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Game News The Outer Worlds Feature at Game Informer: The Halcyon System

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Instead of making a setting which focuses on the hubris of literally reaching the stars, they have a half-baked fairy tale about the perils of voluntary exchange. Sigh.

This is the point I was lamenting. Instead of taking what was actually interesting from that era, they do this. They could take this opportunity to give us something akin to mixing themes from Arcanum, Deus Ex, and Bioshock. Great glories and failures in a frontier physical, scientific, and personal. Instead we will get some flip-flop-sporting, freshman grade anecdotes on "the corporations". If they spent the thought on unscrupulous mayonnaise preparation, I can imagine what main entree that sophomoric anecdote will garnish. DECLINE.
 

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
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Is there something hidden in all the hype videos that I missed, that you can be so confident in exactly how they are going to treat the setting?

Because the article doesn't really have anything about GRARGH COMPANIES BAD MONEY BAD CAPITALISM BAD. If anything, chances are that the corporations will be roughly equivalent to the in-game factions and we'll get a variety of different types.

Certainly, going for the Deus Ex style where the entire setting is conceptualised through an Orwellian paranoia of corporations and organisations, would be a poor decision for this game, given the period they are reaching into. If they have any sense, we should be seeing a lot more entrepreneurial spirits, nouveau riches, generational shifts, etc. I don't know if they'll do a good job at all, obviously.
 

Rinslin Merwind

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I am surprised you have the energy and time to play any games, what with your obsession to communist regime and the crying need to be acknowledged for your obsession...
..
.
Oh wait, you dont play any game at all.
That's a very bold statement, is there some facts to back it up?
Oh, sorry I forgot that you pulled this statement out of your ass, because you had to continue discussion that ended long before you decided that you have problems with my "obsession".
 

Kyl Von Kull

The Night Tripper
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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Instead of making a setting which focuses on the hubris of literally reaching the stars, they have a half-baked fairy tale about the perils of voluntary exchange. Sigh.

This is the point I was lamenting. Instead of taking what was actually interesting from that era, they do this. They could take this opportunity to give us something akin to mixing themes from Arcanum, Deus Ex, and Bioshock. Great glories and failures in a frontier physical, scientific, and personal. Instead we will get some flip-flop-sporting, freshman grade anecdotes on "the corporations". If they spent the thought on unscrupulous mayonnaise preparation, I can imagine what main entree that sophomoric anecdote will garnish. DECLINE.

If you don’t think that open, violent class war was an interesting part of late 19th century American history, you don’t know much history. The Western Federation of Miners literally conducted a guerilla war against capitalists and ultimately had to be put down by the U.S. army. The governor of Idaho (IIRC) who requested federal troops was then assasinated (they blew him up on his front porch). The prime suspects were defended by the smooth talking Clarence Darrow and got off scot free.

And, of course, the company town thing that TOW is drawing heavily on also resulted in some crazy violence—Homestead being the most obvious example. At first the owners brought in their own private army to put down the strikers who’d taken over the town.

This was before child labor was illegal, before weekends, before any meaningful labor laws. It was before antitrust laws were enforced. So if this is the period TOW is based on, yeah, the corporations will be insanely rapacious and amoral. Industrial magnates were called robber barons for a reason.
 

Trashos

Arcane
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Dec 28, 2015
Messages
3,413
Tigranes, there is an impressions discussion at Game informer, where it is mentioned that The Outer Worlds are a fucked up capitalistic society that is ruled by evil corporations and workers have no rights. Here, go to 7'00'':
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhJxY6tzkHg

Kyl Von Kull, I won't start a discussion about how capitalism improved everyone's life. I am only going to ask, who the fuck thought that this is an interesting centerpiece for the world to be built around? The Outer Worlds is going to be about class warfare? Seriously?
 

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
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Messages
10,350
Thanks. Watching it - ehhhh. Game journalists sitting round a table going "so like, huh, there's no racism but a lot of CLASSISM!!!" "Yeah like uh there's these corporations who bought a solar system huh" ... does that really tell us anything about the nuances the actual game is going to have or not have?

It's a game that's not even close to coming out, and the worst thing about the bits of dialogue we saw wasn't that it was some kind of commie propaganda, it was that it was pretty banal. I don't really know why there's this whole discussion around how they must have decided to create an anti-capitalist game or that they must have wanted to build the entire game around class warfare.

The right way to do it would be to reflect some of the harsh bargains that were in play in that period: Kyl Von Kull mentions how rapacious capitalists could be in this period, but the bigger picture also included the fact that there were huge gains and massive, transformative projects to be had for those who were on the right side of that ledger. It was a time for great projects strung together by hook and crook, and that should be an exciting recipe for an outer space RPG setting if they do it properly.
 
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Is there something hidden in all the hype videos that I missed, that you can be so confident in exactly how they are going to treat the setting?

Because the article doesn't really have anything about GRARGH COMPANIES BAD MONEY BAD CAPITALISM BAD. If anything, chances are that the corporations will be roughly equivalent to the in-game factions and we'll get a variety of different types.

Certainly, going for the Deus Ex style where the entire setting is conceptualised through an Orwellian paranoia of corporations and organisations, would be a poor decision for this game, given the period they are reaching into. If they have any sense, we should be seeing a lot more entrepreneurial spirits, nouveau riches, generational shifts, etc. I don't know if they'll do a good job at all, obviously.

Well, I hate to disappoint you but...

Tags: Leonard Boyarsky; Obsidian Entertainment; The Outer Worlds; Tim Cain

Game Informer's final article about The Outer Worlds last week was about Tim and Leonard's general approach to choice & consequence. You'd think that would be interesting, but it wasn't particularly. Today's feature article has a bit more substance to it. It's a detailed look at the game's setting, the Halcyon star system - its history and its various locations. Warning, deep lore ahead:

“One of the defining features that set Earth apart in this new timeline is the nature of companies, classism, and the central importance of money-making. Imagine the already absurd power of corporations, banks, and billionaires in the real world, and ratchet it up several more degrees. “What if the trusts hadn’t been broken up?,” Boyarsky muses. “You have these robber barons at the turn of the 20th century. A couple of hundred years later, what if we still have that culture?”

"In this twist on history, Earth is already the domain of massive and powerful companies as humanity begins to spread out across the stars. Rather than the intrepid explorers and diplomats of some other science fiction properties, it’s the reaching arm of capitalism that sends humanity hurtling into the void, and habitable planets across the galaxy are being carved up like parcels of land in the American Old West. This first installment of The Outer Worlds focuses on one particular solar system called Halcyon, and the ten companies that banded together to purchase it. “The corporations have pretty much taken over everything,” Boyarsky says. “But they want to go that last little bit and make it the perfect society for corporations. When Earth was colonizing the furthest reaches of the galaxy, they bought one of the furthest colonies and set up what they thought would be a corporate utopia, where they can control every aspect of people’s lives.”

"In-game, Terra 1 has been renamed as Monarch, and it’s a dangerous place to live. It’s also where the board’s outsized influence has begun to fray, as many groups and individuals are rebelling against the companies."

"The other comfortably habitable planet orbiting the Halcyon star is called Terra 2, and it remains much more under the sway of the board. Here, the colonists have largely accepted and even embraced their roles as corporate workers, but the façade is slowly breaking down, as towns slowly fall into disarray."

“There’s a product sold called Tartarus Sauce, for dipping Saltuna fish sticks,” Cain says with a smile. “What they do is they take mayonnaise and they expose it the caustic environment of Tartarus for just a few seconds, and then put the lid back on, and they sell it. It makes the mayo really tangy, because it introduces a lot of very low-level toxins. There’s not a lot of restrictions on corporate food products.”


Read your comment again, then read the article quotations in the spoiler. Decline. PoE's writing was a dud, PoE 2 was worse. This game will be a proverbial shovel compacting the final layer of topsoil on Obsidian's legacy as great narrative builders and writers of the gaming world.​
 

Tigranes

Arcane
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Messages
10,350
Mr. Tartarus Trauma,

We appreciate that you have once again brought the subject of the Sauce to the Codex. We duly note that you have raised the evils of the Sauce on multiple occasions; indeed, we feel obliged to point out that the very subject was debated early in our meeting, on the very first page of the minutes, though we cannot be sure that you had paid attention.

A thorough discussion yielded numerous historical examples of the period to which the Sauce conforms. Without passing judgment as to the literary excellence of the Sauce, we feel confident that your allegations about the end of Western civilisation through the Sauce appears, at best, a saucy exaggeration. Perhaps it would behoove us all if you were to consult the earlier discussion; the Codex must now move on to more weighty topics, including the colour of hair of each and every Outer Worlds designer and the weight gain/loss of Tim Cain over the development period.

Yours Sincerely,
Everybody Else.
 
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Ah yes. We've reached the point where your argument is invalidated, so you now trot out the tedious non-sequitur. So let's just recap then.
  1. I make a singular claim that they're taking the wrong inspiration from a point in history.
  2. You spend the next dozen posts defending all criticism of the design choices and expressing skepticism.
  3. I follow up, clarifying that their premises are boring and a failed opportunity.
  4. You say, "Certainly, going for the Deus Ex style where the entire setting is conceptualised through an Orwellian paranoia of corporations and organisations, would be a poor decision for this game, given the period they are reaching into."
  5. I demonstrate by citing nearly an entire article of the designer's own words, that this is exactly what they are doing.
I think we're done here. Let's hope Obsidian can still make a good Bethesda game.
 

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
10,350
Aww. Mr. Magniloquent Codex Posturing aside, look. My bet for the game currently is "OK but not good, another proof that Obsidian cannot make even flawed gems anymore". I don't care that it's Cain & Boyarsky, I don't care about what the journos say, but I do care about the gameplay footage, and everything about that looked pretty poor. If I had to bet money, I certainly am not betting yet on a new Fallout.

My only disagreement is that (1) people seem to be reading really heavily into the previews mediated by ~Games Journos~, which I don't think gets us anywhere, and (2) I think Tartarus Sauce is perfectly fine, while you seem to think it is some kind of singular affront to human civilisation. Perhaps it's possible to have that disagreement while not thinking the other side is made of slug brains.
 

Crescent Hawk

Cipher
Joined
Jul 10, 2014
Messages
664
You can forgive people being a bit cynical Tigranes. After all latest stuff coming from videogame land and Obsidian have been well, insert all the nice "cool female" characters form Tyranny and POE here.
 

Fenix

Arcane
Vatnik
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Russia atchoum!

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
10,350
Learn to read, buddy. I know English isn't your first language, but you keep going around mocking people because you can't understand what they're saying.

(Paranoia doesn't mean that it's not real, unless you're speaking in strictly clinical terms)
 

Fenix

Arcane
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Paranoia is used when someone want to tell, that it's not real.
And my English has nothing with it.
 
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