Vapourware Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic Remake from Saber Interactive

[LESS T_T]

From an alternative timeline:

 

[just]

all timelines are fucked

 

[Nano]

 

[Trippy]

My once experience with KOTOR, specifically the sequel:

I'm playing along, listening to Kreia blab on and on about balancing the force, not adhering to ideology, etc etc. And I'm all for it! Finally a game will let me play as a Taoist grey force motherfucker, neither good nor evil! Awesome. This perfectly fits my reading of the prequels: The Sith are obviously bad, but the Jedi ain't great either. So I carefully balance my good/evil points throughout and specifically play as a middle-path force user. And then near the end the thing just arbitrarily declares me a terribly evil Sith, and I'm railroaded into the 'bad guy' ending. I look it up online and confirm that, indeed, there is no possibility of a middle-path ending. Like... what the fuck, Avellone? I'm actually paying attention to the philosophical implications of your story, actually agree with them, and am actually trying to role-play against them. And then fuck that, you're a malevolent Sith, tough shit buttercup.

I remain unconvinced that these games are masterpieces.

 

[Lacrymas]

What is the "bad ending"? Killing the Jedi Masters? Kreia specifically tells you she doesn't want to balance every little good deed with an equally evil one. She never advocates for the Grey Jedi, she wants to tear it all down because trying to achieve any sort of balance causes endless war and makes her feel like a slave. Kreia isn't a centrist, she's an extreme radical.

 

[Jarpie]

From an alternative timeline:

It might be pretty telling about Beamdog's reputation if their pitch was rejected, even though they have ex-Bioware working there. That being said, their pitch was probably more in line what they did with IE-games remasters, keep most of the writing/story/etc and just add to it, rather than full blown remake, which is why it might have gotten rejected.

 

[Zibniyat]

And then near the end the thing just arbitrarily declares me a terribly evil Sith, and I'm railroaded into the 'bad guy' ending. I look it up online and confirm that, indeed, there is no possibility of a middle-path ending.

And what would this "middle path" be? Sparing the lives of sclerotic, narrow-minded and arrogant Jedi? Trying to turn the power-addicted Sith to the "light side"? You seem to have completely missed the point of Kreia's teachings then, as she denounces such clearcut division of the Force and very clearly states how Jedi and Sith are both "pieces of a whole". As Lacrymas says, her philosophy isn't that of some "middle ground", it's literally a "fourth position", away from "light side", "dark side" or this "middle ground". Because for her, there is not truth in the Force and therefore basing morality on it is doomed right from the start.

She clearly hates evil though. She laments the countless lives lost and the atrocities committed in the name of this or that aspect of the Force. But she doesn't find the solution in the "good side" or the balance, since it all ends up being countered with equal measure of evil. The solution she sees is in the death of the Force. That way, at least, some avenues for causing great evil would be avoided. Which would be a net positive considering how Jedi really always end up being pathetic and worthless in maintaining peace or good.

 

[Storyfag]

So I carefully balance my good/evil points throughout and specifically play as a middle-path force user. And then near the end the thing just arbitrarily declares me a terribly evil Sith

This is how it works within the setting. To the Jedi Councils of all times, if you're not firmly on with them, you're a Dark Jedi. And almost every "grey" Jedi ever recorded did indeed fall to the Dark Side in the end.

 

[lukaszek]

My once experience with KOTOR, specifically the sequel:

I'm playing along, listening to Kreia blab on and on about balancing the force, not adhering to ideology, etc etc. And I'm all for it! Finally a game will let me play as a Taoist grey force motherfucker, neither good nor evil! Awesome. This perfectly fits my reading of the prequels: The Sith are obviously bad, but the Jedi ain't great either. So I carefully balance my good/evil points throughout and specifically play as a middle-path force user. And then near the end the thing just arbitrarily declares me a terribly evil Sith, and I'm railroaded into the 'bad guy' ending. I look it up online and confirm that, indeed, there is no possibility of a middle-path ending. Like... what the fuck, Avellone? I'm actually paying attention to the philosophical implications of your story, actually agree with them, and am actually trying to role-play against them. And then fuck that, you're a malevolent Sith, tough shit buttercup.

I remain unconvinced that these games are masterpieces.

I think you were a bit too red and started changing appearance? I was fully neutral and was counted as good guy

 

[Lacrymas]

AFAIK, there are only 2 endings - killing the Jedi council and not killing them. The ending isn't affected by whether you are light or dark side. There is a difference in Kreia's dialogue if you don't kill the Jedi and you aren't light side. She says something like "I sought to understand why you did it [cutting yourself off from the Force] and now I know - you were afraid", the last bit gets changed to "it was because you had no choice" if you aren't light side.

 

[Fenix]

What is the "bad ending"? Killing the Jedi Masters? Kreia specifically tells you she doesn't want to balance every little good deed with an equally evil one. She never advocates for the Grey Jedi, she wants to tear it all down because trying to achieve any sort of balance causes endless war and makes her feel like a slave. Kreia isn't a centrist, she's an extreme radical.

Looks like Chaotic.


All in all, I think, all kreiism summoned to life due typical misinterpritation and misunderstanding what light side is, or probably more precise - with clished depiction of it in Star Wars, or even more precisely - in conscience of western man, full of stereotypes and lables.
This misunderstanding give birth to all these third, fourth and other sides that seems to be needed as alternative for good/ligth/sacred.

 

[Adenocaulon]

Be optimistic, maybe the game will have isometric camera and the option to switch to turn based combat

 

[rusty_shackleford]

so uh
...

why does a remake need dedicated writers?

 

[mkultra]

so uh
...

why does a remake need dedicated writers?

* To fix all the hundreds, if not thousands, of various problematic things.
* To get the SJW seal of approval

 

[good fucking shit happen]

Troon or Jewish or both

The children of Israel also known as Judah or Hebrews were Black people. Bantu speaking people are the descendants of ancient Israelites from the Bible. This Polish looking freak ain't Black. Whites with long noses don't have an Israelite bone in their body.

https://boundingintocomics.com/2021...star-wars-knights-of-the-old-republic-remake/

Most nerds seem to like entertainment that has disdain for them so it is possible this will sell well.

 

[J1M]

so uh
...

why does a remake need dedicated writers?

This form of journalist retirement package is present on all major productions. It's a kickback, like speaking fees for former politicians.

You didn't really think other games needed half a dozen "narrative designers"?

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

"I sought to understand why you did it [cutting yourself off from the Force] and now I know - you were afraid", the last bit gets changed to "it was because you had no choice" if you aren't light side.

I think this was actually just defined by previous dialogue not alignment.

In any case, to the misinformed Trippy, Grey Jedi are a meme. They don't exist and never have due to the corrupting nature of the Force. Kreia abhorred fence-sitters. She gave you the advice, whatever path you were travelling, to essentially steel-man your opposition. (That's while working within the framework of the Force if you insisted on doing that.) She was a Sith as the Sith should have been if they actually valued true power. The Force in her eyes, being a foreign power that inevitably dominates you if you use it for your own self interest, must be rejected. In the long run she wanted you to "destroy" it, not literally because that's impossible, but by amplifying the echo at Malachor V (Your death or hers would add to this, which is why she lures you there.) and creating more wounds all across the galaxy to eventually deafen all Force Sensitives to it. A lot of this info is hidden behind all the alternate character interactions of differing sex and alignment choices and even then some must be inferred.

In the end she gets something she wanted either way, even if she didn't know she wanted it.

 

[Frozen]

Kotor II is just emo edgy teen version of SW

Codexers were young and stupid when playing it and now they are old and stupid and make 5h videos about "Kreia ideology" LOLz

 

[DeepOcean]

To be fair Siths are Chaotic evil stupid and Jedi are Lawful good stupid, anything that promotes ending their retardation is incline. Avellone did a favor to George Cuck and Disney mercenary Empire by just having an argument that the only good solution for Star Wars was to nuke it out of existance.

 

[karoliner]

My once experience with KOTOR, specifically the sequel:

I'm playing along, listening to Kreia blab on and on about balancing the force, not adhering to ideology, etc etc. And I'm all for it! Finally a game will let me play as a Taoist grey force motherfucker, neither good nor evil! Awesome. This perfectly fits my reading of the prequels: The Sith are obviously bad, but the Jedi ain't great either. So I carefully balance my good/evil points throughout and specifically play as a middle-path force user. And then near the end the thing just arbitrarily declares me a terribly evil Sith, and I'm railroaded into the 'bad guy' ending. I look it up online and confirm that, indeed, there is no possibility of a middle-path ending. Like... what the fuck, Avellone? I'm actually paying attention to the philosophical implications of your story, actually agree with them, and am actually trying to role-play against them. And then fuck that, you're a malevolent Sith, tough shit buttercup.

I remain unconvinced that these games are masterpieces.

Welcome to the codex.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

id and Jedi are Lawful good stupid

What's "good" about Jedi?
Their code is to explicitly reject anything that makes you human, and to not enjoy any of the pleasures in life. You aren't to deviate from their code no matter how much you disagree with it.

 

[Harthwain]

I remain unconvinced that these games are masterpieces.

KotOR 2 is interesting, because it doesn't follow the simplistic "Blue - Good, Red - Evil" mindset of the Star Wars universe (which is shared by most games made by BioWare, to be honest). It still has to adhere to the Light and Dark Sides of the Force, but at least it tries to do something more with the premise.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

"Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic Remake from Aspyr" ger syndrome

So the game will feature retarded and autistic gameplay. Huzzah...

 

[KörangarTheMighty]

What's "good" about Jedi? Their code is to explicitly reject anything that makes you human, and to not enjoy any of the pleasures in life. You aren't to deviate from their code no matter how much you disagree with it.

The Force doesn't care what you disagree with. The Jedi are correct. Reject hedonism and being ruled by your petty emotions or go insane. There is no third option for Force Users.
Lessons hard-learned and codified over the course of thousands of years to be ignored at their own peril. They don't expect any adherence from the general populace, but for supermen there are higher standards. If anything, the Jedi are too lenient on their own.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

What's "good" about Jedi? Their code is to explicitly reject anything that makes you human, and to not enjoy any of the pleasures in life. You aren't to deviate from their code no matter how much you disagree with it.

The Force doesn't care what you disagree with. The Jedi are correct. Reject hedonism and being ruled by your petty emotions or go insane. There is no third option for Force Users.
Lessons hard-learned and codified over the course of thousands of years to be ignored at their own peril. They don't expect any adherence from the general populace, but for supermen there are higher standards. If anything, the Jedi are too lenient on their own.

There are plenty of force users who are neither jedi or sith. And it goes from plenty to ridiculous amount if you include EU.

If you haven't noticed, this thread is actually about one. Revan is neither jedi nor sith(arguably both, but definitely not one or the other.) Avellone's entire interpretation of the force/jedi in kotor 2 is about this topic and how ridiculous jedi are.