So I bought KotOR...

[sea]

Yeah, I know her plan was supposed to be that she wanted to use the Exile to destroy the Force by creating a new wound (somehow, by uh, doing something?), but then she just decides to attack you for no apparent reason (did she give up?) and then she does this complete 180 and basically repents for everything she has done.

If Kreia's goal was to kill herself, then why did she even bother with the Exile in the first place? Or would she somehow sever the link? Was the point to complete the Exile's training by completely removing the force from her, and then killing herself so the Exile would live on to spread her teaching? And if she wanted the Exile to be powerful enough to stop her, what did it matter after all the other Sith were dead? Shouldn't she just have laid down and died at that point? And speaking of, was the bond between the two all a lie? I mean, she dies at the end after all anyway... there's ambiguous, and then there's "shit is cryptic to the point of stupidity" and "makes no goddamn sense." I didn't remember the ending being this bad the first time through.

A lot of the stuff she does to the companions also makes little sense. Her fucking around with Disciple for instance... why did she try to mask her presence from him? What goal did that accomplish? And then at the end it just ends up being useless anyway because Disciple is still in the loop. Same goes for all her hatred towards T3, who basically has no role in the story once you unlock his few secrets. I know that her whole shtick is manipulation and deceit, but most of the stuff she does does not really add up. And saving Hanharr just to send him to Malachor on the off chance Mira would be there... seriously? It's so pointlessly convoluted to the point of being ineffectual.

I feel like MCA and the rest of the Obsidian guys had a plan for Kreia, but it sure as hell did not come out right at all.

 

[yes plz]

Always thought everything Kreia did in respect to the Exile was to ready him for whatever threat was beyond known space ('True Sith' I think it was?), the threat Revan went after. If I remember correctly, the whole 'And then they flew off into space' ending was because Obsidian was under the impression they'd be doing a sequel that would deal with what the Exile and Revan found out there. As for the Force Bond between Kreia and the Exile, you were supposed to learn a lot more about it from the Jedi Master Lonna Vash, who was originally meant to be on the droid planet but that was of course cut and she ended up getting put on Korriban where she dies before you can talk to her. Her original dialogue files still exist as far as I know and from what I remember of them, you would learn that a strong shift to the light or dark side on one side of the bond could cause it to break. So I've always figured Kreia re-embracing the dark side at the end caused it to break.

Been years since I've played through the game fully, so my memory is pretty foggy, especially for the finer details.

 

[Grimlorn]

Well she says that when they are in battle the link won't affect them. I guess that's why cutting her hand off towards the end of the game doesn't matter. I guess that alignment shift makes sense too if they had put it in the game.

I didn't think Kreia was just preparing the Exile to help Revan. Doesn't make sense. She seemed to be trying to prepare the Exile to help her destroy the force by causing a greater wound. How is still a mystery. I think she hoped to have the Exile help her directly by teaching the Exile and if that didn't work then through manipulation but it's not expanded on at the end of the game.

I've been reading some of the EU character summaries from Star Wars and it sounds terrible. After Return of the Jedi there are Emperor clones that come and turn Luke to the Dark side anyways making his stand at the end of the movie seem useless. Seems like all the Jedi masters from around the prequels train Jedi that turn to the Dark side. Just seems like they rehash the same stuff over and over which makes the Star Wars setting seem shallow and stupid.

 

[abnaxus]

It is quite funny how the crappy remote somehow manages to beat both HK-47 and G0T0 and blow up Malachor in the 'good' ending.

 

[Commissar Draco]

It is quite funny how the crappy remote somehow manages to beat both HK-47 and G0T0 and blow up Malachor in the 'good' ending.

With Force everything is possible... as well as influence HK-47 and HK-50s to change sides.

Also Seems to me Codexers failed Kreia:

 

[IDtenT]

The more I think about it, the more I realise I preferred the first one over the second. Sorry Codex.

Revan > Exile in terms of importance in canon. Which makes me link this wonderful autism adventure: http://www.starwarsfanworks.com/timeline/swtg50.zip

 

[Commander Xbox]

It is quite funny how the crappy remote somehow manages to beat both HK-47 and G0T0 and blow up Malachor in the 'good' ending.

With Force everything is possible... as well as influence HK-47 and HK-50s to change sides.

Also Seems to me Codexers failed Kreia:

thats a prime example of kreias character and writing going nowhere. she makes a lot of really wordy and cryptic rants, which you are fooled into thinking are really going somewhere interesting and meaningful, then it fizzles out in a standard end game boss battle, with almost no explanation of her motives or a payoff/ conclusion. it isnt even really very clear what the fuck her motives or beliefs are during the game, people say she wants the death of the force, but she only mentions it like once offhandedly

 

[SCO]

I saw this thread from the main page

So I bought KotC
(O was cut)

i'm dissapointhttp://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?posts/2256522/

 

[Commissar Draco]

The more I think about it, the more I realise I preferred the first one over the second. Sorry Codex.

Revan > Exile in terms of importance in canon. Which makes me link this wonderful autism adventure: http://www.starwarsfanworks.com/timeline/swtg50.zip

Woooho and for Lucas TOR is teh best a over prequels cause it gets him more Jewgold. End of the Rhine. Codex is full of hipster faggots who can't into Philosophy. I am crashed again.

 

[Grimlorn]

It is quite funny how the crappy remote somehow manages to beat both HK-47 and G0T0 and blow up Malachor in the 'good' ending.

I don't know if it was the restored content but at the end when G0t0 goes after the remote, HK-47 comes out of nowhere and destroys him helping the remote. I lost all influence with HK-47 too so he had no reason to help me.

The HK-50s showing up were weird though because during the droid factory on Telos they attacked HK-47 and HK-47 shut down the facility so them showing up and saying they couldn't attack HK-47 both made no sense.


What the hell am I suppose to do with that timeline? 4 guides hundreds of pages long on Star Wars universe? I'm not reading that crap.

 

[Black Shogun]

I played for a while-

 

[Black Shogun]

KOTOR is an excellent game. KOTOR 2 is an excellent game, too. KOTOR is excellent overall.

I liked Fallout 3.

 

[Jaesun]

How old are you? 12?

 

[Black Shogun]

How old are you? 12?

Me? No.

If I was twelve I'd probably like Fallout 3.

 

[EG]

How old are you? 12?

Me? No.

If I was twelve I'd probably like Fallout 3.

Ah, young enough to swoon over the pronunciation of "Fallout 4" then?

 

[Black Shogun]

How old are you? 12?

Me? No.

If I was twelve I'd probably like Fallout 3.

Ah, young enough to swoon over the pronunciation of "Fallout 4" then?

No. Please no Fallout 4. Especially if it's being made by... Bestheda.

Wait... why is my age so important? Aren't my views of more notice?

 

[EG]

Wait... why is my age so important? Aren't my views of more notice?

Naive fool! What ever we decide is a weakness in the moment is all that is noticeable.

 

[Black Shogun]

Wait... why is my age so important? Aren't my views of more notice?

Naive fool! What ever we decide is a weakness in the moment is all that is noticeable.

 

[Koelkastmagneet]

The more I think about it, the more I realise I preferred the first one over the second. Sorry Codex.

Revan > Exile in terms of importance in canon. Which makes me link this wonderful autism adventure: http://www.starwarsfanworks.com/timeline/swtg50.zip

What kind of Star Wars obsessed retard gives any fucks at all about importance of characters within canon? Characters aren't good characters because of the number of ships they blew up.

Reminds me of all the shitty X vs. Y arguments that pop up daily on Star Wars forums.

 

[Sabriana]

I don't remember much of both KotOR games, but I do remember having a 'meh' feeling for the first one, and being terribly disappointed in the second one. It's quite possible that I expected too much from the sequel, and hating LucasArt for a while. Well, I still hate Lucas and his megalomania and delusions of grandeur. But hey, it was Star Wars, and I'm a fan of IV through VI. Although the Ewoks more or less symbolized the decline of Lucas' creative streak. Yes, it was a streak, the man is no artist, he just got lucky for a while.

I like FO3 too. I picked it up for 10 € with all its DLC, and had a blast. I never had better laughs than playing this game, it made little sense, but had me and my daughter laughing out loud quite a lot. I spent a lot of time in the DC area as an international student, and seeing all those places gave me nostalgia. Until the next bout of laughter occurred. FO3 can't be taken seriously, but its comedic value is not to be denied.

If they absolutely had to use the name 'Fallout' (which I guess they more or less bought fair and square) they should have named the game "Fallout DC - a satire", and then give FONV the name Fallout 3.

 

[Angthoron]

If they absolutely had to use the name 'Fallout' (which I guess they more or less bought fair and square) they should have named the game "Fallout DC - a satire", and then give FONV the name Fallout 3.

"Bethesda's Whimsical Adventure in Apocalypse, DC" perhaps?

That's a reasonable way of putting it, I suppose. It is a very senseless game, and something you could perhaps see as an Onion parody of the actual thing (although I think Onion would be more subtle) than a direct sequel.

 

[Sabriana]

"Bethesda's Whimsical Adventure in Apocalypse, DC" perhaps?

That's a reasonable way of putting it, I suppose. It is a very senseless game, and something you could perhaps see as an Onion parody of the actual thing (although I think Onion would be more subtle) than a direct sequel.

I like that idea. Well, actually the name and the idea of Onion doing something like that. I love that site, I wish they had something like this over here. The stars know that a lot of idiotic shit that's happening over here is perfectly ripe for spoofing and satire.

If you think of it, Megaton (or is that Megatron? I forgot) alone is worthy of several comedy stars. My kid and I had a blast trying to come up with reasons for things happening in that little village alone. Hours of fun and laughter were had.

While we're at it, we could rename KotOR 2 to "How to nuke a promising premise for Dummies - by LucasArt"

 

[Statik]

If they absolutely had to use the name 'Fallout' (which I guess they more or less bought fair and square) they should have named the game "Fallout DC - a satire", and then give FONV the name Fallout 3.

"Bethesda's Whimsical Adventure in Apocalypse, DC" perhaps?

That's a reasonable way of putting it, I suppose. It is a very senseless game, and something you could perhaps see as an Onion parody of the actual thing (although I think Onion would be more subtle) than a direct sequel.

This actually makes a lot of sense. The trainwreck plot that brainlessly slams together bits from Fallout 1 and 2 "hay guise something about water and you fight the Enclave and you make a bad guy kill himself and something something a GECK lol juts liek da old Fllaouts" is slightly less painful if viewed as a mediocre parody. Slightly.

 

[Catfish]

Ugh. I think I just got the "seven times" sentiment reading through this thread. What, pray tell me, is unclear about Kreia?

1) Revan runs off to fight Mandalore and his space goons
2) Kreia is blamed for Revans transgression, being the one of his mentors with "weird" teachings. Because the Jedi are dicks and always blame anyone but themselves.
3) Having been exciled from the order, Kreia goes searching for Revan into unknown space. There she presumably learns of the "real threat" that was never explored (let us just agree that the abominable mmo does not exist), and, later, finds the sith academy on Malachor five. Malachor is, thanks to the doomsday weapon used to end the mandalorian wars, effectively a wound in the force. Experiencing Malachor leads Kreia to begin digging into the subject of force wounds
4) Kreia explores the dark side, turns into the Sith Lord Darth Treya and seeks out two force wound apprentices that are to help her exact revenge on the asshole Jedi that screwed both her and Revan over so badly. That doesn't go well, since the force wound apprentices betray her, cut her off from the force and throw her in the ditch.
5) at this point, Kreia is an exile from both orders. But, upon reviewing the situation, she doesn't really blame any of them. She blames the force itself, accusing it of using living creatures as pawns in its own weird schemes. Kreia is sick of living in a galaxy where every living thing is a pawn of the force with no free will, and, being a Jedi/sith scholar and all, theorizes that wounding the force enough may actually kill it if she is able to understand how these wounds are created and how to manipulate them and live long enough to see it work. And, since she could no longer use her sith apprentices to further her understanding, she seeks out the exile.
6) she finds the exile on a republic ship and uses the commotion caused by the zombie sith guy and the hk droid to steal her and run away on the ebon hawk. But the ship gets hit during the getaway, nearly killing them both. The astrodroid steers the ship away from trouble and onto Peragus
7) an unexpected thing happens, the exile, clinging to life, forms a force bond with Kreia. She was not expecting that, but decides to get on with her plan of force killing anyway. So she stays with, studying the exile and getting to know him/her, even growing a kind of human attachment. This is where the main meat of the game takes place and where player experience may differ the most, so I won't elaborate.
8) now, the Jedi council is back together. They decide to cut the exile off from the force. At this moment several important things happen to Kreia. For one thing, she finally understands how the wound thing works (the exile was able to survive being a living wound and damaging the force so much by turning away from the force, out of fear). For another, she admits she really really cares for the exile, that is why she destroys the Jedi council, not because it was part of her revenge plan or some such shit - she couldn't care less about the Jedi, since destroying the force would leave them powerless and miserable anyway.
9) finally, the big showdown on Malachor is only a result of Kreia caring for the exile. She promised answers at the end, and she waited for the exile to show up so she could deliver on these promises. In the end, she gave up wanting to kill the force - precisely because of her connection with the exile. And she practically begged to be killed by her - to be set free, even going as far as to force the exiles hand by delivering one last lesson in the form of the triple lightsabre duel (this both mirrors and deconstructs the duels in the original trilogy, which were always about the context and not about the sabre swinging)

This is a tragic and beautiful dramatic conclusion to the path of a great character, one that is a galaxy far far fucking away from the simplistic stuff even the original trilogy offers. And what is more tragic is how some codexers boasting about their sincere love for games with good writing fail to appreciate a story more complex than a fucking sixties comic book. And guess what - figuring this stuff out only requires paying attention during gameplay and applying some brain work to reflect upon the experience. But oh well, back to bashing, like, decline or something...

 

[Lord Carlos Wafflebum]

Is it worth it to buy the kotors? The 'dex seems kinda split on this- more than usual.