Risen 3: Titan Lords

[Dreaad]

You guys are such a bunch of hypocritical bastards. At least he isn't lying through his teeth in that interview. Do you really need to hear the "Best game EVAR!!! EMOhTIONz!!! Huge world!!!! Consequences!!! Gridmark!!!!" speech again. Ffs here is a developer telling you the truth and most of you think he's an asshole.

I can guess what he is talking about, and it has nothing to do with not trying to make good games. He's just maki

 

[Bubbles]

To those saying they should revive Gothic - a brand name can only get you so far:

After two days of sales, Gothic III and Gothic III Collector's Edition are sitting pretty atop Germany's media Control Charts, placing first and second, respectively. More than 100,000 copies were sold in the first weekend, making Gothic III the most successful game of the year in Germany. On the UK sales charts, Gothic III placed 4th.

JoWooD sent out a PR praising Arcania's early sales success on German market. Their RPG climbed to the #1 spot in the official PC full price charts and reached #2 in the XBox charts.

The PC version sold 27.000+ units within the first week while the XBox 360 game was sold through 3.600 times.

 

[curry]

The one thing I liked about Risen 2 is that they managed at last to maintain the exploration/social/combat balance throughout the whole game, more or less, while all previous games turned into linear hack & slash shortly before midgame.

What? Risen 2 had a bunch of corridors. No exploration. No cliffs to climb, weird places to find, none of that Gothic exploration shit.

 

[Lord Andre]

I never understood why PB is acting like it's such a big mystery what made g1, g2 and risen well received. A pattern is easy to discern:

- Rather small open map with vertical design e.g. a dungeon below a cave below a hill on top of which there is a tower and you need to dive, walk, climb,jump and backtrack to find them all.
- 3 factions to join exclusively with 3 tiers with exclusive armor and quests.
- combat where rhythm and timing are important.
- no level-scaling
- skillpoints with trainers

How hard can it be to follow this simple formula ? And if you must innovate just keep to these core rules and add shit on top.

 

[Bubbles]

I never understood why PB is acting like it's such a big mystery what made g1, g2 and risen well received. A pattern is easy to discern:

- Rather small open map with vertical design e.g. a dungeon below a cave below a hill on top of which there is a tower and you need to dive, walk, climb,jump and backtrack to find them all.
- 3 factions to join exclusively with 3 tiers with exclusive armor and quests.
- combat where rhythm and timing are important.
- no level-scaling
- skillpoints with trainers

How hard can it be to follow this simple formula ? And if you must innovate just keep to these core rules and add shit on top.

Large environments were very hard to implement on last gen's consoles, but publishers would be extremely hesitant to fund an exploration game that didn't compete on multiple platforms. With the Xbox One, we should be seeing a marked improvement in the quality of exploration-based RPGs.

 

[imweasel]

If Risen 3 reaches the quality of Risen 1, then it will be great game. One of my fondest memories of Risen was entering the swamp after playing the game for 10 minutes - and getting my ass handed to me. This was totally unexpected after playing so much (level scaled) popamole during past years. The feeling of progression in this game is excellent.

Somehow I don't really think PB will try and return to their roots and will instead go full popamole on Risen 3.
Many publishers seem to try and follow Bethesda's design methodology to an even greater extent nowadays, which is "more retardo = more sales". Although the game must also be a hiking simulator for it to impress the retards, many publishers seem to oversee this little fact. If it is a hiking simulator then they can make game as shitty as they want, the retards will gobble that shit up and praise it as one of the greatest games ever made.

 

[General Maxson]

I never understood why PB is acting like it's such a big mystery what made g1, g2 and risen well received. A pattern is easy to discern:

- Rather small open map with vertical design e.g. a dungeon below a cave below a hill on top of which there is a tower and you need to dive, walk, climb,jump and backtrack to find them all.
- 3 factions to join exclusively with 3 tiers with exclusive armor and quests.
- combat where rhythm and timing are important.
- no level-scaling
- skillpoints with trainers

How hard can it be to follow this simple formula ? And if you must innovate just keep to these core rules and add shit on top.

Large environments were very hard to implement on last gen's consoles, but publishers would be extremely hesitant to fund an exploration game that didn't compete on multiple platforms. With the Xbox One, we should be seeing a marked improvement in the quality of exploration-based RPGs.

All the exploration games wanted and needed by publishers and most of the gamers today are Skyrim and Fallout 4, unfortunately. Gothics and Risen haven't sold nearly as much as Bethesda "exploration" games and there's no much incentive for the devs, or publishers to make and fund such games.

Popamole and better sales is all I expect now.

Edit: Ah, ninja'ed by imweasel.

 

[Sunsetspawn]

Would you like to go back to developing a new Gothic game?

Oh, ok, the following only represents my own opinion:

To be honest: not really. The one who develops a new Gothic, will get his fingers burned. He will be slashed by magazines and burned alive by die hard fans.

The expectations for this game would be so high, we couldn’t meet them.

The times have changed, the Gothic games lived up by a different mood, we were much more experimental back in the day. Something that was very exciting and the player could feel this loose and playful approach, but this also led to exorbitant developing times and many many bugs. We fixed this, but we also parted from this sand box developing approach.

If you really read between the lines it's much sadder than that little smilie indicates. The truth behind these words is that PB no longer has the talent to attempt such a game. The individuals who are directly responsible are gone. I don't actually know this for a fact, but that's what those words say to me.

 

[NotAGolfer]

Fuck it, now I definitely have to play Risen.
Thanks for the recommendation, after Gothic 3 I didn't expect it to be any good, especially after a rather meh review by a reviewer I kind of trust.

 

[Bubbles]

Many publishers seem to try and follow Bethesda's design methodology to an even greater extent nowadays, which is "more retardo = more sales". Although the game must also be a hiking simulator for it to impress the retards, many publishers seem to oversee this little fact. If it is a hiking simulator then they can make game as shitty as they want, the retards will gobble that shit up and praise it as one of the greatest games ever made.

Not all new RPGs trend towards Skyrim. Remember, Bioware pointedly went for less freedom of exploration with DA2, citing Call of Duty as an example of an RPG with limited exploration and great mass appeal.

 

[Infinitron]

Many publishers seem to try and follow Bethesda's design methodology to an even greater extent nowadays, which is "more retardo = more sales". Although the game must also be a hiking simulator for it to impress the retards, many publishers seem to oversee this little fact. If it is a hiking simulator then they can make game as shitty as they want, the retards will gobble that shit up and praise it as one of the greatest games ever made.

Not all new RPGs trend towards Skyrim. Remember, Bioware pointedly went for less freedom of exploration with DA2, citing Call of Duty as an example of an RPG with limited exploration and great mass appeal.

...and you saw how that went.

I think the days of the "cinematic corridor RPG" may be at an end. They're all going to go in an open world direction now. Trying to ape cinematic shooters hasn't proven itself financially. Mass Effect's sales pale next to Skyrim's.

 

[General Maxson]

Many publishers seem to try and follow Bethesda's design methodology to an even greater extent nowadays, which is "more retardo = more sales". Although the game must also be a hiking simulator for it to impress the retards, many publishers seem to oversee this little fact. If it is a hiking simulator then they can make game as shitty as they want, the retards will gobble that shit up and praise it as one of the greatest games ever made.

Not all new RPGs trend towards Skyrim. Remember, Bioware pointedly went for less freedom of exploration with DA2, citing Call of Duty as an example of an RPG with limited exploration and great mass appeal.

...and you saw how that went.

I think the days of the "cinematic corridor RPG" may be at an end. They're all going to go in an open world direction now. Trying to ape cinematic shooters hasn't proven itself financially. Mass Effect's sales pale next to Skyrim's.

I dread to say it, but it's for the best IMO. Those linear cinematic corridor shooters brrrrr--- even bethesduh games are more interesting... That was the bottom of the barrel IMO. And it's considered the pinnacle of rpg games. :shudder: I read that some guy said to a bethesda fan that if he wants to experience a "real true hardcore" rpg experience, he should leave "popamole" bethesda games and try those new bioware masterpieces. Bethesda is for "casuals".

Not to mention with open world games, there's a miniscule chance of , whether with linear corridor shooters I am certain nothing good would come out off.

 

[imweasel]

It isn't the open world that makes Bethesda's games so terrible, it's their very own and very special Todd Howard. The world in Skyrim is actually ok, Bethesda just filled it up with fucking terribly designed content, broken RPG mechanics and dumbed it down to absolute retard level.

Spoiler

The areas in Skyrim, New Vegas and Bethesda's games in general span over thousands of square kilometers - yet in-game you can run across the map in 10 minutes, tops. Doesn't feel very open world to me. Fallout and Arcanum are true open world games and they convey this feeling too.

Open world (Fallout, Arcanum)? Yes, definitely. Hiking simulator (Skytard, Oblivishit)? Not really.

 

[Bubbles]

The areas in Skyrim, New Vegas and Bethesda's games in general span over thousands of square kilometers - yet in-game you can run across the map in 10 minutes, tops. Doesn't feel very open world to me.

You realize there are mods that reduce movement speed by a factor of twenty or thirty, right?

 

[DefJam101]

The problem is that the games are almost entirely about exploring environments and the environments are fucking boring

 

[Murk]

You realize there are mods that reduce movement speed by a factor of twenty or thirty, right?

Yeahhh... I don't think his complaint is about the walking pace so much as it is about the actual size of the game.

 

[Renegen]

The areas in Skyrim, New Vegas and Bethesda's games in general span over thousands of square kilometers - yet in-game you can run across the map in 10 minutes, tops. Doesn't feel very open world to me.

You realize there are mods that reduce movement speed by a factor of twenty or thirty, right?

Just searched for such a NV mod and found nothing.

It's a valid complaint though, what we have is the "Moon crater" RPG experience where every interesting area is very close to each other and there is a lack of real environments to seperate areas.

 

[deuxhero]

Morrowind and Gothic 1 got it right: Don't even pretend the game area is this huge place and make the world VERY detailed to make up for it.

 

[DalekFlay]

The problem is that the games are almost entirely about exploring environments and the environments are fucking boring

Obviously not for the 20 million people that buy their shit up.

Yes we can call them shitty hiking simulators, but people obviously love to hike. The key to appealing to random Codexers as well, if this is even a goal of theirs (which I doubt), is to compliment the hiking with interesting quest design, writing, factions and lore. Morrowind and New Vegas, widely enjoyed here on the Codex and seen as the pinnacle of hiking and CRPG combination, excelled in those areas. Oblivion failed completely in those areas. The difference isn't hard to see.

Skyrim was better than Oblivion in those areas. Hopefully Bethesda keep moving forward.

Why the fuck this is being addressed for the 100th time in a totally unrelated thread is the real question. Risen 2 actually failed in the hiking area, a totally different problem.

 

[Irxy]

The one thing I liked about Risen 2 is that they managed at last to maintain the exploration/social/combat balance throughout the whole game, more or less, while all previous games turned into linear hack & slash shortly before midgame.

What? Risen 2 had a bunch of corridors. No exploration. No cliffs to climb, weird places to find, none of that Gothic exploration shit.

It did have all those things, though obviously not on the level with previous games.
Anyway, I was talking about balance - which is a big improvement by itself, imo - not the quality of individual elements, because lets be frank, combat and social elements also sucked.

 

[DalekFlay]

I actually quite enjoyed the musket combat, very unique for this kind of game, and the traditional PB dialog style was still entertaining.

If the game wasn't corridor island after the first couple locations I would have genuinely liked it.

 

[theSavant]

Fuck it, now I definitely have to play Risen.

Don't get yourself hyped. The game was so linearly dumb, that I never touched it again after the first hour. But hey, check the demo version and judge by yourself.

 

[Visperas]

If the coming old-school games are succesful I expect someone to try and make a true Gothic-like game. But I don't think PB will.

 

[Irxy]

I actually quite enjoyed the musket combat,

Haven't tried it. But melee is bad - annoying at 1st when every lowly mob kills you in 2 hits, while you must hit them 20 times, and you have to roll around crazy like some Geralt to survive and wait 5 minutes for regen between battles (a cheaty pistol helps though since it ignores armor), but just after a little while you become a killing machine roflstomping everything - I killed the final boss in 3 hits or so, lol. Also magic is useless, although the few mind control scenarios were fun.

traditional PB dialog style was still entertaining.

How? No branching, no c&c, no rp options, very few skill checks and all of them do nothing but give you some useless cash, the majority of characters are traditionally boring and undeveloped.
Sure, it has never been a focus of Gothic games, but I don't see why it can't be improved, considering they kinda planned it by giving you a crew.

 

[Tigranes]

Fuck it, now I definitely have to play Risen.

Don't get yourself hyped. The game was so linearly dumb, that I never touched it again after the first hour. But hey, check the demo version and judge by yourself.

Fallout 2 was so fucking corridor, I played it for half an hour and then never touched it. Also the whole fucking game is full of cave people, it's nuts.