Game News Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Kickstarter Update #99: Dev Diary #5 - All About Demons

[Tacgnol]

lawfull evil is doing things to better youself in the expense of others but in a more orderly way?

lawyers, tax collectors and politicians.

basically the worst elements of any bugman society.

Also criminal organisations and their henchman usually fall under the LE umbrella.

 

[Iluvcheezcake]

lawfull evil is doing things to better youself in the expense of others but in a more orderly way?

That would be Neutral Evil.

Lawful evil is for example a tyrant who (might or might not) cares about his subjects but rules with an iron fist, follows rules etc. And brooks no nonsense, no opposition.

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

Lawful evil is for example a tyrant who (might or might not) cares about his subjects but rules with an iron fist, follows rules etc. And brooks no nonsense, no opposition.

That's closer to Lawful Neutral.

Lawful Evil is less about following the rules and more about using them to their advantage, or working within them to their ends. They follow the rules or laws out of either fear, because the system empowers them, or else a personal code they wish to live by, but their motives are generally selfish and evil.

An example of that would be Edward Longshanks in Braveheart.



A Lawful Neutral character, on the other hand, cares about the rule of law above all else, even their own feelings or goals - or the feelings or goals of others.

 

[Roguey]

oposed case the problem would be that the developers force a moral judgment upon the player. That's usually what causes the issue with these things. It's not the existence of trannies, it's the sudden intrusion of the author screaming, "HEY, LOOK AT THIS. VERY IMPORTANT. THIS CHARACTER IS AWESOME. YOU LOVE THEM. THERE IS NO OTHER CHOICE. ACKNOWLEDGE THE HECKIN' VALIDITY."

That was also how it was in the BG blowup. It wasn't about there being a tranny (which was nonsensical in D&D world anyway since they can just magically become the actual gender with none of the IRL hangups), it's always about the tranny inserts having to be the center of attention, because that's what "queer" ideology is about in general, "pride".

This isn't like that at all (you have to pass a massively high speech check to even know about the trans backstory).

Yeah, but that's pretty bad writing. A typical example of a special snowflake character that makes zero sense.

In a fantasy setting, someone that spends a fortune on a potion to lose their dick makes little sense. If someone were turned into a man against their will, it would be justified, but this is pretty silly and an obvious case of "I want to write this, but how do I justify it?".

Tranners: *exist*
You: wtf why would someone want to magically change their sex if they had the option to do so????

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

This isn't like that at all (you have to pass a massively high speech check to even know about the trans backstory).

So special and unique that only a special and unique character may know their secret. lol. What tripe.

Tranners

You misspelled trannies.

You: wtf why would someone want to magically change their sex if they had the option to do so????

*And if it costs a fortune to do so.

Maybe you'd go to heroic lengths to de-dick yourself so that finally take Josh Sawyer's Balanced™ boner into your science magic vagina, but those of us who don't have demons running around in our heads work for more practical things.

 

[Roguey]

So special and unique that only a special and unique character may know their secret. lol. What tripe.

There's nothing particularly special about someone who doesn't want to broadcast the fact that they used to be a man and thus requires expert charm and persuasion to get the answer. Also all Player Characters in Pathfinder are special and unique, that's what this whole campaign is about.

*And if it costs a fortune to do so.

Maybe you'd go to heroic lengths to de-dick yourself so that finally take Josh Sawyer's Balanced™ boner into your science magic vagina, but those of us who don't have demons running around in our heads work for more practical things.

Hierarchy of needs. They had everything they wanted except one thing, and getting that one thing just required parting with a family heirloom; easy decision to make.

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

There's nothing particularly special about someone who doesn't want to broadcast the fact that they used to be a man and thus requires expert charm and persuasion to get the answer.

A "massively high" check though? He's a already in a lesbian marriage with an orc. It's not like he needs to maintain a reputation of traditionalism.

Again, it's just bad writing.

Also all Player Characters in Pathfinder are special and unique, that's what this whole campaign is about.

But this one has to be extra special and unique. The specialist of snowflakes.

Hierarchy of needs. They had everything they wanted except one thing, and getting that one thing just required parting with a family heirloom; easy decision to make.

More than one heirloom, if you count the family jewels.

Again, maybe removing your dick is a no-brainer to the demon-possessed trannies of today, but it's just typical SJWism if you're writing it into a fantasy setting. And I feel comfortable stating that as a fact, since the writer her(?)self says she's an SJW who deliberately inserts her ideology into her writing.

 

[Roguey]

A "massively high" check though? He's a already in a lesbian marriage with an orc. It's not like he needs to maintain a reputation of traditionalism.

Again, it's just bad writing.

In the forever-ago of the of the 20th and early 21st century, it was the tranner ideal to pass so well that no one would ever be able to tell you were a man. The idea of actually saying you were one anyway was ridiculous (and it's come about because of all the unhinged autogynephiles who have found power/influence in the trans identity). No one with an actual female body would go around talking about a past they would rather forget.

Again, maybe removing your dick is a no-brainer to the demon-possessed trannies of today, but it's just typical SJWism if you're writing it into a fantasy setting.

The guy who created the Forgotten Realms also messed around with genderbending in his novels, which I imagine you'd know about if you weren't a Joined:2020 johnny-come-lately.

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

In the forever-ago of the of the 20th and early 21st century, it was the tranner ideal to pass so well that no one would ever be able to tell you were a man. The idea of actually saying you were one anyway was ridiculous (and it's come about because of all the unhinged autogynephiles who have found power/influence in the trans identity).

He's married. There's no reason to hide it. There's no reason for him to "pass", and you inserting that modern idea is more evidence that it can only be interpreted as a fantasy version of this modern idea.

No one with an actual female body would go around talking about a past they would rather forget.

So tragic. Pretty sure remembering the past, what, 20 years of his adult life wouldn't be nearly as traumatic as the average tranny makes it out to be.

And you misspelled tranny again.

The guy who created the Forgotten Realms also messed around with genderbending in his novels, which I imagine you'd know about if you weren't a Joined:2020 johnny-come-lately.

I've been on this site since 2003, newfag. Don't know what tranny book you're referring to though. Maybe if you got specific instead of acting like a smug faggot over literally just reading a book, I could say more, but as it is, so what?

As I said before, I have no problem with genderbending in stories and have used it on characters myself. What I have a problem with is bad writing. This is bad writing. A special snowflake character that makes little if any sense, clearly inserted for modern politics. His entire identity was invented to express a political ideal. Everything else might as well be filler.

 

[Iluvcheezcake]

AFAIK thats Amber Scott garbage.
Its in the game, just ignore it.
You are wasting a lot of energy that could be used elsewhere.

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

AFAIK thats Amber Scott garbage.
Its in the game, just ignore it.
You are wasting a lot of energy that could be used elsewhere.

Do you even know what website you're on?

Besides, I'm talking about her writing, not the game at this point.

 

[Thonius]

It's an Amber Scott character what do you expect.

I had forgotten all about Dragonspear and Scott. I didn't even pay much attention to Dragonspear other than the fact that it had a tranny in it and bad writing in general. Those things alone had me not buy it until I finally purchased it do the BG2:EE BGT mod.

So all of this info is pretty new to me, especially the stuff about WotR, since I haven't paid much attention to it during its development and I never played the original campaign.

But at least now I can mentally prepare myself for the decline.

She only wrote the first book. The rest of it (the AP at least) is pretty normal.

Then again the original AP is super combat heavy anyway, so you don't interact with a fuckton of NPCs.

What do you mean bad? It actually makes sence. A city with tranny sec force got overrun and was full of cultists. Thus that char is incompetent af . Reminds you of anything IRL?

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

What do you mean bad? It actually makes sence. A city with tranny sec force got overrun and was full of cultists. Thus that char is incompetent af . Reminds you of anything IRL?

And demons are everywhere. Yeah, when you think of it like that, it makes sense...

 

[Roguey]

He's married. There's no reason to hide it.

"I'm married so it's fine for everyone to know I used to be a man."

I've been on this site since 2003, newfag.

Oh right, it's you. Broke-brained self-nuker who just couldn't stay away.

Don't know what tranny book you're referring to though. Maybe if you got specific instead of acting like a smug faggot over literally just reading a book, I could say more, but as it is, so what?

Elminster: The Making of a Mage.

As I said before, I have no problem with genderbending in stories and have used it on characters myself. What I have a problem with is bad writing. This is bad writing. A special snowflake character that makes little if any sense, clearly inserted for modern politics. His entire identity was invented to express a political ideal. Everything else might as well be filler.

Character makes perfect sense to me given the setting. You just flip your lid at the idea of a transperson being in a fantasy game.

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

"I'm married so it's fine for everyone to know I used to be a man."

Yes. Why would it matter? They already know he's an orc-fucking lesbian.

Oh right, it's you. Broke-brained self-nuker who just couldn't stay away.

As opposed to the Sawyer-obsessed nutjob, whom everyone could tell 10 years ago was a tranny in the making.

Elminster: The Making of a Mage.

lol. You mean when Mystra turns him into a woman? That's not the same at all. This is specifically the "I'm a woman on the inside, I must cut my dick off to have lesbian sex" modern tranny trope. It's specifically that, and its inclusion for political reasons that I'm against.

(Not that I enjoyed Gender Swap Fantasy: Elminster Edition, mind you. I'm just not offended by it, and don't find the concept itself bad writing.)

Character makes perfect sense to me given the setting. You just flip your lid at the idea of a transperson being in a fantasy game.

You misspelled tranny again.

 

[Iluvcheezcake]

AFAIK thats Amber Scott garbage.
Its in the game, just ignore it.
You are wasting a lot of energy that could be used elsewhere.

Do you even know what website you're on?

Besides, I'm talking about her writing, not the game at this point.

I was referring to her abyssmal writing as well.

 

[Roguey]

Yes. Why would it matter? They already know he's an orc-fucking lesbian.

Someone who believes themselves to be a woman would loathe the idea of anyone thinking of them as a man. Someone who has magically changed themselves into a biological woman has no reason to ever put the idea in another person's head that they were ever a man.

lol. You mean when Mystra turns him into a woman? That's not the same at all. This is specifically the "I'm a woman on the inside, I must cut my dick off to have lesbian sex" modern tranny trope. It's specifically that, and its inclusion for political reasons that I'm against.

In a setting where magic exists that will change a person's sex, there will also exist people who will want to use that magic. Any transpersons in the past just had to live with it because there were no options until the 20th century. And they did exist; the bible has rules against homosexuality and crossdressing because they found these people to be abominations.

 

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

Someone who believes themselves to be a woman would loathe the idea of anyone thinking of them as a man. Someone who has magically changed themselves into a biological woman has no reason to ever put the idea in another person's head that they were ever a man.

Someone who is married wouldn't care, since they've already attained a mate. And, in fact, being that they accomplished a feat defying nature, they might even be proud of it.

The idea that they would be at all ashamed of it is a modern projection. It's not universal, and for someone who claims to have been reading fantasy for such a long time, you're remarkably ignorant of that.

In a setting where magic exists that will change a person's sex, there will also exist people who will want to use that magic. Any transpersons in the past just had to live with it because there were no options until the 20th century. And they did exist; the bible has rules against homosexuality and crossdressing because they found these people to be abominations.

Because they are abominations. They're mentally unwell. When you're willing to spend $20,000 to cut off your dick and turn it into a gapping, smelly wound to satisfy your sexual perversions, there is something wrong with you.

And I'm sure all sorts of perversions existed in the past, but the realities of life took precedence over getting turned on by weird things. For you to talk about the hierarchy of needs and then not realize that in a medieval fantasy setting there might be needs slightly higher than lopping your dick off because you REALLY want to be able to have lesbian sex (and thus never be able to impregnate your partner again), well, that's just silly.

Ultimately, it's a modern idea that could only exist in a decadent, spoiled society. A society filled with gullible, midwit, sex-obsessed perverts, looking for ever increasing stimulation, attention, and a feeling of uniqueness and control of their otherwise meaningless and unfulfilling lives. This, and the fact that the author herself says she puts that sort of thing in for political reasons, makes its inclusion complete tripe.

That said, if you want to put bad writing in your brain, be my guest. I myself enjoy some bad writing or silly concepts on occasion - but I'm at least honest about it.

 

[Roguey]

Someone who is married wouldn't care, since they've already attained a mate.

With the exception of some autogynephiles, being trans is not just about finding a mate.

The idea that they would be at all ashamed of it is a modern projection.

Loud and proud trans is the modern way of thinking. Not true in the past.

And I'm sure all sorts of perversions existed, but the realities of life took precedence over getting turned on by weird things. For you to talk about the hierarchy of needs and then not realize that in a medieval fantasy setting there might be needs slightly higher than lopping your dick off because you REALLY want to be able to have lesbian sex (and thus never be able to impregnate your partner), well, that's just silly.

"Might." In this case, there aren't any.

 

[CancerUnlimited]

Last game was cartoony and generic. This one looks even more generic.

 

[Crescent Hawk]

Of course its cartoony, its fucking golarion. But I still find it insane we are getting a sequel or crpgs for that matter in 2021. Not being a pessimist just a fact.

 

[Thonius]

That's your first message on this forum pal....

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Are you turning into Lacrymas, Roguey?

 

[Lacrymas]

This seems to be an interesting conversation.

In a setting where magic exists that will change a person's sex, there will also exist people who will want to use that magic. Any transpersons in the past just had to live with it because there were no options until the 20th century. And they did exist; the bible has rules against homosexuality and crossdressing because they found these people to be abominations.

The more interesting aspect is why they thought like this, it obviously isn't random and these ideas have to come from somewhere. Homophobia is a Jewish invention imo and I'd wager it's because pagans/their rivals/oppressors (whether Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, or Romans) had nothing against it and it was easy to denounce as a political tool and as a way to differentiate themselves from paganism as the chosen people. The only source of homophobia in the New Testament is actually Saint Paul, he wrote like 2 sentences about it and that's it. There are two reasons for this - since Saint Paul had to basically make up the law as he went along because Jesus didn't speak about every scenario imaginable, he defaulted to Mosaic teachings (even though he himself had said the laws of Moses no longer apply). The second is the Nietzschean view that Christianity is Jewish revenge against their Roman oppressors, so denouncing sexual gratification as a sin was easy and readily available.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Homophobia is a Jewish invention imo

Peoples of Abrahamic faiths aren't the only ones who were homophobic in premodern times. And if you want to talk about it being an 'invention', then it's a post hoc religious rationalization for the disgust that many people innately experience at the sight of homosexual behavior rather than some cynical twisting of a 'pure' faith by its clergy.