Bard's Tale The Bard's Tale Series

[Grampy_Bone]

Ahh I see. I didn't think to save scum the rogue. Never noticed that big of a point difference.

it BT2 I'm opening all the chest automatically so for now I'm good. I also noticed I'm gaining stats again for all characters, I believe in the original game the stats were still capped? Not sure. I find it amusing my Archmages can cast a spell to summon another archmage who is stronger than they are. Sure, makes sense.

Finished Dark domain, onto the Tombs..

 

[Mauman]

Ahh I see. I didn't think to save scum the rogue. Never noticed that big of a point difference.

it BT2 I'm opening all the chest automatically so for now I'm good. I also noticed I'm gaining stats again for all characters, I believe in the original game the stats were still capped? Not sure. I find it amusing my Archmages can cast a spell to summon another archmage who is stronger than they are. Sure, makes sense.

Finished Dark domain, onto the Tombs..

You need to get your dex maxed out for the two classes ASAP.

Much like con and hp or int and sp, dex provides bonuses to rogue and hunter abilities.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Boom, tombs done. Castle next.

You need to get your dex maxed out

I did prioritize dex for everyone, but just for initiative purposes. The game's combat is a quickdraw duel between insta kill spells.

Though in BT2 I seem to be resisting everything so far.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Lemme think since it has been a while since I booted up bt1 the original: (from memory)
Races:
Human
Elf
Dwarf
Half-orc
Half-elf
Hobbit
Gnome

Bloody AD&D

Classes:
Monk
Rogue
Bard
Hunter
Warrior
Paladin
Conjurer
Magician
Sorcerer
Wizard

I think that's it,

 

[octavius]

Finally got my own A-Team up and running properly. Used less than an hour to map the first level of the Wine Cellar, while I spent days mapping Skara Brae.

I've been experimenting a bit with the traps system. Seems only a Rogue can actually ID the trap, but so far my Bard has been able to Disarm all chests gambling that they are Poison Needle.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

Conjurer
Magician
Sorcerer
Wizard

My point was, pretty much by design, you're going to have overpowered casters by the midpoint of the game. In classic fashion, the XP reqs to go from levels 1-13 are the same to go from 13-14. Hence, any non-dumb player will immediately multiclass after achieving level 7 spells, which costs nothing and has no drawbacks. Then it only takes a couple of battles to zip right back to level 13, gaining full HP and SP increases every level. Only Wizard has any higher XP reqs, but at that point you have spells that can fully restore your entire team's HP for a mere 12 sp, nuke everything on screen for 7-11 sp, and teleport even to unexplored squares. You have more HP than the fighters and enough SP to cast spells pretty much at will. What is even left?

In comparison, class changing in Wizardry is tricky-- it resets all your stats to minimum values, and casting is only retained if you continue to another casting class. Each class has it's own mana pool, and restoring within the dungeon is impossible. Achieving a full set of priest and wizard spells with maxed casting slots is an achievement in itself, and not something you're likely to hit without grinding well past what is needed for the game. That's why I see the casters in bard's tale as turbocharged.

 

[baba is you]

That's why I see the casters in bard's tale as turbocharged.

It's been a while since I've played Bard's Tale, so my memory is fuzzy... but what I do remember is that Bard's Tale has very strong spellcasters from mid-game onwards, but I don't think that makes the millie class any less important, as it's classes like Monk that are best suited to dealing single damage.

 

[octavius]

I play with three spell casters myself.
I start with one Conjuror and one Magician, and change the Magician to Sorceror when he's level 5 (the Wind Dragon, anti-illusion spells and detection spells are nice to have ASAP). Then I roll a new Magician, while I retire my Hunter, leaving a Paladin, Monk and Bard on the front line. The Paladin is important as party leader to improve the party's saving throws, the Monk has the best AC which may be crucial in the late game (in the long run a Hunter with max crit chance may be better, though), and the Bard is of course mandatory.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

What's the xp gains again per level? Gotta pull out my manuals or BTCS. Btw, I was hoping someone on the appleii bardstale would have imported characters from Wiz 1 and Ultima III. Bring different weapons try different class max out stats/lvls (in thd case of Ultima III). I don't think i've seen a vid of this.

 

[octavius]

That would involve actually having characters survive the Apple version of Wiz 1. With spells being allowed in the surprise round, that is hard to achieve.

For players who played this game "right" or back in the day, is there any clue anywhere in the game about the Spectre's Snare? I found the square by accident, looked up the answer, and get another absurd weapon. Curious what the 'legit' means to acquire it is.

There is at least one hint, apart from the name of the weapon:

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

I wonder if you can get Mangar into your party. I swore I did this in DOS.

As to a party.... well it wouldn't take long for Wizardry.

 

[octavius]

Grrr...the game froze (emulator still working) and when I rebooted all my characters had 0 Gold (some anti-Mondblut measure?).
Guess I need to find a gnome in the AG to hold the gold for my party.

 

[octavius]

I guess I should have heeded the warning signs and quick saved ASAP:

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Did it freeze again? Maybe that copy is bugged. I'm curious if quicksaves and reloads bug/freeze at the same point. I have had this issue on games in vice/ccs64 where random glitching/freezing would appear.

 

[octavius]

No, that was some minutes before it froze. I should have taken it as a sign that the program had become unstable.
I try to avoid quicksaving, but although I can accept losing some progress, the loss of all the gold is harder to accept.

 

[octavius]

Just completed the Sewers.
Only one party death so far, to a clan of filthy Barbarians.

I'm surprised at how much more I'm enjoying the Apple version of Bard's Tale than I did playing the Llylgalmyn Saga remake of Wizardry 1.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

Grrr...the game froze (emulator still working) and when I rebooted all my characters had 0 Gold (some anti-Mondblut measure?).
Guess I need to find a gnome in the AG to hold the gold for my party.

Be sure to always safeguard your party's wealth in Gnomish banks, rather than risk it being stolen by tricksy hobbits.

 

[octavius]

The Wind Dragon is so ridicilously OP in The Bard's Tale:

All the summons from spells or figurines up to that point has had AC of like 5-9 and HPs less than 30.

So while the Apple version may be bug free it still has the same problem of balance. The start is even more brutal, but once your party is able to survive it takes too long before they are presented with more challenging enemies. I think I saw Barbarians even in the Catacombs.
But if it's like the DOS version you need all the XP you can get to survive the upper levels of Mangar's Tower. I dunno, maybe Flee is really en integral option in this game, both to survive the start and end, and to not be too OP in the mid game.
I remember from my first playthrough on the Amiga that the Blue Dragons were a rude shock when they started to appear, though.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

I used the Wizard's binding spell on the Soul Sucker ~ 200 damage per group per round. Does that work in this version?

 

[octavius]

That should work.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Binding Mangar was interesting (at least on DOS). Pretty sure i did it once.

Anyway, I'm a bit disappointed BT2 for NES/FAMICOM was never translated to english. There is a FAQguide for play though.

 

[octavius]

Getting the Wind Dragon ASAP as well as only fleeing when you have to made my party too OP for the mid game, which was the same problem as with the DOS versions of BT 1 and 2.

So I decided to start a new party which will only fight the fixed (those that leave chests) battles as well as those in houses in Skara Brae for an initial boost. The main problem with my previous party (actually several parties' worth of characters) was that the front liners had too poor AC and were nearly always hit by enemies. So I rolled three Hobbit Warriors, and with Dex 18 and Plate Armour they have an AC of -2, which makes a noticeable difference. My party is now level four and I've had not a single death so far. Once my mages get War Strike and Star Flare, I'll retire my Hobbit squad and develop a Human Paladin and a Dwarf Monk and push my Bard up to slot 3. The Magician will change to Sorceror and I will create a new Magician.
Hopefully this party, running away from all random combat, will both find the mid game a challenge and the end game a possibility. If things get too easy, I tend to lose interest.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Play with a smaller party.

 

[octavius]

Nah, a diversity squad need a full party.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

The final battle was always a crapshoot. Getting chars drained or stoned or both. I'd run that loop on pc until my levels read ** and I had no clue what level I was. Oh, i was op for BT2 at the start. I still want to try the theory of just power levelling a single class conjurer and magician a few hundred levels just for kicks before class changing. I don't think I ever just never changed classes as I wanted all the spells to be an archmage.