Codex Interview RPG Codex Interview: Torment: Tides of Numenera

[Ninjerk]

I'm not sure it actually is a positive feature. People think it is, but the games that actually feature it in some regard (say, Age of Decadence talker routes) have had a lot of detractors. There are things the Codex likes theoretically, but then reacts to in an adverse way.

I liked the ratio of dialogue/walking to combat in Dead Man's Switch, I'm imagining Torment will be comparable but with more freedomsssssssssss.

The last time I checked it out, AoD's talking routes were go here, spend time in menus, go there, spend time in menus. It lacked the walking-around-looting-containers-and-discovering-side-quests aspect that people enjoy in Fallout and Torment that will no doubt be present in New Torment.

I don't think you do the disconnect justice by saying "go here... go there." More like "teleport here.... teleport there." It makes the game feel like a slideshow.

 

[eremita]

G. Zeits:

I think problems arise in new settings when characters are flat and boring, stories are clichéd, the audience isn’t emotionally invested in what’s happening, and the creators are relying upon the details of the setting itself to interest the audience. A lot of hard science fiction falls into this trap. Writers can become so focused on communicating the details of the setting that they fail at job #1, which is creating an engaging story.

I would agree with this, if he said that this approach is the right one assuming you're actually working on a story focused game (more of a book/movie format, like PT or BG2). But I get the feeling he's talking generally here in which case I disagree... Well, first and second sentence are rather optional, only substantial part is this: "the audience isn’t emotionally invested in what’s happening". Let's face it bros, the intellectual value of the story is not enough unless you really give a shit and cliché and boring characters never stopped anyone from enjoying something (these kind of people are actually emotionally engaged because they like flat characters and cliché).

Anyway, my point is, IMO you don't need an emotionally engaging story in RPG (unlike in books, movies) because the narrative could be different. So I disagree with this: "...and the creators are relying upon the details of the setting itself to interest the audience.". The world itself, if designed with detail but primarily designed to stand on its own (Planescape Torment is not that, PT is designed around TNO), should work itself. Simply put, from the perspective of human perception, the world/setting has to work the same way our world works (which is impossible in the book and movie, or any format in which you are basically BEING TOLD something, no matter how ambiguous) and that's enough, because then the imaginary world shares the same key thing with our world: you are actually exploring something that exists outside of you, thus being open to different grasps, which ultimately leads to creating your own story and that is the most emotionally engaging story of them all...

 

[Gondolin]

Anyway, my point is, IMO you don't need an emotionally engaging story in RPG (unlike in books, movies) because the narrative could be different.

I couldn't finish IWD 2 because there was no story to make the game interesting, to make me want to keep playing.

 

[himmy]

Gene Wolfe.

*Googles name*

Wikipedia article pic is this:

*instant audiobook download*

 

[eremita]

Anyway, my point is, IMO you don't need an emotionally engaging story in RPG (unlike in books, movies) because the narrative could be different.

I couldn't finish IWD 2 because there was no story to make the game interesting, to make me want to keep playing.

IWD is linear Dungeon Crawler...

Gene Wolfe.

*Googles name*

Wikipedia article pic is this:

*instant audiobook download*

He's the fucking gem! I recommend the Soldier series (there are three installments, Soldier of the Mist, Soldier of Arete and Soldier of Sidon - The first two I have read already and they're great). Although It's set in the Ancient Greece and it requires some knowledge about the era...

 

[Gondolin]

IWD is linear Dungeon Crawler...

Ah, you want to DISCUSS the definition of a Role Playing Game. Right. No.

 

[eremita]

IWD is linear Dungeon Crawler...

Ah, you want to DISCUSS the definition of a Role Playing Game. Right. No.

Nope. I said not every RPG game has to be what Zeits said to be great. By pointing out that IWD is linear Dungeon Crawler, I showed that it's not the kind of game I was talking about (so saying that you couldn't finnished IWD cause story was lacking is non-sequitur). Simple as that. We can discuss why if you like, I wasn't sure anyone was interested in that so I didn't want to waste my breath...

 

[Aeschylus]

it’s reminiscent of Ravenloft (one of my D&D favorite settings), and you get to play as a monster – three things I’d love to see in a CRPG.

Please, please convince someone to let this man make a real Ravenloft RPG.

 

[Elhoim]

I'm not sure it actually is a positive feature. People think it is, but the games that actually feature it in some regard (say, Age of Decadence talker routes) have had a lot of detractors. There are things the Codex likes theoretically, but then reacts to in an adverse way.

I don't think it was a lack of combat per se that was people's issue with Age of Decadence. Besides which, if you look at the recent poll, it seems its reputation has been rehabilitated somewhat.

Which poll?

 

[likaq]

I'm not sure it actually is a positive feature. People think it is, but the games that actually feature it in some regard (say, Age of Decadence talker routes) have had a lot of detractors. There are things the Codex likes theoretically, but then reacts to in an adverse way.

I don't think it was a lack of combat per se that was people's issue with Age of Decadence. Besides which, if you look at the recent poll, it seems its reputation has been rehabilitated somewhat.

Which poll?

I think Infinitron refers to this poll : http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/the-second-list-of-incline-new-poll.91705/

 

[Roguey]

I think Infinitron refers to this poll : http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/the-second-list-of-incline-new-poll.91705/

Ehhhhhhh look at the ratios of the two polls. 61.1% versus 61.4%. I think VD even started a poll not too long after the first demo's release that showed the majority of posters here liked it well enough. A good chunk of the 40% really hate it, but that's true of everything. That thing Spazmo said.