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Wizardry Silvern Castle

octavius

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Since I'm too lazy to make a Let's Play (making screencaps, posting them and making links seems like a major chore), I'll instead make a thread where I jot down my impressions of this rather obscure Wizardry clone.

It's an Apple only game from 1988, same year as Wizardry 5, but was not released until 1999, so you will find very little discussion about it on the internet. The major discussions, from a BBS, are collected in a PDF file name Tome of Arcane, which can be downloaded, along with the manual and the game itself from the Silvern Castle home page.

Getting it to run can be a problem, but fortunately a busy Bee has done the hard work for us:

Yes, I should even have an AppleWin-compatible HDD image somewhere. Let me check... Here it is: http://www.mediafire.com/download/mjdw6axp8v8ha3s/silvern_castle_9.5.1_autoboot.hdv

It's a hard disk drive image, do not load it into the floppy slot. Instructions: Run AppleWin -> Press F8 for options -> In the Disk tab, Enable hard disk controller in slot 7 -> Select HDD 1 -> Select the image you've downloaded -> exit the options, run the game. (If this doesn't work for you, just follow the instructions on the website.)

So get AppleWin and follow the above instructions. Only problem I've encountered was to get the "Closed Apple"/Options key to work; I had to switch from Norwegian to English (US) keyboard.

The graphics is just as lovely as those of Wiz 1-5. Here's my party heading back to town after their latest foray into the Maze:
v4iW53c.png


The gameplay is pretty similar too, but with some additional rules/annoyances, like Encumbrance.

According to the manual stats can go both up or down at level ups, but so far the worst thing that's happened was that one character got no stat increases at all.
In Wiz 1-5 you only got bonuses if having stats of 16-18. In Silvern it's my impression that they are more evenly distributed.
It still pays to max out stats, though, since the game has a facility called the Proving Grounds, where you can "buy" and "sell" stat points. So if you start with 18 Luck and 6 Str, you can sell 1 point of Luck and buy 3-4 points of STR, while at character creation all points have the same "price".

When you get enough stats and character levels you can promote characters to prestige classes, like Ranger, Druid, Assassin, Wizard, Monk and Mystic. One interesting thing is that the game even features the change classes back and forth scheme of Wiz 6-7, even though written before those games. Doing so may in fact be a way to oppose the main decline compared to the Wizardry games: Level Scaling.
The level scaling is blatantly obvious. My lvl 1 party encountered only single parties with 1-4 enemies. At lvl 2 they encountered single parties with 1-6 enemies. At lvl 3 they can meet up to two parties with 1-8 enemies each.
At lvl 3, while still exploring lvl 1 of the Maze, some monsters start fleeing from combat.

I have explored nearly all of lvl 1, and I can't say I'm directly impressed.
It's not bad, just a bit bland.
The maps are 27x27 in size, but there's very few squares of interest. On lvl 1 there's no fixed encounters and only a handful of messages. The author seems to have been a world class Apple fanboi, since nearly every message mentions Apple.

Other things I've noticed:

There's no monsters in the rooms, they are most usually found just outside the room, and less frequently in the hallways.

There's a more limited menagerie than on the first level of Wiz 1, but each enemy seems to have a wider variery of equipment, and many will use items. If the program takes several second to generate the encounter, you know it will be a big one...

Using the currency from D&D with copper coins weighing down your party was not a good decision, methinks.
The game is much more configurable than other blobbers, so you can make the party ignore everything less valuable than gold coins, for example.

The game has also adopted D&D's rule of making demihumans very powerful in the beginning, but useless at the highest levels.
So a major decision in the game will wether to use demihumans or not, or use them only in the beginning.
Personally I went with a Dwarf Fighter, a Hobbit Thief, a Gnome Cleric and an Elf Mage. Of these only the Fighter and Cleric has made a difference so far. The Dwarf since he's a killing machine and the Gnome because she's got lots of spell points to cast healing spells. I have't seen single chest so far for the Hobbit to meddle with, and there's little need for casting mage spells on lvl 1 of the Maze.
The game is supposed to be harder than Wiz 1, but so far I've had only one character death - the Elf Mage. Resurrection cost is far lower than in Wizardry, but I decided to replace him with a Human Mage instead.

In combat a character does not die immediately if going below 0 HP. Instead he's dying, so if you heal him before taking another blow, you can save him. This combined with low Resurrect cost makes the game easier than Wiz 1 so far.

Stay tuned, as my party prepared to descend to lvl 2 of the Maze.
 
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I played this quite a bit several years back. I remember the levels being pretty dull; mostly just 2-3 tiles per level that had anything interesting. I remember the last level (10?) having a fair amount going on though.

I never bothered with demihumans. I just made a party of all humans, and don't recall having any particular difficulties. As you noticed, when creating a character, its best to raise one stat as high as possible, and then redistribute them at the training ground. This will result in higher stats overall. Another related note is to make sure a character does not have any stats at 18 before they level. Lower any that are and use the points to raise their other stats. A stat at 18 has no chance of being raised, so you may as well have as many chances to raise them as possible.

Getting a character to be able to change to a mystic takes a fair amount of work:
All of the character's stats must be raised to 21 (if I remember right). It costs something like 100 points to raise a stat above 18. You'll need to lower several stats by several points in order to do this each time. However, a mystic has all the abilities of all the other classes, so they're pretty useful.
 

octavius

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That's good advice about how to use the Proving Grounds.

Meanwhile, my party has explored about half of lvl 2, which is not very different from lvl 1. It has the same 'theme' of just a nondescrepit maze, with much the same enemies, only one lvl higher + rats and bats. Lvl 2 Fighters can drop Chain Mail, which is nice.

The only noteworthy thing my party (which has had a few personell changes) has encountered is a group of friendly orcs.

F8XAyfa.png


There's no alignments in Silvern Castle, but is it possible there are Choices&Consequences?
 

Crooked Bee

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Not sure about any C&C in this one.

The dungeon levels aren't so good in this game, either. Still, it is a pretty interesting Wizardry-like RPG.

Also, making an LP isn't such a chore, really. Just batch-upload your screenshots to imgur and put some comments under each of the images.
 
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octavius

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Oh well, it suits me better to write small updates more frequently anyway, so here goes...

Finally something excting happened as we found a Lair:
8FkhSsk.png


The Chief went down in one swing from Stamm Bladecaster, and the rest was not much of a threat.

The Lair contained the first treasure chest I've found so far, but unfortunately my Human Thief was not able to disarm the trap and open it. You can't just go 'lol, i'll just let it blow up in my face' (well, actually you can, but the chest will remain locked) in this game, so we will never know what was in that chest...

But this led to me to decide to bring back my retired Hobbit Thief, and let him handle things until Alex Ander is up to speed (or Agility, I suspect).
 
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octavius

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There's no monsters in the rooms,

Correction: no wandering monsters. It looks like every 2x3 room has a chance of containing a lair, and the chance is calculated every time you (re)enter a level, and the higher your characters' level the higher the chance of finding a lair.
The first lair I found, where I had to leave a treasure chest, was populated by Goblins when I returned to it, and when I accidentally walked into another room that was previously empty there was now a lair there too.

I'm now halfway through lvl 3, and the only magical weapon I've found so far i a Long Dagger +1. I also found a Ring of Fireballs (worth a whopping 1900 gp), from a wandering Enchanter, but alas it can only be used by my Mage who already can cast the spell normally. I had hoped my Thief, with his high Iniative, would be able to use it.

Also, one thing I forgot to mention earlier about stats, is that Agility does not decrease AC in this game.
And I don't know if Vitality work retroactively or not. In any case HP allocation does not work the same as in Wiz 1-3, where your total HPs are recalculated (but never decreased, you always get at 1 HP) every time you level up.
So I'm not sure if maxing out Vitality for all my characters was a good idea, considering how cheap Resurrection is, and how easy the game has been so far. It would probably have been better to max out Agility on my Human Thief at least.
 
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Crooked Bee

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What did ya find interesting about this one?

Most Wizardry clones clone the character system as well, down to a tee. This one doesn't. It still emulates Wizardry, but does a lot of its own things, for better or for worse.
 

octavius

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My party is down on lvl 5 now, and there's still not much excitement.

Reading the Tome of Arcana (comments from player from when the game was released), it seems the game orignally was significantly more difficult, and people had problems surviving their first battle, and were forced to use parties of Dwarf Fighters in the front line.
So far I've had one character death (which I could have avoided if I had bothered to throw in a healing spell).

And only twice has a monster's special attack affected one of my characters, once a Paralyze attack and once a Thief stole the only quest item I've found so far - the Silver Key. But fortunately it was still on the Thief's corpse.
Enemy spell casters are also very reluctant to cast spells.
So all in all it looks like the game was made too easy in it's final version.

The level design is rather disappointing. All levels so far look the same; there's no themes or individual touch to any of the levels, just semi-random rooms and hallways. No Spinners, no Darkness (although there are areas which are illuminated), no Anti-Magic zones, no traps, and no fixed encounters so far.
Just large and bland levels. :(

Still, character development is very rewarding, and so is slowly getting better gear.
 

TigerKnee

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Most Wizardry clones clone the character system as well, down to a tee. This one doesn't. It still emulates Wizardry, but does a lot of its own things, for better or for worse.
That sounds interesting. Maybe I'll give it a try even if the dungeons are apparently not stellar
 

octavius

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Found something that looked promising on lvl 5:
3V4tlG0.png


2Q0WRa4.png


But then it turns out it's just the senile old court Wizard, sending us out on a quest we had already undertaken.

On lvl 6 we found something more interesting - a Wishing Well. In true Avatar style I dropped all the coins my party was carrying, into the well, hoping my great sacrifice would turn into profit. And it did, giving most of my characters bonuses to their stats, and one to lose 4 years of age. But the one to benefit most was Alex Ander:

LGlZENa.png


Not only did his Agility increase to 19 (not attainable on level ups), but he now also qualified for promotion to Assassin:

RMk7kzb.png


Unlike Wizardry characters don't lost stats when switching class.

But the game starts to feel less like Wizardry, and more like Bard's Tale, and joins the latter in the ranks of the Badly Balanced Blobbers.
It's not quite as bad as the mid game of BT2 and 3, where monsters always acted first, and never hit, but I did start to feel a kind of deja vu when most of the monster act first in a round, and they very rarely hit.
 

octavius

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Almost ready for lvl 8. I think there are 10 levels in all the the first if the three parts.
Got a Ranger, Monk (critical hits) and a Druid. If I had abused the character class changing system I would have had them much earlier, but who in their right mind would do that in a game as easy as this one? Getting a Wizard is harder, since you need to be lvl 15, and my Mages are currently only lvl 11.

Haven't even seen a Dragon yet. In the first version of the game people started seeing them on lvl 5 before getting roasted.

That's all for now. Move along, folks (yes, all three of you), there's nothing exciting to see here.
 

octavius

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Things suddenly got much hairier when I descended the stairs to lvl 9 and was met by the Demon Welcoming Comitte. I actually had to teleport out of that fight by invoking a Red Amulet. More Deja Vu from the Bard's Tale series, but from BT1 this time, where difficulty increased dramatically as you started to meet groups of Greater Demons on the last couple of levels.
Agility seems to be the all important stat in the end game, since it has the most effect on Initiative.
Stats seems to be capped at 21. At least that's the highest you can get from the Proving Grounds.

No party deaths yet, and still only one character death.
 

dragonbait

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I haven't gotten around to playing through Silvern Castle yet but have been enjoying reading your thoughts about playing the game in this thread. The Demon Welcoming Commitee sounds interesting and super kudos to Crooked Bee for the autoboot file! :mrpresident:
 

octavius

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So far I've only found +1 equipment, + a Giant Slayer sword from looting, and bought some +2 items from the store.
But then we entered an old vault on lvl 10 that had already been looted, but searching the remains of the fallen guardian of the vault we found a Scimitar +2, Padded Armour +6 (nice for my Druid who can hardly wear anything) and a Leather Helm +9.
It's also possible to Enchant items at the store, but for the items worth enchanting the prices range from 450,000 to 1.2 million gold coins, which is more than I have.

Level 10 is also protected by an anti-Teleport field, so I think I'm getting close. But there are signs that I must traverse some watery area (the moat perhaps) before meeting "The Foozle".

Sorting out loot is becoming a major chore, and the option to Skip Mundane Loot does not seem to work. :argh:
 

octavius

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Highlight of the game so far was finally finding a Dragon Lair, resulting in 256,000 XP, about 100,00 gold and scrolls of all the high level spells. Mother dragon had 10,000 HP and was accompanied by a Pup, and some undead. Unlike regular lairs which have only one treasure chest, the dragon lair had six; one in each sqaure.
Managed to scrape enough money to Enchant a 2H Sword, which is the weapon with the highest base damage.

The Monk is the weakest of the prestige classes. Critical Hit only mean extra damage, and using hands and feet they can't hit undead and dragons. Also they are more restriced in which items (wand, rings and such) they can use.
 

octavius

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Things are getting a bit more interesting now. Most of lvl 10 has been explored, except a cave-in cut off the way into the south-western part of lvl 10. There's also a door for which I have no key.
So the only place left to explore is the moat (reached by casting Teleport "out of bounds"), which on the auto-map is called Lvl 10U. I guess I need to find a key down there, or an alternative way up to the SW part of lvl 10.
 

Lhynn

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Things are getting a bit more interesting now. Most of lvl 10 has been explored, except a cave-in cut off the way into the south-western part of lvl 10. There's also a door for which I have no key.
So the only place left to explore is the moat (reached by casting Teleport "out of bounds"), which on the auto-map is called Lvl 10U. I guess I need to find a key down there, or an alternative way up to the SW part of lvl 10.
lvl 10 is the last lvl? doesnt that mean its a short game?
 

octavius

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lvl 10 is the last lvl? doesnt that mean its a short game?

No, the levels (11 with the moat) are large 27x27, the encounter frequency is high, the game is slow (emulated Apple Basic), and it takes a lot of time to sort the loot. So it takes longer than it should.

I just encountered The Foozle and his henchdemons and henchdragons, and had to flee.
I can protect against their spells and breathing, but I can't kill them fast enough to avoid my character getting Stoned when hit by Demons.
So far only two character deaths, and having to flee twice. A sign of a game that is too easy, at least for a blobber.
 
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octavius

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And so, yet another in a long range of evil masterminds with the cunning plan of sitting in their lair at the bottom of a large dungeon, waiting for some adventurers to put them out of misery, joins the ranks of so many other evil masterminds before them.

Q7m9ifm.png


Of these the Cruds (Grelbs or something) were the most dangerous, since they could both Gulp characters (out of battle until the Gulper is killed) and destroy equipment. Second most dangerous was the Fiends (Maze Demons) with their Stoning Attacks. Drachma and the Dragons were relatively harmless as long Silence and Breath Attack Shield was up.
All had thousands of HP each, so spells like Stun and Death Ray which halve HP were essential.

EKaLBX6.png


5igGKYg.png


UYsZo87.png


Returning the Castle, we are challenged by the Castle Guard.

z37P10D.png


Roleplaying evil mercenary types: "Pfff! We'll mow them down like they were invalids!"

One round later:

DxjBts8.png


So why the hell weren't those motherfuckers sent down in the dungeon instead of lvl 1 neophytes?

Anyway, the canon ending:

baFNqo3.png


z9KG5B0.png


tuk9jPJ.png


slb4BJ8.png


There's also mention of how to proceed to Senario 2, but I can't say I'm very tempted.
 

octavius

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Dying is much the same as Unconscious is the Gold Box game, and can be healed in battle if you are quick enough. Unlike Wiz 7, it's not possible to raise the dead in combat.

BTW, not only the graphics was cloned, there's also Zilwan Rods and Tiltowatt Rods.
 

octavius

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So now that I've finished the game (or at least the first of the three scenarios), what's the verdict?
Well, I must say it's one of the weaker TB blobbers I've played, not in the same league as any of the Wizardry games.
The level design is bland. No traps, no Darkness! zones, no anti-magic zones or any such fun stuff. Apart from the last two levels, all the levels are self contained. There are a couple of chutes, but they are marked on the auto-map. On level 11 you'll have to find a path through a field of teleporters (a larger version of the one in Wiz 4, but all the teleporters are marked on the automap when stepping next to them. :roll: So not really a challenge

Encounters are too frequent, and the loot is just too much; it takes just too much time to sort through it. There is an option to Skip Mundane Loot, but it doesn't work.

You can change classes, but unlike Wiz6-7 stats are not reset, so it's easy to get to the prestige classes and get lots of HP fast by abusing this feature. I didn't since the game was too easy. The only way to lose stats seem to through being Raised from the dead, which turned out to cost more stat points than I had expected.

So the core gameplay is subpar compared to every other TB blobbers I've played, but the game has some redeeming features:

Every 2x3 room (and there's quite a few of them on each level) can contain a Lair, with a "boss" monster, and chance of phatter lewt. Dragon lairs especially have lots of treasure chests.

Spells can have extra "charge", if you find spell scrolls of +1, +2 and so forth. Makes spells like Protect and Haste much more effective.

There are wishing wells and altars where you can raise stats, and reduce AC and age. They are very rare, but always fun to encounter.


I decided to continue playing, and the Moat level is far more intricate than the rest of the levels (which look computer generated) put together, with puzzles, hidden doors and such.
Also it turns out that the second scenario is supposed to be played with a new party, so I think I will give it a go.
 

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