Eternity Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Lambach]

I have found them to be useless, ended up just using alchemy + potions instead.

No potion can replace having 6+ additional damage sponges, some of them with pretty decent damage and debuffs, in any given fight. Specially considering you can effortlessly rest-spam to refresh your Figurines while potion ingredients are a finite resource.

 

[Lacrymas]

Figurines were a mistake. At least this many figurines, 1 would've been enough to reign them in while still giving you a cool item to play with.

 

[Lhynn]

No potion can replace having 6+ additional damage sponges, some of them with pretty decent damage and debuffs, in any given fight. Specially considering you can effortlessly rest-spam to refresh your Figurines while potion ingredients are a finite resource.

Have you seen how effective potions are if you max the skill? because they are just silly, one potion lasts you through the fight and turns it into a trivial matter. As for their limited supply, nothing is in short supply if you are the only member in your team.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Creating chokepoints with figurines is easiest path to victory.

 

[fantadomat]

I find it interesting that people use all those vendor-trash items. Did their patches scale the difficulty that much? I remember ravaging everything in sight on veteran story without using any consumables,fancy resting foods or many buffs. Am i missing something or what? Didn't even knew that there is such things as figurines.

 

[Shadenuat]

No potion can replace having 6+ additional damage sponges, some of them with pretty decent damage and debuffs, in any given fight. Specially considering you can effortlessly rest-spam to refresh your Figurines while potion ingredients are a finite resource.

Have you seen how effective potions are if you max the skill? because they are just silly, one potion lasts you through the fight and turns it into a trivial matter. As for their limited supply, nothing is in short supply if you are the only member in your team.

Wait for it. Insect Plague/poison was already nerfd. So would be your pot of arcane shield etc.

 

[Tigranes]

Hahahahahahahahahaha Figurines being OP has been an issue for the entirety of the POE franchise.

They are often strong enough to take down an enemy or two depending on what you match them up with, they eat a huge amount of hostile attention (there's your 'action economy' for you, genius), they create roadblocks, some of them even cast highly useful spells like charming enemies.

massive buff, holy shit

I have found them to be useless, ended up just using alchemy + potions instead.

There's enough tools in the game that you don't need them to succeed. Doesn't mean they're not OP. Most definitely don't need a 'massive buff'. Just means for whatever reason you haven't found a way to make them useful.

The way alchemy works with potions, and arcana with scrolls, does get pretty silly though. On one hand, it's good to finally see consumables that make a difference. On the other hand, pre-patch Insect Plague, or high arcana Nazpalca, just get a bit ridiculous - POE2 really can't seem to handle scaling bonuses at all.

 

[Safav Hamon]

Yeah change to figurines is idiotic.

Figurines are the most OP items in the game. Either they nerf them or take away unlimited uses, but something had to be done. I prefer the latter.

 

[Roguey]

It makes me think 2 things
1 - IE had the right idea, at least on higher levels, for staves and wands with limited charges and trash mobs and some unique figurines with exotic (but still not game breaking) creatures for "animal" classes like druid and ranger - dogge, lion.
2 - It shows how easier it is to break POE combat by throwing a few more bodies into it with above average or similar stats. And how enemies have no idea what to do with them. Ever got your summons killed off by Paladin's banish ability? Counter-spelling, banish, dismissal, all that play is absent so you get what is expected.

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, summoning was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

 

[Shadenuat]

That is a different topic. I was talking how to design items.

In IE you could summon, so could your enemies.

In PoE, you have infinite summons regardless of class equal to number of characters in party for every encounter, no threads attached.

These are not scrolls. No charges. Don't require class like being a wizard to activate. Almost no casting time. Instant extra bodies. And no enemy group in the game begins combat with using a figurine for every enemy. Pure crutch for the player.

 

[Lilura]

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, summoning was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, direct damage was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, immobilization was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, divide and conquer was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

...

 

[fantadomat]

Yup,IE games do give you a lot of options to win battles.

 

[Rinslin Merwind]

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, direct damage was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, immobilization was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

For the majority of encounters in the IE games, divide and conquer was, if not an outright win button, a "make this battle noticeably easier" button. It can never not be.

...

Sounds like IE games are easy...Oh wait they are. All this whining about IE games being superior in terms of difficulty makes me think that some people stuck in nostalgia glasses or even worse - they just just suck at playing IE games.

Spoiler

[spoiler]

 

[Lacrymas]

PoE on PotD is harder than the IE games, but nothing comes close to SCS.

 

[Lilura]

Sounds like IE games are easy

They are. After you've read my blog.

 

[Parabalus]

PoE on PotD is harder than the IE games, but nothing comes close to SCS.

SoD on Legacy of Bhaal is harder than SCS.

Much dumber coz it's stat bloat, but harder nonetheless.

 

[AwesomeButton]

some of them even cast highly useful spells like charming enemies.

With the caveat again, that in Deadfire you can cast any wizard spell you want if you have the grimoire that has it, and it's below your maximum allowed spell level. One more time, this is the reason summons are no longer such an unique advantage to have.

I am jealous. PoE never made me happy.

Then why did you play it? Even though I've been very critical of PoE, if it has kept me for 300+ hours, I can't honestly call it bad or dull, even if I can't point at the things that have kept me. I don't play games I consider shit for hundreds of hours, I simply don't have this kind of free time or masochist tendencies. Fallout 4 - pirated and played for a total of 11 hours, never came back. D:OS - never past Cyseal. D:OS2 - about 30 hours, a little after the ship battle.

Don't get how Dumpsterfire could be hard but PoE easy

What's preventing you from getting it? PoE on Hard has given me no experiences of "I just barely managed to win this combat", while in Deadfire on Veteran I've had this happen more times than I can count.
Just the fact that you can, and most probably will, play PoE overleveled most of the time, and you can turn on upscaling for Deadfire, is enough of a reason for Deadfire to be potentially a more difficult game to beat.

PoE on PotD is harder than the IE games, but nothing comes close to SCS.

I agree about being harder, but I'd specify that it's harder in a dumb way - it swarms you with enemies which move extremely fast. I found this was the major source of irritation for me in PoE - Hard is too easy, PotD is hard but it's achieved in a brute force way.

 

[Lambach]

Just the fact that you can, and most probably will, play PoE overleveled most of the time, and you can turn on upscaling for Deadfire, is enough of a reason for Deadfire to be potentially a more difficult game to beat.

Even upscaling doesn't fix the problem once you break the barrier of level 13-14, unless you're either gimping yourself in some way or deliberately going for content that's above you. The main problem with the lack of difficulty later on is that the AI is mostly functionally retarded and enemy spellcasters are largely impotent.

Take the fight with Concelhaut as an example: I have never seen this supposed "Archmage" cast a single 8th or 9th level spell - he prefers to just buff himself and auto-attack, occasionally throwing Chain Lightning or some other weak sauce shit like that. It's the same for all types of enemy spellcasters - Wizards, Priests and Druids simply don't use higher level abilities which makes it easy for your own spellcasters to dominate fights, enemy Ciphers don't even use "Whispers of Treason" ffs, enemy Chanters don't summon stuff (at least not that I recall) etc. At later levels, the only type of dangerous enemies are Rogues with their extremely high levels of single-target damage that can wreck the squishies in 2 seconds. Everything else gets blown the hell out by an Empowered Ninagauth's Freezing Pillar or two.

 

[Parabalus]

Don't get how Dumpsterfire could be hard but PoE easy

What's preventing you from getting it? PoE on Hard has given me no experiences of "I just barely managed to win this combat", while in Deadfire on Veteran I've had this happen more times than I can count.
Just the fact that you can, and most probably will, play PoE overleveled most of the time, and you can turn on upscaling for Deadfire, is enough of a reason for Deadfire to be potentially a more difficult game to beat.

You're experience is completely to the contrary of every account I've seen in this thread, including my own.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Even upscaling doesn't fix the problem once you break the barrier of level 13-14, unless you're either gimping yourself in some way or deliberately going for content that's above you.

We'll see, I'm just reaching level 13.

 

[fantadomat]

f it has kept me for 300+ hours,

Are we talking about skyrim here?

 

[AwesomeButton]

PoE + WM1&2

 

[Shadenuat]

Then why did you play it?

Happiness and satisfaction are different. Happiness is transcendent. Satisfaction can be achieved by eating a burger at McDonalds.

I am a big fat rpg-pig. So I stuff myself with burgers to close the hole where my heart was.

it was taken, by another, long time ago

Even though I've been very critical of PoE, if it has kept me for 300+ hours

I do have a ridiculous amount of hours in PoE1 as well, but that's because it is a big game +2 expansions + I tested the system to understand everything in it like killing sensukibeetles etc.

Deadfire was good for one playthrough, but most of the novelty wore out after Neketaka really.

 

[The Avatar]

Sounds like IE games are easy

They are. After you've read my blog.

Maybe the perception of IE games being hard(for some people) has to do with the 2nd edition rules and how easy it is to make an underpowered character. IE games have way more traps that will make the game more difficult. Underpowered classes like a straight thief, and plenty of useless spells. There's only a handful of useful spells in Baldur's Gate1/2 and knowing which ones will make the game much easier.

This is one aspect of IE that Pillars did not inherit. Not everything in Pillars is balanced, but that balance is much tighter so its almost impossible to make an underpowered character.

 

[Shadenuat]

Totally wrong

You can't pick "wrong" spells in IE games - because you always have all of them. It is easier to make bad build in PoE and especially Deadfire. You can pick some shit like cure poison and that's only spell you'll have for a while. Same for any other class.

In IE every class is a well rounded package doing everything you need. It's fundamentally simplier class system.