Eternity Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire Pre-Release Thread [BETA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Modron]

I don't really see it as Sawyerism because the thing he was describing in terms of losing money is really only more applicable to blobbers/jrpgs/rpgs with unlimited random encounters such that you couldn't reach a no win state via hemorrhaging money. Plus I wasn't really speaking towards balance during the first part more as in giving in more options on how to deal with encounters than kill em all/talk them down.

I personally would like to see more options to part people of their valuables especially in the face of potentially one sided combat encounters in which you just go through the motions until everyone is dead. You know the option to be an evil diplomatic bastard instead of just a pacifist diplomat.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

I actually like "unbalanced" systems like Morrowind, Infinity Engine RPGs, Arcanum, etc., the most, so it's not really about balance to me, either. I'm just saying that maybe there should be some reason to actually use the feature if it's in the game. If you make an enemy or group of enemies flee, reward it in some way. It doesn't have to be exactly the same way you'd get rewarded if you fought and won, i.e. you don't get the same item, or similar amount of items or gold. Just have some sort of system there that isn't a complete zero and/or a waste, if not even entirely penalizing.

Maybe if your party is really messed up and about to die, a last resort Fear spell would make the enemy book it. In that case, you are at least rewarded for a clever way to end the battle by saving your ass. Maybe this takes place on a harder difficulty level with an option turned on that you can only save in towns, thus it adds a lot of weight to your decision and a very good incentive to do anything to stay alive, even casting Fear and having your opponents run away. As you can see, you can take this deeper.

As for losing stuff in RPGs, the mainstream probably don't like that at all, but if you can slowly groom a sort of gameplay that is challenging, has a lot of risk/reward and different options, perhaps more RPG gamers will check them out and see what the draw is. Because honestly, Lords of Xulima Hardcore Ironman is freaking fantastic, but most would rage-quit in the first 30 minutes. However, a campaign to show people what these types of games offer can maybe make more and more people want to try this type of experience, rather than gaming just being Easy Mode with very minimal thought required.

 

[Prime Junta]

If you make an enemy or group of enemies flee, reward it in some way.

There already is a reward: you don't expend resources on the fight.

If that's not appealing enough, demand harder combat and more restricted resting. If you're low on resources, avoiding a fight can become very attractive.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

True. Then resources have to be scarcer, combat more difficult, resting/saving restricted, etc. In other words, Lords of Xulima Hardcore Ironman.

 

[Rivmusique]

more restricted resting.

Hoping for only single use rest spots this time, personally.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

I'm just hoping that RPGs like this one start adding more difficulty options in general. Let us tailor the game a bit. Several difficulty levels and a la carte options would be great I think.

 

[Prime Junta]

I'm curious about the latest teaser. If it's not Kana, it looks like it's some other, more martially-minded type from Rauatai, on a mission to bring order to the Deadfire archipelago.

Question is, what would a Rauatai military expedition be doing there? Rauatai is way to the north. Are they doing British style global empire-building, gunboat diplomacy and all?

 

[Infinitron]

It could be one of Kana's siblings.

 

[Sizzle]

I'm curious about the latest teaser. If it's not Kana, it looks like it's some other, more martially-minded type from Rauatai, on a mission to bring order to the Deadfire archipelago.

Question is, what would a Rauatai military expedition be doing there? Rauatai is way to the north. Are they doing British style global empire-building, gunboat diplomacy and all?

From what I remember Pallegina saying, Rautai is in a sort of naval cold war with the Vailian Republics, so this could be just some sort of way that the both of them (or just Rautai) are expanding their influence - by establishing colonies/military outposts on the lawless Deadfire Archipelago.

It could be one of Kana's siblings.

Now that could turn out interesting (even if Kana Rua isn't a companion) if his brother/sister is completely different in character than him (which the quote certainly suggests).

 

[Sannom]

We already know that Kana's family is at odds with his beliefs, he said as much in the game. The only one who lent him a somewhat sympathetic ear was his father, and he's the guy who built the wall around their capital's port. The rest seems to be various shades of warmongerers.

 

[Sentinel]

I'm curious about the latest teaser. If it's not Kana, it looks like it's some other, more martially-minded type from Rauatai, on a mission to bring order to the Deadfire archipelago.

Question is, what would a Rauatai military expedition be doing there? Rauatai is way to the north. Are they doing British style global empire-building, gunboat diplomacy and all?

It's the fish-guy that is talking to Edér in that dialogue screenshot Sawyer published a while ago. It was something about "Gary's Show", and it also showcased that dialogue checks would be based on party attributes and not PC. His name starts with P.

 

[Prime Junta]

Peregund.

I'd be surprised if that's his actual name though, as Peregund is a minor character from Pillars, and not an aumaua.

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

There already is a reward: you don't expend resources on the fight.

If that's not appealing enough, demand harder combat and more restricted resting. If you're low on resources, avoiding a fight can become very attractive.

That is appealing and it's Lords of Xulima Hardcore Ironman for me right now. You actually have to manage your resources to survive, which includes avoiding certain combat encounters (Camouflage skill) and managing a bunch of other things wisely.

 

[Sentinel]

Peregund.

I'd be surprised if that's his actual name though, as Peregund is a minor character from Pillars, and not an aumaua.

Yeah, his name is probably placeholder, like the dialogue options. But he has a portrait, so he's either a companion or a VERY story-relevant NPC (Thaos-tier relevant).
Also party stats for dialogue checks instead of PC's alone almost make me drop this game. Fucking hate that shit. It was shit in Tyranny, it will be garbage in PoE. No incentive to replay the game.

 

[Sannom]

Since when are the party stats used for dialogue checks in Tyranny? Aren't you confusing those with lock-picking checks?

 

[Deleted Member 16721]

Also party stats for dialogue checks instead of PC's alone almost make me drop this game. Fucking hate that shit. It was shit in Tyranny, it will be garbage in PoE. No incentive to replay the game.

I didn't play Tyranny. What do you mean by this?

 

[Prime Junta]

Yeah, his name is probably placeholder, like the dialogue options. But he has a portrait, so he's either a companion or a VERY story-relevant NPC (Thaos-tier relevant).

Or the whole thing just might be placeholder written up to test new features in the dialogue system. The portrait certainly looks far from final quality.

Edit: also, the location is the temple of Hylea. I.e. certainly placeholder; I would be extremely cautious reading anything at all into it, other than perhaps the possibility to check party stats in dialogue.

Spoiler

 

[Sannom]

I didn't play Tyranny. What do you mean by this?

Don't listen to him, he's drunk. I've played Tyranny and I have no idea what he's talking about.

 

[Sentinel]

Also party stats for dialogue checks instead of PC's alone almost make me drop this game. Fucking hate that shit. It was shit in Tyranny, it will be garbage in PoE. No incentive to replay the game.

I didn't play Tyranny. What do you mean by this?

When a stat check is present in dialogue, if your player character doesn't have the required stat but some party member does, you can pass the check anyway. This is also sometimes present in cumulative form (the most stupid one). That is, all the characters in your party add to the stat score, and you can pass the check that way, even if your PC has 0 in it. So, for example, if you have 2 in mechanics, but happen upon a lock that requires 13, and you have a rogue with 11 mechanics, you pass the check because 11+2=13.

I didn't play Tyranny. What do you mean by this?

Don't listen to him, he's drunk. I've played Tyranny and I have no idea what he's talking about.

If it wasn't Tyranny that did it, it was some other shit game. I tend to mix big piles of shit together.

 

[Sannom]

If it wasn't Tyranny that did it, it was some other shit game. I tend to mix big piles of shit together.

Not one by Obsidian, I believe. Unless it was Storm of Zehir, but that didn't have a PC.

 

[Turjan]

Meh. It's a party-based game. In general, it's okay to use the highest party skill in most situations. It's better than not letting you choose companions for tasks at all. In conversations, it's admittedly the most questionable choice. In some games, the companions just chime in.

Unrelated, I wonder whether the Adra Dragon will show up in POE2, in case you let her go? She left the area by ship.

 

[2house2fly]

Peregund.

I'd be surprised if that's his actual name though, as Peregund is a minor character from Pillars, and not an aumaua.

Yeah, his name is probably placeholder, like the dialogue options. But he has a portrait, so he's either a companion or a VERY story-relevant NPC (Thaos-tier relevant).
Also party stats for dialogue checks instead of PC's alone almost make me drop this game. Fucking hate that shit. It was shit in Tyranny, it will be garbage in PoE. No incentive to replay the game.

Checks will probably have much higher thresholds to compensate. I'd prefer a more content-based implementation, not being able to unlock certain things unless you have a specific party member with you, or companion-based flavour to the skill check lines. I'm optimistic that there'll be something like that, White March and the stronghold additions showed a lot more effort put into the content side of things.

 

[Turjan]

 

[AN4RCHID]

Yeah, his name is probably placeholder, like the dialogue options. But he has a portrait, so he's either a companion or a VERY story-relevant NPC (Thaos-tier relevant).

Man, I hope they invest in a more portraits for non-companion characters. PoE would have benefited from more memorable side characters.

 

[Projas]

Sounds like another Vailian companion. Twitter also says "26.", announcement date likely.