Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Quake 4

NecroLord

Dumbfuck!
Dumbfuck
Joined
Sep 6, 2022
Messages
14,724
Quake 4 is a great game and actually Raven's last good game before the dark times of them being Activision's bitches.

That being said, it is not without some flaws.
Cinematics and setpieces, the squad system taking away from the original Quake 1 and 2 heroic one-man army gameplay, rather lackluster early game (something it shares with Doom 3) that only starts to get intense and brutal after the infamous stroggification sequence (maybe right at the Tetranode level, depending on your viewpoint).
The enemy design is really good, and not just visually, enemies like the Berserker are now actually threatening compared to their Quake 2 versions.
Also has some vehicle sections, the tank one is by far the best, while the bipedal walker one is rather lacking.

Discuss.
What did Quake 4 got done right and where did it fail?
 
Self-Ejected

gabel

fork's latest account
Patron
Joined
Mar 27, 2023
Messages
2,032
It had worse multiplayer than Q3 (obviously, you can't beat perfect), and the SP-campaign was shit as well, with awful, forced vehicle-sections etc. Doom 3 SP was better than Quake 4, not to mention the original Quake and even Quake 2, which Quake 4 was basically the sequel to.
Yeah, Quake 4 was completely unnecessary shit.
 

Lemming42

Arcane
Joined
Nov 4, 2012
Messages
6,806
Location
The Satellite Of Love
It feels like Raven just sort of doing their thing, by the numbers. It's not bad at all but it's like if an AI was asked to make a game in the style of early 2000s Raven.
 

MasterofThunder

Guest
The "strogg" storyline of Quake II and 4 are just plain bad. It really should have been it's own IP, so that a genuine "Quake II" could've revolved around more Lovecraftian fare. Quake 4's failure is a direct result of how ugly it looks from an aesthetic standpoint IMO, nevermind it's gameplay. Doom 3 suffers from this to a lesser extent, but there is something about the way Id Tech 4 renders it's visuals that puts me off entirely. It has this uncanny valley effect that no other set of games has managed to give me, not even the original Far Cry which is similar in some spots.

The infamous Quake 4 "stroggification" sequence also perfectly encapsulates why I dislike both games. Body horror for body horror's sake. Morgoth's Review touched upon this in one of his videos a few years back on horror movies, but he basically talks about the transition that occurred in Hollywood when horror movies shifted from supernatural horror to body horror. He makes an example of the film "Silence of the Lambs", and how it attempted to quantify Evil itself as a mere symptom of societal ills or chemical imbalances. A liberal, seemingly more rational explanation of the problem of Evil, which the denizens of the gay 90s lapped up without a second thought. Quake II and 4 are spiritual kinsmen to this line of thinking. In the strogg storyline, pre-Call of the Machine I suppose, there is no supernatural element. Just a cold, heartless, and unfeeling robot army that seeks to assimilate mankind into it's collective. Even the final boss itself is a machine. As opposed to Quake, where you are fighting an unknowable evil that has it's tentacles in numerous dimensions, in Quake II and 4 it's just pure material phenomenon. You're just trying to avoid being put on the meat hook next. It's very nihilistic and off-putting, but you are distracted by the loud blaring rock music to notice I suppose.
 

baba is you

Educated
Joined
Mar 11, 2023
Messages
126
Location
No. I'm not a freaking chatbot.
Hmm, Quake 4 has some rail sections. Because this is used repeatedly, there are sections where the level and combat become meaningless. In particular, there is no difference between a tank and a robot.

And even off this rail section there are some problems. Enemy design is better than Quake 2, but resource management, one of the main design elements of classic FPS, has deteriorated significantly. Even if you run out of health, ammunition, or armor, you can quickly replenish it by interacting with nearby NPCs.

I don't think this design is a good design. Bioshock 1 also had very poor resource management, but Quake 4 is... in some ways even worse.
 

Beans00

Erudite
Shitposter
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Messages
1,710
Quake 4 is a great game

No it wasn't, you're trying to do contrarian revisionism.

The only thing Quake 4 managed to do, aside from killing raven with poor sales. Was be the 3rd best FPS in the 360's starting lineup, out of 3. Worse than call of duty 2 and.... Perfect dark zero...
 
Last edited:

Baron Tahn

Scholar
Joined
Aug 1, 2018
Messages
668
I dunno it was alright. Just standard for the time. I did like the strogging bit and how it started to translate the language after it happened. Just a bit too much on rails spectacle and not enough game. Always felt like it could've shuffled some stuff around, few more missions, strogged a bit earlier, one more visit to the hub with a bit more to do there than just watch a show....shooter campaigns are hard and I've always preferred Im sims...Hard to know how to fix it without making it 'not a shooter'.
 

JDR13

Arcane
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
3,997
Location
The Swamp
I thought it was "ok" for it's time, but looking back, it was the worst of the three big id Tech 4 games (Doom 3, Quake 4, Prey) by far.
 

Freedos

Educated
Joined
Feb 17, 2020
Messages
59
I wouldn't say it's a bad game, but it's the worst Quake single player game by far. And yeah, worse than Doom 3 and the original Prey.
 

Darth Roxor

Rattus Iratus
Staff Member
Joined
May 29, 2008
Messages
1,879,034
Location
Djibouti
Quake 4 is a great game and actually Raven's last good game

No and no. Q4 did not excel in any way to deserve being called great, at most it was OK. It was also not the last good Raven game, because both Singularity and Wolfensteen '09 were enjoyable despite their various flaws.
 

Fargus

Arcane
Joined
Apr 2, 2012
Messages
3,848
Location
Mosqueow
I don't like it. Replayed it a few years ago and it's even less enjoyable than older Quake games. Good thing Q4 is really forgettable aside from strogg body horror shit.

French president boss is a joke. I think he can die under a minute if you just spam the BFG knock off at him.
 

ind33d

Learned
Joined
Jun 23, 2020
Messages
1,799
It had worse multiplayer than Q3 (obviously, you can't beat perfect), and the SP-campaign was shit as well, with awful, forced vehicle-sections etc. Doom 3 SP was better than Quake 4, not to mention the original Quake and even Quake 2, which Quake 4 was basically the sequel to.
Yeah, Quake 4 was completely unnecessary shit.
Q3 didn't have a campaign. Of course Q4 had worse multiplayer, it had to work on both single player and PVP
 

rumSaint

Educated
Patron
Joined
Sep 1, 2023
Messages
178
Location
Poland
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
Quake 4 sucked. Forced squad AI teammates. Dumb plot, weak multiplayer.

Only good thing was the stroggification part.
 

NecroLord

Dumbfuck!
Dumbfuck
Joined
Sep 6, 2022
Messages
14,724
Only good thing was the stroggification part.

Also the intro video where a corpse floats in space, and the horror-themed levels where you meet the transfers. The edgy shit is always the best in shooters.
Medical Facilities followed by the Waste Processing and Putrification Facility were definitely the best levels in the game.
I also liked the Nexus Core.
 

Gandalf

Arbiter
Joined
Sep 1, 2020
Messages
754
The only things I remember from Quake 4 are: flying arm in space and that jump scare at the first hours of the game.
 

Be Kind Rewind

Dumbfuck!
Dumbfuck Zionist Agent
Joined
Mar 14, 2021
Messages
595
Location
Serbia
Discuss.
What did Quake 4 got done right and where did it fail?
It's pretty bold to claim that Quake 4 was great but nothing was ever gained by parroting the same old line, especially if it was one handed to you by someone else. It's conventional "wisdom" that Quake, with its incoherent mishmash of failed ideas for an RPG with hints of poorly executed Lovecraft and terrible bosses is the best shit ever, and that Quake 2, with its focused on more mission-based gameplay was a step in the wrong direction. Quake 4 then by actually being the only game in the series to actually be a fucking proper sequel to an earlier game, is treated much in the same way as its ancestor. Despite being an edge connoisseur I never cared much for the original Quake in terms of setting nor the NiN soundtrack. I still admire it for the purity of the gameplay.

Since they are all made in the same engine people tend to bundle together Doom 3, Prey (2006) and Quake 4. It's an objective fact that Prey is the best of the three, partly because like Duke Nukem Forever it had perfectly retained a design and script from the peak of the genre in the 90's and Human Head perfectly executed a 90's shooter in that era when consoles rose and the PC was in decline, and unlike DNF it kept the best bits in and didn't change into a console first shooter. In my conception Prey is the final great shooter in the old style until the recent revival which resulted in only a handful of worthwhile games, one among which was running on the Build Engine.

Doom 3 on the other hand was a total failure at being a sequel and sought to achieve something much more like System Shock, with only a few enemies at the time, very dark locations forcing you to use a flashlight, and audio logs and door codes. Quake 4 in comparison is much more of a throwback, one last hurrah for the Quake series, and was to follow up on the only coherent setting and plot in the series. So far so good, it was better than Doom 3.

But even if you had asked me around the time, it was released the same year as F.E.A.R. by Monolith, who at that time retained their PC shooter excellence, so I'd compare it to that. Perhaps that's an unfair comparison, even Monolith's blunders blow most others, and perhaps particularly indie efforts out of the water. Blood 2's gunfeel and impact was top shelf despite the game being essentially unfinished. Other games from the same year are more flattering to Quake 4, Call of Duty 2, one of the worst series of mainstream shooters was released then. But perhaps one of the issues with Quake 4 is that it wants in on that game, of military cinematic shooters. In Quake 2 you were dropped into a hostile world as a lone survivor, the few humans you meet are driven insane by the troon-humanist shit going on.

What makes it hard to evaluate Quake 4 is in what you compare it to, if you consider that it managed to retain a lot when at the time Serious Sam had gone over to consoles with Serious Sam 2, a game most fans of the series wants to forget, or that Deus Ex spinoff that was rebranded as Project: Snowblind, you have to give Raven credit. I mean, if you asked someone to play Quake 4, Vietcong 2, Pariah and then Bet on Soldier in a couple of sittings they'd probably, if they had any sense and taste, tell you that Quake 4 was great in comparison. But now that Quake 4 is older and was too outdated in the time of Call of Duties, Battlefield 2's and console shooters like TimeSplitters at the time to get a proper following it gets compared to the icons of the genre instead of where it was historically situated. Being old school without being a retro callback doomed it to being underrated and underappreciated. Even Prey, which had the interactivity and dynamism of a Build Engine game or SiN has fallen into relative obscurity, so what chance did it stand?

Not only do you lose the impact of the first time when you make a sequel years later, nobody was very impressed with Quake 4 when Half-Life 2, for good and mostly ill, had come out the year before, but typically, if something is great enough to warrant a sequel or spawns a genre, or establishes principles, then that first instance is in most cases the best. Quake 4 is not a bad shooter, nor even mediocre, it is professionally made, it keeps to the core tenets of a pure shooter, it has great skyboxes, tested and true weapons, good craftsmanship, but since it wasn't revolutionary like Quake was it was destined to never become iconic or even very memorable. Despite the transhumanist themes being more relevant than ever now and the gameplay being comparatively very true to the genre when genre-mongrels are the new standard.


TL;DR: It's a better game than retro revivalist boomer shooters or the Ashes mod for Doom, and certainly most of the competition at the time. It was just made in a bad period, some of that influence can be found in the game with the CoD wannabe stuff or vehicle sections. Nobody remembers the bad games of the time though so people with no memory of the time will rate it shit since they compare it to Quake 1.
 

Beans00

Erudite
Shitposter
Joined
Aug 27, 2008
Messages
1,710
This thread has impressed me a bit on the codex. Good job everyone.

Sorry NecroLord. I would say I agree with your gaming takes 70% of the time, but this quake 4 hipster revisionism isn't going to work. Game was too garbage.

Be Kind Rewind I'm not going to pretend I liked doom 3 all that much. That being said doom 3 blows quake 4 the fuck out of the water. Doom 3 was dark, and shitty, and the flashlight thing was stupid. Doom 3 was also absolutely mind blowing for graphics at the time.

Quake 4 was literal generic garbage. Absolutely trash game, only made because it was an easy title with recent brand recognition and either MS or ID/Raven wanted easy sales being a launch title. This didn't work because the 360 also shipped with call of duty 2(a game series I don't particularly care for), and call of duty ate quake 4 then shit it out. Then perfect dark zero(which wasn't very good lol) ate quake 4 again, then also shit it out.

Doom 3 sold 3.5 million units
Quake 4 barely sold 400k

Stop coping lol.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom