Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

The Valve and Steam Platform Discussion Thread

Country_Gravy

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 24, 2004
Messages
3,407
Location
Up Yours
Wasteland 2
$250K and put him on the payroll.

Good thing he was a Ukrainian and not a real Russian or there would have been keys for everyone as they helped make gaming great again.
 

LESS T_T

Arcane
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
13,582
Codex 2014
Halloween Sale is not necessarily for horror-themed games, but for Valve secretly and scientifically trying to measure what is the most horrifying monster of all time.

Here are the results:

#10 - Rust - G-Man aka Garry Newman, an FBI agent who thought he is secretly investigating Gabe Newell. Exposed by Newell at the time of Half-life 1 (reportedly punched in the face), and then turned into a game developer, now making a ton of money with Valve.

#9 - The Forest - The Lone Survivor, known for butchering innocent cannibalistic tribes of remote islands.

#8 - Assassin's Creed Odyssey - AssCreed, ass-shaped former-assassin turned into an RPG imposter. Most horrifying to Codexers, I heard.

#7 - Call of Cthulhu - Cthulhu, it's only seventh? What a wimp.

#6 - Divinity: Original Sin 2 - Definitive Edition - Talking skeletons with genitals. Most adored by Codexers, I heard.

#5 - DARK SOULS III - The Fire Fades Edition - Souls-like. Similar to the RPG imposter, you can't escape them.

#4 - Grand Theft Auto V - Car thieves, actual modern horror. They all once dreamed of becoming a rock star, though.

#3 - PLAYERUNKNOWN'S BATTLEGROUNDS - Takeshi Kitano.

#2 - The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Game of the Year Edition - Of course, Halloween should have witches.

#1 - Football Manager 2019 - It's official, bigfoot is the most horrifying monster. Hear their sound, you'll know why.

NOW it's back to usual boring weekly top seller by revenues list!

#10 - HITMAN 2
#9 - ARK: Survival Evolved
#8 - The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt - Game of the Year Edition
#7 - OVERKILL's The Walking Dead
#6 - ARK: Extinction - Expansion Pack
#5 - Grand Theft Auto V
#4 - ARK: Survival Evolved Season Pass
#3 - Total War: WARHAMMER II - Curse of the Vampire Coast
#2 - PLAYERUNKNOWN'S BATTLEGROUNDS
#1 - Football Manager 2019

Overkill's Dead Walker seems like a flop, earned less than expansions of Total Warhammer 2 and ARK?

And in current global top seller list, it's BELOW Divinity: Origianl Sin 2 (which is not on discount). Oh boy. Makes me little worry about SS 3, eh...
 

LESS T_T

Arcane
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
13,582
Codex 2014
Looks like Steam is leaking again, some hidden app names are exposed via SteamDB?

Nothing that much interesting I can find, though.

Server app for inXile's Wasteland: Frostpoint: https://steamdb.info/app/774581/ (so this is the main app: https://steamdb.info/app/684030/)

Broken Horizon (this is the rumored codename for Lost Planet 4) https://steamdb.info/app/834200/

Furyu1 (probably referring to Japanese developer Furyu, another one of their games coming to PC?) https://steamdb.info/app/981750/
 

Hirato

Purse-Owner
Patron
Joined
Oct 16, 2010
Messages
4,002
Location
Australia
Codex 2012 Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong
5xmcrxL.png


Hooray, now the mad cunts of the world can be ripped off just like they are in their local stores!
Current conversion rate is 1 AUD -> 0.73 USD; closer to 0.716 if you factor in the typical foreign transaction fee of 2%
Valve converted everyone's wallets at a rate of 1 AUD = 0.69 USD, so we aussies already got gypped

Plus their recommendations to game devs were at the same rate, so prices of most things in store have gone up around 8.5% on average!
Some things are cheaper, others even more expensive.

Hooray~!
As an aussie I love being ripped off.
Who'd want to pay a 2% foreign transaction fee when you can pay 8.5% higher prices instead!
Absolute fucking bargain!
 

Mr. Pink

Travelling Gourmand, Crab Specialist
Joined
Jan 9, 2015
Messages
3,050
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Screenshot_from_2018-11-21_02-24-58.png


they should just start paying people $2.50 to take these. it's only -10% more.
 

Gerrard

Arcane
Joined
Nov 5, 2007
Messages
13,006
5xmcrxL.png


Hooray, now the mad cunts of the world can be ripped off just like they are in their local stores!
Current conversion rate is 1 AUD -> 0.73 USD; closer to 0.716 if you factor in the typical foreign transaction fee of 2%
Valve converted everyone's wallets at a rate of 1 AUD = 0.69 USD, so we aussies already got gypped

Plus their recommendations to game devs were at the same rate, so prices of most things in store have gone up around 8.5% on average!
Some things are cheaper, others even more expensive.

Hooray~!
As an aussie I love being ripped off.
Who'd want to pay a 2% foreign transaction fee when you can pay 8.5% higher prices instead!
Absolute fucking bargain!
You have literally nothing to complain about, ya cunt.

ZnHcbMh.png
 

Unkillable Cat

LEST WE FORGET
Patron
Joined
May 13, 2009
Messages
28,771
Codex 2014 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy
The current interface is usable, the new one will, without a doubt, be shit.

The current interface is usable but could stand improvement. Considerable improvement, in fact.

My money is on the new interface ignoring all of the needed features and just going with a generic mobile interface.
 

LESS T_T

Arcane
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
13,582
Codex 2014
Responding to the AAA exodus?: https://steamcommunity.com/groups/steamworks#announcements/detail/1697191267930157838

New Revenue Share Tiers and other updates to the Steam Distribution Agreement

Today, we updated the Steam Distribution Agreement with several important changes. Actual Authority members can review all the terms and details with their next login in to Steamworks but we wanted to highlight a few of the changes\additions in this note.

The value of a large network like Steam has many benefits that are contributed to and shared by all the participants. Finding the right balance to reflect those contributions is a tricky but important factor in a well-functioning network. It’s always been apparent that successful games and their large audiences have a material impact on those network effects so making sure Steam recognizes and continues to be an attractive platform for those games is an important goal for all participants in the network.

With that in mind, we’ve created new revenue share tiers for games that hit certain revenue levels. Starting from October 1, 2018 (i.e. revenues prior to that date are not included), when a game makes over $10 million on Steam, the revenue share for that application will adjust to 75%/25% on earnings beyond $10M. At $50 million, the revenue share will adjust to 80%/20% on earnings beyond $50M. Revenue includes game packages, DLC, in-game sales, and Community Marketplace game fees. Our hope is this change will reward the positive network effects generated by developers of big games, further aligning their interests with Steam and the community.

We’ve also made a change to the agreement regarding confidentiality of your sales data. We frequently get questions from partners who want to talk with other developers\third parties or publicly about the sales of their games on Steam. We've heard you, and we're updating the confidentiality provisions to make it clear that the partner can share sales data about their game as they see fit.

Other less exciting changes include:

- Language to address how customer data is treated under the 2018 European data rules (GDPR) This doesn't change the fundamental agreement between Steam and game makers about customer data - Valve still keeps the data it collects from customers, and partners still keep the data customers give them. But this language helps clarify how that relationship maps to the terms of GDPR.

- Safety warranties prompted by VR. We have added some basic safety warranties about games – that they won't cause physical harm, and they won't override Steam safety features like Chaperone.

We’re spending a bunch of time and energy adding some new developer tools and features for self-marketing\promotion, improved navigation data, as well as more insight into metrics on impressions and activity for your games on Steam. We’re also continuing the effort to improve and expand access to markets all over the world with new currencies, server\bandwidth infrastructure and payment methods. More to come on that in the future.

The Steam Team
 

Jenkem

その目、だれの目?
Patron
Vatnik
Joined
Nov 30, 2016
Messages
9,118
Location
An oasis of love and friendship.
Make the Codex Great Again! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. I helped put crap in Monomyth
holy tile cancer batman
I hope they add an option to stay on the old UI 'cause that one at least looks usable on a PC.

I highly doubt that it will be the redesign, it's two years old at this point and Valve is constantly iterating on things, often to the detriment that they never actually release anything (see HL3)
 

GrainWetski

Arcane
Joined
Oct 17, 2012
Messages
5,513
holy tile cancer batman
I hope they add an option to stay on the old UI 'cause that one at least looks usable on a PC.
Might be too optimistic, but I can't imagine the UI would look anything like that. They already have a separate UI for cuntpads and the mobile app is nothing like the PC one, so they're obviously not like the lazy retards that make their websites designed for phones on every platform.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
100,094
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Responding to the AAA exodus?: https://steamcommunity.com/groups/steamworks#announcements/detail/1697191267930157838

With that in mind, we’ve created new revenue share tiers for games that hit certain revenue levels. Starting from October 1, 2018 (i.e. revenues prior to that date are not included), when a game makes over $10 million on Steam, the revenue share for that application will adjust to 75%/25% on earnings beyond $10M. At $50 million, the revenue share will adjust to 80%/20% on earnings beyond $50M. Revenue includes game packages, DLC, in-game sales, and Community Marketplace game fees. Our hope is this change will reward the positive network effects generated by developers of big games, further aligning their interests with Steam and the community.

This is clever - it actually incentivizes publishers not to sell their games on other stores. Any sale not on Steam doesn't contribute towards reaching the $10 million and $50 million milestones.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
100,094
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Vault Dweller

http://greyaliengames.com/blog/steams-discovery-algorithm-killed-my-sales/

Steam’s discovery algorithm killed my sales



Firstly I want to be clear that I have had some measure of success on Steam and I’ve enjoyed going to Steam Dev Days and other events and talking to their reps who seem to be genuinely interested supporting indie developers. So this blog post is not about me hating on Steam, rather it’s to discuss a recent issue that has impacted my sales and the sales of many other indies too.

Here’s a huge Steamworks forum post about the issue (you have to be logged on as a developer to read it).

The October Discovery Bug

In early October Valve changed something in their discovery algorithm and introduced a bad bug which meant that Steam was only recommending some big name games instead of relevant games, oops!

Ongoing Discovery Issues

Valve fixed the October discovery bug quickly (within a week I think) but since then many indies have seen a big dip in their traffic from “Other Product Pages” and “Home Page”. Other product pages includes a sub-category of “Discovery Queue” and traffic from that source appears to have decreased significantly for me if I compare before and after the October bug.

Here’s a good week (click to enlarge the image):


And here’s a bad week (click to enlarge the image):


You can see that Other Product Pages has gone from being my top traffic source with 305 visits to a mediocre traffic source with only 91 visits.

This effect can also be seen on the traffic graphs in Steamworks (click image below to enlarge it). The orange line is “Other Product Pages”. I ran a weeklong sale at the start of Oct but straight after the sale finished the traffic from other product pages dropped and stayed low. The other two peaks are the Steam Halloween and Thanksgiving sales.



I can see the same drop in traffic for two of my other games and some devs have showed me charts with an even more severe drop.
Impact on Sales



I compared full price sales before and after the October bug (being careful to avoid weeklong sales and Steam sales) and my total units sold have halved. Revenue has dipped even more because our most expensive game has dropped to 36% of previous unit sales.

I’m not sure if this issue also affects traffic during a) discount sales and b) game launches because those are a lot harder to analyse like for like, but based on some data I’ve seen from other developers I’m suspicious that those things may also be impacted.

Has this issue affected all indies?

I’ve heard in private that some games are either not affected by this issue or have actually benefited from it with increased traffic! It stands to reason that if many devs are losing traffic, then that traffic must be going elsewhere. That said, a huge number of smaller indies have been hit hard by this issue, harder than me, with traffic and sales dropping to near zero in many cases.

Have I told Valve about it?

Like many indies who added games to Steam since Steam Greenlight I don’t have an official rep. However I did email a couple of reps who I got business cards from and they said they would look into it, but I haven’t heard from them since then.

Admittedly I should chase them up but I was waiting to see if the problem resolved itself, but it’s been ongoing for two months now. Other indies I know have emailed their reps but I haven’t heard anything positive yet.

Here’s the data I sent to Valve (click to enlarge) along with screenshots of the traffic graphs.



Theories

Fellow indie dev Danny Day has suggested that the discovery algorithm may have a historical data component to it and after the initial October bug the historical data got trashed and so the algorithm is not giving the same results as before.

October/November is also AAA release season and includes two Steam sales so it’s possible that our sales are impacted slightly, but that doesn’t explain the sudden huge drop off in discovery traffic that many indies are seeing.

Another possibility is just that Valve changed the algorithm to highlight different games and some devs have benefited and others have not.

It’s even possible that Valve shifted some kind of slider from “show a variety of indie games” further towards “show popular games that earn more money”. They are a corporation after all and corporations like to make money and they don’t have any real obligation to help out smaller indie teams. This particular point seems evident when taking into account the recent news that games grossing over $10M will receive a greater share of the revenue but struggling indies will not.

Also I’ve heard Valve say multiple times that they put the customer first (understandably) and so they probably believe whatever changes they make improve the experience for customers.

But I must stress that the above points are just theories, we haven’t heard anything official from Valve yet.

Selling Direct and Itch.io

So, should I double down on selling direct or use itch.io?

Well I’ve been selling direct since 2006, but sadly my direct sales are about 1% of my total revenue. I need distributors like Steam to survive. I wish it wasn’t that way, but it is.

Btw, you can buy all my games direct from me here. I get 100% of the revenue minus a small processing fee, so it’s amazing and the best way you can support indies is to buy direct.

The second best way is to buy through itch.io because they only take a small fee (in fact developers can set it at a rate they think is fair). I haven’t put my games on itch.io yet because I’ve heard that sales on there are very low and I’ve been busy with potentially higher value tasks. However, I will try out Regency Solitaire on there soon and see how it gets on as I’d like to support the platform now more than ever.

More discussion

Check out these Twitter threads for more discussion with other devs who have also shared their data.

Conclusion

In the past I have felt positive about Steam, but these discovery changes and the recent revenue share changes that are only relevant to hugely successful games don’t make me feel particularly positive about the future of selling games on Steam. In fact I’d go as far as to say I’m worried.

Making indie games is my full time job and I’d really like it to continue for many years. I’ve had to adapt a lot over the years and it feels like another phase of adaption is fast approaching…

https://steamcommunity.com/groups/steamworks#announcements/detail/1697191267955776539

About Store Traffic to Games in October
5 DECEMBER - TOMB

We wanted to address some concerns we've heard from a few developers about store traffic to their games in October. Back then, after some developers let us know about the issue, we did some investigation, found a bug in one widget, and pushed out a fix a few days later (along with making some tweaks to the algorithm for that widget).

Here's the history of what happened:

On October 5th, we deployed some code to Steam that changed the defaults for our search queries to factor in sales and wishlist activity more than before. This change was meant to fix an issue where customers would search for a game, but that game would be much lower in the search results than other less relevant games.

This change had the unintended side-effect of de-boosting tags in the “More Like This” section on a game's store page. What that meant was that instead of seeing products similar to the game, you saw games that shared just one tag in common, but were effectively the most popular games on Steam. This isn't how we wanted that feature to work.

On October 9th, to fix the issue, we changed the algorithm for the "More Like This" section to increase the boost on tag similarity. However, we still kept a part of the change that factored in sales and wishlist popularity. On October 30th, we increased the weighting of tag-similarity again based on the results we were seeing.

To compound matters, from October 10-17, we were also running an experiment in the same "More Like This" section to test out a new algorithm which we hoped would be more effective in showing customers games that we think they would be interested in. This experiment ended up showing fewer products to a subset of customers, which led to a decrease in overall impressions in that area.

As a result, overall impressions and views for the "More Like This" section did show a substantial decrease for about two weeks after the initial bug. But traffic recovered around October 19th, and has stabilized since.

In general, we’re always trying to show games to customers that we think they will enjoy, no matter who made them, what the budget was, when they came out, etc. We're constantly exploring ideas and trying new things to try to figure out the best ways to do this. The fact is, traffic is going to shift whenever we do this work; it may go up or it may go down for any individual product. However, not all impressions and views are equal – in the end, what matters is that we show customers games that they find interesting.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom