HAVE AN UNLIMITED STASH FOR FUCK'S SAKE!

You literally have that on Standard. The "remove only" tabs stay there forever until you take everything else out. You can still use your regular tabs for storage.

Besides, only weirdos and people who buy currency with real money play on Standard. Completely meaningless mode. Only good for testing out builds before committing in a real League.

How much GGG pays you to shill?
How much for putting them in your signature?
Do you get cosmetics for this or you are on a payroll?
Just curious.

 

[Gerrard]

What you're playing isn't considered "true/actual melee" by the critics. Literal Heavy Strike without splash or ancestral call is what they want.

Literally yes. I want to move around the mob, hit him with my actual weapon, defend and so on. Instead of AOE one click spam which you consider "gameplay".
I also want normal mobs to last longer than one hit. In fact i want very varied mobs that actually you need to adjust to.

Crazy no ?

You want the game to be a different genre. That's not crazy, there's another word for it.

 

[Damned Registrations]

What you're playing isn't considered "true/actual melee" by the critics. Literal Heavy Strike without splash or ancestral call is what they want.

Literally yes. I want to move around the mob, hit him with my actual weapon, defend and so on. Instead of AOE one click spam which you consider "gameplay".
I also want normal mobs to last longer than one hit. In fact i want very varied mobs that actually you need to adjust to.

Crazy no ?

You want the game to be a different genre. That's not crazy, there's another word for it.

What different genre? That's how POE used to be before all the power creep took over. Believe it or not, there period when you didn't have 100% uptime on 5 utility flasks, 50% max health/sec recovery, 200% movespeed and screen wide coverage with a single click.



I want that game back.

Edit: Melee being used back in the day:

 

[Gerrard]

Nice, you posted some dogshit zdps builds as an example of what you think the game was like, meanwhile here is a video from a half a year later of what actual PoE gameplay looked like.



The game you want hasn't existed for 10+ years, literally more than 90% of this game's existence, and for a reason.

 

[Damned Registrations]

And you posted a no life streamer with basically perfect endgame gear grinding a low level map for xp to reach 100 to pretend everything always died that easily.

What was really interesting looking for old gameplay was how many videos were around of people doing stuff before maps. Just videos of fighting Piety or Dominus, because those were actually benchmarks back then instead of irrelevant speedbumps.

 

[Gerrard]

>Poorjoy's Asylum
>low level map


Sorry to break it to you but this game was always balanced around "no life streamers" and PoE2 will not be any different.

 

[ArchAngel]

>Poorjoy's Asylum
>low level map


Sorry to break it to you but this game was always balanced around "no life streamers" and PoE2 will not be any different.

PoE2 will be different early like how PoE1 was. We all need to play that version while we can because it is going to turn to shit later.

 

[Israfael]

PoE2 will be different early like how PoE1 was. We all need to play that version while we can because it is going to turn to shit later.

Pretty sure you'd find something not to your liking and proceed to complain how the game is wrong bcause it doesn't conform to your expectation.

 

[ArchAngel]

PoE2 will be different early like how PoE1 was. We all need to play that version while we can because it is going to turn to shit later.

Pretty sure you'd find something not to your liking and proceed to complain how the game is wrong bcause it doesn't conform to your expectation.

There is no perfect game out there. But usually games have more good than bad so we keep quiet and suffer through it. Once bad outweighs the good we complain.

 

[Israfael]

Once bad outweighs the good we complain.

No one prevents you from playing in whatever fashion you want in SSF where there is no trade treadmill and pressure to go zoom-zoom to keep up with the curve. You won't (probably) get mageblood, but you can do all of the content with relative ease, just need more time as compared to trade.

Also, here I've respecced my ice nova hierophant for shield block combo (svallin + red nightmare), now I'm almost immortal (I only died after degen killed my mana regen). Considering it's not even block cap and I didn't bother with switching to crit variety of this build (i don't have the devotion timeless jewel with needed mana mods), you can do this as soon as you get shield (easy) and the jewel (requires a bit of farming):

 

[Kjaska]

A lot of interesting speculation based on the current available gem info for PoE2.

Some key points:

- people will gravitate to as few buttons as possible
- attack skills with built-in movement will be absolute aids to play with high attack speed, people won't use them at end-game
- with so much space for additional 6-links, some of the "Ultimate" skills with high damage and high cooldowns are going to be a no-brainer free addition to any build
- "spender" type abilities for charge stackers look to have the best scaling options (we D4 now "yay!")
- "cast on x" triggers seem to have no internal cooldown and can be used with spells now, making them an easy target for top builds
- all auras seem weak, heralds and blasphemy looks strong
- with the spirit and mana separation for reservation skills, mana stacking type builds will finally get to use as many auras as regular builds
- high mana costs and multiple 6-links will lead to people having to stack mana even without the scaling damage incentive
- conversion seems giga nerfed, but also much more available

 

[Kjaska]

How much GGG pays you to shill?
How much for putting them in your signature?
Do you get cosmetics for this or you are on a payroll?
Just curious.

Take your meds, kkkomrade. Your pattern recognition is turning into schizophrenia again.

What different genre? That's how POE used to be before all the power creep took over. Believe it or not, there period when you didn't have 100% uptime on 5 utility flasks, 50% max health/sec recovery, 200% movespeed and screen wide coverage with a single click.

Ah yes, the "golden era" of:

- desync every 5 meters
- nobody knows how to build good characters
- no end-game bosses
- no map sustain

yeah, in that aids of an environment you don't have a reason to build for clearspeed or damage. There are a bunch of games that still have environments like that: Souls-likes.

I want that game back.

You're not getting that. PoE2 ain't gonna be it for you.