KickStarter System Shock 1 Remake by Nightdive Studios

[Trithne]

Doubleposting like I'm The Wall:

Apparently someone 'hacked' the Gamescom demo and it's just the full game with a timer.

To which I can only ask:

 

[Feyd Rautha]

even if the gameplay turns out great somehow, there's just too many chunks missing and changes made, certainly the soundtrack for one, ain't nobody want no spooooky Bioshock ambientscape

I can't believe they went with this:

Instead of this:

 

[Terenty]

Nice combat track, I will make sure to blast it next time I have trouble falling asleep

 

[DJOGamer PT]

Name three remakes that are better than the originals. And if you're gonna say one of the Resident Evils, think again before I click on that popamole button.

>Give an example that prove me wrong
>But you can't use X because it proves me wrong




Well fuck you
- REmake
- REmake 2
- Pokemon FireRed
- Pokemon SoulSilver
- Link's Awekening DX
- AM2R
- Twin Snakes (anyone that disagrees sucks cock by choice)

Resident Evil 1's remake is superior.

If you're into monochrome, yes

"Oh no, le heckin vibrant colors in my dark horror game set in a creepy decaying mansion/evil laboratory!"

I blame Ash for starting this idiocy

Sorry, but REmake is the better game by every objective measure
- the art is superior
- the camera shots are superior
- the atmosphere is superior
- the challenge is superior
- the changes to level design are superior
- the enemy design improvements are superior
- the gameplay is superior

 

[HansDampf]

LA:DX is not a remake.
AM2R is a fan project (and better than the official Metroid 2 remake).
Twin Snakes has worse soundtrack.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

LA:DX is not a remake.

The devs+Nintendo say otherwise, plus the game has unique content and some gameplay/level changes

AM2R is a fan project

Still a remake

Twin Snakes has worse soundtrack.

Better AI
More challenging
MGS2 tech

 

[Roguey]

I can't believe they went with this:

tbh the first level music is extremely annoying and I turned it down as low as possible without outright muting it, I can understand why they changed it

 

[DJOGamer PT]

They can always follow REmake 2 example and give the option in the audio settings for both the classic OST and the new one

 

[†††]

More challenging

How the fuck is Twin Snakes more challenging when you can shoot in first person from safety, thing you couldn't in the original? it's the biggest criticism the remake receives and it's completely valid. Also they butchered the atmosphere (lush greens and blues turning into grey).

 

[Nifft Batuff]

Remakes are a huge social problem.

 

[DJOGamer PT]

How the fuck is Twin Snakes more challenging when you can shoot in first person from safety

This is a huge meme perpetuated by MGS fanboys
There's only a few locations you can really do this, and the overall improved AI more than makes up for it
I played both and Twin Snakes was more enjoyable and demanding
The only detraction of TS is that it doesn't have the VR missions

Also they butchered the atmosphere (lush greens and blues turning into grey)

Oh fuck off, the game looks better
And the atmosphere is more in-line with the genre, the ost's even provide a good example - the oringal is more grand and "epic", while the remake is more subdued and tense (you know, like a stealth game)

 

[LarryTyphoid]

At least it'll come out before System Shock 3.

 

[Bad Sector]

They could have done a faithful recreation with better graphics

Unless they went with an early/mid 90s 3D theme and visual fidelity, it would be impossible to do that: the game's visuals are heavily influenced by the limited graphics tech they had at the time, even the level layout is as it is because they couldn't make freeform 3D environments but were limited to two boxy heightmaps with some extra boxes to act as bridges.

As a result a ton of what people see in SS1 is based on their interpretation and their imagination filling in the blanks. But since not everyone has the same interpretation and imagination, improving the fidelity means having the artists realize their own interpretation with their own imagination, which will 100% always clash with other peoples'.

This is why pretty much all similar attempts to remake older games with graphics from an era where the tech heavily influenced the games' visuals have a lot of people thinking the new visuals are worse or not looking like the original: they simply filled the blanks between the limited graphics in the original with different stuff than the artists who worked on the remakes.

Because of that there is no such thing as "better graphics" in these cases because everyone who played these games had a different idea of what the graphics are showing or even what atmosphere they're trying to create - and in turn what "better graphics" mean. For all we know, what Nightdive has done is "better graphics" for their artists and anyone who dislikes them simply had a different idea what the limited graphics in the original game represented.

tbh the first level music is extremely annoying

Not just the first level music but while there are some nice pieces, a lot of the music in the original System Shock is like the game sending random bytes to the Adlib registers and calling it "music". It took me years of repeated plays for my ears to become numb to the aural assault of the menu music.

SS2 has slightly better music, but IMO these games play way better with either subdued/ambient music or no music at all and using environment sound effects to fill the soundscape.

 

[Lemming42]

^ The franticness of the music is the point, it matches the nerve-shredding panic of the game's premise - the station's going to blow up in seven hours, and in that time you've got to prevent a mining laser from carving Earth's major cities apart, thwart a biohazard that could wipe out humanity, blow up the station's comms systems to prevent SHODAN downloading itself to Earth's internet, and, after all that, you've got to set the reactor to go into meltdown and rush to Security with every remaining lifeform on the station right behind you so that you can get to the Bridge seconds before the station explodes. Throughout this journey, you're constantly under attack, you're being tracked at all times by a rogue AI and a psychotic fellow cyborg, and you're racing around with a lightsaber.

It's a fast-paced, adrenaline-pumping adventure where the pace never lets up (bar maybe the floor with all the lights out). The soundtrack backs that up, it sounds like a mad disjointed heart-pounding panic because it was written for a game in which the player is in a mad disjointed heart-pounding panic. I don't know why people think SS would suit ambient spooky music, dark shadowy visuals, and slow-paced gameplay, basically just Dead Space in first person. Maybe it's down to SS2's unfortunate influence, though even that game seems to have a reputation for atmospheric horror that far exceeds what the game actually contains.

 

[Jaesun]

I backed and own this, but just haven't had any time yet to play through this. Any thoughts so far on people actually playing it?

 

[Jenkem]

Better AI
More challenging
MGS2 tech

"more challenging" lmao, no.. twin snakes is far easier BECAUSE of the mgs2 tech, they added in MGS2 gameplay features, while keeping the maps and scenarios, designed without those gameplay features, the same.

 

[Bad Sector]

^ The franticness of the music is the point

Yeah no, even if it was some intentional point (i doubt it), i still find most of the music ear grating - and if the point was to be ear grating then, that was a bad choice as far as i am concerned.

You can like the music and there is nothing wrong with that, but personally - aside from a few clips - i never really liked it regardless of any reasons/excuses there might be for that.

I don't know why people think SS would suit ambient spooky music, dark shadowy visuals, and slow-paced gameplay, basically just Dead Space in first person. Maybe it's down to SS2's unfortunate influence, though even that game seems to have a reputation for atmospheric horror that far exceeds what the game actually contains.

SS2 didn't have spooky music though, even Yahtzee made a joke about the game playing "techno music" in an old video of his about the game :-P (yea ok it isn't techno, it was part of the joke). As for the pace, i never found any System Shock -or even Prey(2017), Deus Ex, Bioshock, etc for that matter- game to be fast paced. Most of the time is spent exploring the levels and trying to find stuff (and really that is a large part of why i like these games). And that is especially true in System Shock 1 - sure the things you mentioned are part of the plot, but they tend to be in the background and mainly to guide you forward.

Of course you may feel like these games are fast paced, but at least personally when i looking around in some rooms, trying to find some pickup, jack, button or other object while there is dance music playing in the background i find it a bit jarring (and if it is SS1's MIDI bleeps and bloops it is also annoying).

As for the visuals i can't say i care that much about them in an SS1 remake, as long as the concept behind them look like a plausible interpretation of the original (anything more is bound to have issues as i mentioned in the previous post) - beyond that it could look as bright as Prey (which had bright visuals for the most part) or it could look as dark as Doom 3.

 

[Viata]

MGS for PS1 is from Snake's viewpoint. Twin Snakes is from Otacon's viewpoint.

 

[Lemming42]

Yeah no, even if it was some intentional point (i doubt it), i still find most of the music ear grating - and if the point was to be ear grating then, that was a bad choice as far as i am concerned.

You can like the music and there is nothing wrong with that, but personally - aside from a few clips - i never really liked it regardless of any reasons/excuses there might be for that.

The music's obviously intentional, it even plays dynamically! The intense riff from Medical kicks in as soon as you leave the starting room and get the first medical bots careening towards you. The cyberspace music too, where the thudding drums and faster melody kick in whenever you exit one of the tunnels and get into combat.

Of course you may feel like these games are fast paced, but at least personally when i looking around in some rooms, trying to find some pickup, jack, button or other object while there is dance music playing in the background i find it a bit jarring (and if it is SS1's MIDI bleeps and bloops it is also annoying).

I'd suggest that SS1 is largely built around the idea that the player will have the timer enabled (same for the other difficulty settings, the "ultimate" playthrough will have the player turning all of them to max). It makes the plot much more immediate and intense and brings out the best in the mechanics. The game's basically about resoruce management, the systems work better when time is a constantly-depleting factor to weigh into your decision-making. You've got to decide when it's appropriate to use the powerup drugs to speed through a section, when it's necessary to play more cautiously and slowly at the cost of crucial time (foremost example I can think of is the snipers in alcoves on the communications level, which you can't realistically brute force your way through), and when it's appropriate to get the laser rapier out and go mental.

How to translate this sense of immediacy into a modern game and get it across to the player is a problem for the remake designers to figure out, I suppose, but as of the last Medical demo they released, it felt very tonally odd - Lansing contacts you to tell you that a mining laser will fire at Earth's major cities imminently unless you race to the Research deck to disable it, and then rather than doing that, you skulk slowly through a series of corridors with spooky ambient music playing. The original soundtrack is a lot better at conveying the idea that you've got to rush or else countless lives will be lost, including your own.

 

[Infinitron]

 

[gerey]

'd suggest that SS1 is largely built around the idea that the player will have the timer enabled

I disagree. Certainly, the "lore friendly" way to play the game is to crank the difficulty to max on all settings (except cyberspace because fuck that), but it's unlikely how the majority of people experienced the game on their first playthrough. I imagine most left the difficulty at the default 2.

So, basically, there's two System Shock 1s that people have experienced - the first (and usually only) playthrough, where players go around exploring the levels to their fullest, peeking into every nook and cranny, trying to find every secret and just experience the game, and then there's the game when you play it at the max difficulty and you're buzzing around the station like a hornet trying to beat the clock.

The music certainly fits the mood of the later experience, since it's probalby not your first playthrough, there's no sense of horror or dread of the unknown left, instead you're challenging yourself, you're trying to be fast and lethal.

And yes, you can argue that the story expects there to be a strict time limit, but SS1 certainly wouldn't be the first game where the sense of urgency introduced in the narrative does not translate to the actual gameplay.

That being said, I do not like the music in the remake - they could have channeled the more energetic and cyberpunk vibe of the original without compromising the feeling of dread, or even made the music system more dynamic and reactive, or just introduced two separate soundtracks altogether (if they even bothered including a timed limit at the highest difficulty).

 

[gerey]

I take it back, these absolute fucking mongoloid cocksucking faggots still haven't fixed the sights on the starting pistol.

How hard can it be to figure out how to aim a gun? Some ghetto nigger with an IQ lower than that of a gorilla can, but not these hollowed-out soy-slurping vegan husks.

 

[Viata]

Holy fuck, it really looks like Jynx.

 

[Tweed]

even if the gameplay turns out great somehow, there's just too many chunks missing and changes made, certainly the soundtrack for one, ain't nobody want no spooooky Bioshock ambientscape

Instead of this:

Or this:

 

[Melmoth]

the reason to pirate this is to extract the terri brosius wavs from the .wad

mca will inevitably drunkpost his script contributions on twitter so that's the other loose end snipped