Development Info Second ToEE path details

[Azael]

Hell, even Conan O'Brien did a joke about Bertram, saying that it was easier to have a gay marriage in the game than explaining to D&D fans what a woman was.

As far as I'm concerned, about the only thing Troika did right with ToEE was the combat, maybe the character animations as well, most of everything else was crap or just not done in a satisfactory way.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

I'm not so sure on the combat. Did anyone else have serious issues missing every damn monster in the temple? Bugbears especially, around that area with the Hill Giant who wimps out and apparently joins you (but then fails to follow you and then makes you kill him when you talk to him again).

I'm just hoping I messed my character up, but I've got a neat compilation screenshot of 22 straight misses in a row.

 

[Anonymous]

Nope, I didnt have a problem. Which character is the one missing, the monk?

 

[Azael]

The RMG does seem to be messed up in the game, I agree about that.

 

[Sol Invictus]

I can confirm that there was definitely something amiss with the rolls. This has been fixed. Your monks will not miss so often now.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

It ain't monks. It's 5 Paladins. ALL OF THEM (well, the 3 that weren't unconscious by that time) missed 22 times in a row against Scorpp the Hill Giant (NOTE: Because I wanted to encounter some of the apparent numerous bugs first hand, I haven't installed the patch). Screenshot: 22 Misses all in a Row.

Break down of what the image is showing you:
DarkUnderlord = 0 hits out of 8 attacks (4 of which are Attacks of Opportunity).
Sir Hurtalot = 1/8 (4x aoo - hits on last aoo)
Sir Slashalot = 0/7 (3x aoo)

22 misses in a row before we hit.

0. Hurtalot hits Scorpp for 6 hp.
1. Slashalot misses
-. Scorpp reloads, hits Slashalot for 2 HP.
2. DarkUnderlord misses.
3. Hurtalot misses.
4. DarkUnderlord misses aoo.
5. Hurtalot misses aoo.
6. Slashalot misses aoo.
-. Scorpp reloads, hits Slashalot for 3 HP.
7. DarkUnderlord misses.
8. Slashalot misses.
9. Hurtalot misses.
10. DarkUnderlord misses aoo.
11. Hurtalot misses aoo.
12. Slashalot misses aoo.
-. Scorpp reloads, misses Slashalot.
13. DakUnderlord misses.
14. Slashalot misses.
15. Hurtalot misses.
16. DarkUnderlord misses aoo.
17. Hurtalot misses aoo.
18. Slashalot misses aoo.
-. Scorpp reloads, misses Slashalot.
19. DarkUndelord misses.
20. Slashalot misses.
21. Hurtalot misses.
22. DarkUnderlord misses aoo.
23. Hurtalot hits Scorpp for 11 HP in aoo.

The really annoying thing though, is that there doesn't seem to be any way of increasing my chance to hit without levelling up. I mean, I can't sacrifice the damage done to make a more focussed attack and it's not like Fallout where I can take an aimed shot at a part I'm more likely to hit or even move closer to get the enemy in better range. It seems I'm stuck with whatever the dice roll is, which personally is annoying.

It's like a giant game of chance where all you do is roll the dice, roll the dice and hope you win.

 

[Sol Invictus]

Scorpp has 40 natural armor. Bug.

 

[Elwro]

Scorpp has 40 natural armor. Bug.

I killed the giant with a 4 lvl party and iirc it was quite tough, but manageable. I had similar RNG problems later, though. Mysteriously, restarting the PC helped.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

I think you just suck, DU. I murdered Scorpp in several games. Murdered him dead. Dead. Dead. Dead. Just like his Worg. Killed him too. I win. You suck.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Worg I can hit though. It's the damn Giant that's giving me headaches. I really must suck though. I'm still missing the odd monster 20 times in a row here and there.

I did manage to kill Scorpp in the end, eventually.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Okay, this is getting ridiculous. I've installed the patch and I'm stilling missing like some kind of 12 year old trying to chuck a turd through the eye of a needle.

I think I've got all the right proficiencies to be using the weapons I am and I'm not using Power Attack or any of that shit. My attack roll bonus is +10 for most of the characters and I'm still having real trouble hitting some of the monsters. After scraping through a fight with 4 Will-o-Wisps (miss, miss, miss hit - dead oh thank God for that) and then healing (4 guys were unconcscious by the end of it and I had to reload / reload every time I missed with him, just to score a hit and survive), I've taken out some mushrooms tried attacking a lamer, retreated, gone back to get some healing and am now having serious issues taking on the 4 legged lamer-thing.

Here's my save game: DarkUnderlord and his band of Good Paladins.
It's Save Slot01 so I figure if you've already got a slot 1 save game, unzipping and renaming all these files to slot XYZ should fix that (or moving your slot01 files to a backup directory and then replacing them later should work too).

Can someone, anyone take a look at my characters and tell me what's nerfed about them? Did I tick the "Nerf my Paladin" option somewhere or the "Yes, I'd like to Miss a lot because it's fun, fun, fun!" option? All I can think is that I've seriously messed up.

 

[Elwro]

Well, Will o'Wisps have AC of 29. That's quite high and I couldn't hit them easily, too.

 

[Spazmo]

DU, it's just because the random number generator is wonky. It's supposed to get fixed in the next patch.

 

[Walks with the Snails]

Okay, this is getting ridiculous. I've installed the patch and I'm stilling missing like some kind of 12 year old trying to chuck a turd through the eye of a needle.

...

Can someone, anyone take a look at my characters and tell me what's nerfed about them? Did I tick the "Nerf my Paladin" option somewhere or the "Yes, I'd like to Miss a lot because it's fun, fun, fun!" option? All I can think is that I've seriously messed up.

OMFG, noob. Just kidding.

I looked at your party, and they are a little, shall we say, gimpy. They were all carbon copies of each other and had somewhat questionable feat selection. I would have picked up cleave rather than blind-fighting, for instance. At the end, my tanks had 30+ AC's, yours were all 20-21, probably because you didn't have any party item crafters. Bad DarkUnderlord. You had hardly any magic items at all. It can probably be done with your party, you're just tying both your hands and probably some other important things behind your back.

As far as the wisps, that's where having a magic user helps. They're really tough to hit, but spells lay them low pretty quick. If you just like the whole paladin idea, at least multiclass one into a cleric or something. Next game. Or just try to find NPC's that can round out your party.

 

[Anonymous]

I still beat them up without using item creationists, heh.

Just hoard all the phatlewts

 

[DarkUnderlord]

They were all carbon copies of each other

They're Brothers in Arms! They like to whack stuff with weapons, it's their life!

As far as the wisps, that's where having a magic user helps.

Magic users? Pah. My men have no need for trickery!

If you just like the whole paladin idea, at least multiclass one into a cleric or something. Next game. Or just try to find NPC's that can round out your party.

Heh. Thanks. I mean, I know I haven't chosen "the best" options, even now I'm still figuring out the system (I'm not a D&D junkie and to me, a lot of it - even mentions in the manual - seems to be written for someone who's played D&D PnP at least a few times before). My main problem is figuring out what I can do about it. It's also frustrating that I can't do things like sacrifice number of attacks per round, or damage caused per attack, in return for a bonus to hit. I end up getting stuck in a save / reload round about, reloading until I hit, then saving, moving on to the next guy and reloading him until he hits.

DU, it's just because the random number generator is wonky. It's supposed to get fixed in the next patch.

I hope so.

You wanna know what's really funny though? Patch 1 makes a "Tip of the Day" thing appear. Which is great. I left the "display tips" checkbox on thinking that every time I start for the day/session, a new little helpful bit of advice will pop-up. Only, instead of "Tip of the Day" it's actually a "Tip of the Map Change" because every time I move to a different map (be it going inside an inn, or moving between rooms in the temple) a new "Tip of the Day" pops up!

I'm a *tad* concerned that Troika seemingly managed to stuff such a simple thing up. I mean what, didn't they even play-test it themselves at all? In the end I had to turn it off because it just got ridiculous (well, that and after walking through a few maps in the Temple I'd just about read every tip there was).