Review RPG Codex Review: Pillars of Eternity, by PrimeJunta

[Kev Inkline]

This review was so well received that it's been included in felipepepe's book, albeit in slightly condensed form
http://i.imgur.com/btTHq2B.jpg

Ah Bubbles digging dirt on people's past once again.



....
That being said, I like PoE.

 

[felipepepe]

Couldn't have Roxor calling it the worst Obsidian game ever... that honor now lies solely with Tyranny.

 

[Excidium II]

Couldn't have Roxor calling it the worst Obsidian game ever... that honor now lies solely with NWN 2.

FTFY

 

[felipepepe]

NWN2 gave us some cool mods and MotB. PoE gave us DRAMA. Tyranny is such a boring cash grab that even hating it seems like a waste of time.

 

[Bubbles]

The official Codex review should be out shortly, so we can discuss it in the comment section there.

 

[Excidium II]

NWN2 gave us some cool mods and MotB. PoE gave us DRAMA. Tyranny is such a boring cash grab that even hating it seems like a waste of time.

At least it's not NWN 2.

 

[Suicidal]

I agree NWN 2 is the worst* Obsidian game I've played. However MoTB is the best Obsidian game I've played, so I guess it balances out.

*Haven't played Dungeon Siege 3 and Alpha Protocol so not sure how they would compare.

 

[FeelTheRads]

*Haven't played Dungeon Siege 3 and Alpha Protocol so not sure how they would compare.

Both are shit, though not worse than NWN2. Tough to beat NWN2 at that.

 

[Excidium II]

*Haven't played Dungeon Siege 3 and Alpha Protocol so not sure how they would compare.

AP is great, DS3 is a bit shovelwary but at least it's very playable fantasy beat 'em up, and as far as I know the only game using Obsidian's (now dead) internal engine.

 

[Infinitron]

as far as I know the only game using Obsidian's (now dead) internal engine.

South Park.

 

[Excidium II]

as far as I know the only game using Obsidian's (now dead) internal engine.

South Park.

Surprising, thought it was jewnity.

 

[Lurker King]

This review was so well received that it's been included in felipepepe's book.

Do you see that, felipepepe? Prima Junta’s review ends saying that PoE is a deep game, has massive replayability and has better gameplay than BG2. This is the kind of danger I was warning you about in that other thread. Later on, some unadvised player will read this review completely oblivious of what he is getting into and will buy this shitty game. What is the point of talking about cRPGs if we have no standards? None whatsoever. Your book should be titled "Fanboy cRPG book".

 

[FeelTheRads]

AP is great

At what? At being a CYOA? One of those "you only get it if you play it 15 times"?

Perhaps, didn't care enough to bother with the shit gameplay to even finish it once.

 

[Excidium II]

At being a fun game with cool characters, C&C and headsmashing.

 

[Fairfax]

As I told felipepe, despite being someone extremely biased against PJ, I thought it was a decent review for someone who liked the game. However, it does have some bullshit: "massive replayability" and "natural evolution of the originals", in particular. How many of the Obsidian fanboys here have finished the game twice? Hell, with massive replayability they should be playing it 4, 5, 10 times.
Also, to say it succeeded in meeting expectations is no longer just his opinion, he's describing what everyone else thought as well. It's completely unnecessary and adds nothing to his analysis. Objectively speaking, the game didn't deliver many things that were promised, which makes it even worse.

 

[felipepepe]

Prima Junta’s review ends saying that PoE is a deep game, has massive replayability and has better gameplay than BG2.

No, he points out it has worse encounters, worse story and worse areas, plus a tacked on stronghold & mega-dungeon. But he prefers the character system (which took 2 years of patching to fix), even thought it's very different from the one in the IE games.

I think that's fair, reviews don't have to mirror my opinion. It's better to let authors expose their arguments - i.e., both M&M VI and M&M VII reviews claim they are "the best in the series" and both authors make their point. I'm not gonna go "LOL, you can't write that bro, M&M VII is clearly better".

 

[Lurker King]

AP is great

At what? At being a CYOA? One of those "you only get it if you play it 15 times"?

Perhaps, didn't care enough to bother with the shit gameplay to even finish it once.

AP is poorly designed. The C&C is suffocated by the retarded minigames and the trash mobs. So no, it fails even at that. You have to endure a lot of shit to try new things.

 

[Excidium II]

both M&M VI and M&M VII reviews claim they are "the best in the series"

I don't even

Guess if you consider 1-2, 3-5 and 6-9 different series.

 

[Lurker King]

reviews don't have to mirror my opinion.

It is not about mirroring your opinion, it is about doing an editorial job and preventing authors from including obvious falsehoods. Saying that PoE has massive replayability is like saying that BG2 has few spells. Keep your mind open but not so open your brains fall out.

 

[Excidium II]

Saying that PoE has massive replayability is like saying that BG2 has few spells

Replayability is subjective, being an AoDrone you probably consider replayability = exclusive content. And BG2 has a lot of spells but most are trash so in practice it does have few spells.

 

[felipepepe]

While I vastly prefer BG's logic of character building, it's true that PoE is based around building any party you like, and that people are replaying it that way - there's a PoE subforum just for character & party builds, and every community I look is still debating what party they'll build and what they should play next - including the Codex.

That's replayability.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

While I vastly prefer BG's logic of character building, it's true that PoE is based around building any party you like, and that people are replaying it that way - there's a PoE subforum just for character & party builds, and every community I look is still debating what party they'll build and what they should play next - including the Codex.

That's replayability.

Still, how many people discussing builds for their next run actually go through it and replay the game? Offering a variety of different PC builds/party compositions is not the only thing that affects replayability, what's also important is the degree to which said different builds result in a different gameplay experience. Not to mention that the base content of the game has to be good for you to actually go through it again (and not get bored) once you've already beaten the game once.

There are still people replaying IE games (well except IWD 2) 15+ years later, time will tell whether it will be the same case with PoE (and its sequel).

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

That's replayability.

No, it's only replayability if the gameplay is different enough for it to be enjoyable - and preferably the choices and consequences/content as well.

Otherwise it's only "replayability" for the 1% of spergs who would replay virtually any game anyway because they are spergs and want to sperg out and play it X odd way for the challenge. Which I am guessing is where those codexers might fit in - those of them that actually finish their 2nd playthrough and don't just get bored and quit.


It's about what is replayable for the vast majority of users. If you make the dumb argument that:

Replayability is subjective,

then you make virtually any game "replayable" and that makes the word lose its meaning.


This is basically the "mario is an rpg" argument though, so it's not really winnable. You are going to argue your definitions and I'll argue mine.

It's why you can't take what anyone says at face value and have to delve deeper. It's "replayable"? Why? What makes it so? Maybe the reviewer just liked it so much that he thinks he could play it again (even if he never finished it to begin with, which happens). Maybe he just looked at all the options on character creation or dialog and assumed it's replayable - which is my guess here.

 

[Roguey]

How many of the Obsidian fanboys here have finished the game twice? Hell, with massive replayability they should be playing it 4, 5, 10 times.

I'm probably going to play it again soon due to a lack of other things to do and my attempts to replay D:OS and Wasteland 2 being a near-total bust.

 

[felipepepe]

It's about what is replayable for the vast majority of users.

Vast majority of users don't even finish most games. Do you really think the vast majority of people who bought BG2 finished the entire campaign multiple times?