Thief fan missions and campaigns

[Riskbreaker]

Just finished the first mission, really enjoying this. Visuals and atmosphere are top notch, don't want to sound like a graphic whore or anything but I can imagine how, with lesser presentation, this could've been close to boring to play considering how much of Thief's gameplay was cut off. Way it is tho, it is pretty enjoyable to just roam around and soak in the atmosphere.

Do love the sheer number of homages you guys put in there. I take it that you're pretty big (understatement?) fans of "The Big Sleep", eh?

 

[Yandros]

Yeah that's my personal favorite, but certainly also "The Maltese Falcon", and to a lesser extent "The Blue Dahlia", "The Third Man" and "Casablanca" (none of which have the iconic private eye, but have plenty of atmosphere and great stories). And in case anyone was wondering, Tannar and I have already discussed reusing the map to tell a different Sam Marlowe story at some point in the future, but certainly not in the next couple of years, as we both have other projects on our plates that we've been neglecting the last 10 months.

 

[JarlFrank]

We are, of course, free to use your assets if we ever want to make a Thief FM in a modern setting, eh?

Going to give it a shot later this week. I'm looking forward to it, since I'm a big fan of hardboiled noir fiction. Watched the intro movie on youtube, and it gives off just the right atmosphere.
And since I've been looking for some good music and you seem to be the right person to ask, Yandros... do you have any recommendations for good noir-ish jazz? :D

 

[Random_Taffer]

do you have any recommendations for good noir-ish jazz? :D

Be careful what you wish for!!!

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Yeah that's my personal favorite, but certainly also "The Maltese Falcon", and to a lesser extent "The Blue Dahlia", "The Third Man" and "Casablanca" (none of which have the iconic private eye, but have plenty of atmosphere and great stories). And in case anyone was wondering, Tannar and I have already discussed reusing the map to tell a different Sam Marlowe story at some point in the future, but certainly not in the next couple of years, as we both have other projects on our plates that we've been neglecting the last 10 months.

Are all these movies with Bogart in them? I know some are...

 

[Yandros]

He plays Sam Spade in The Maltese Falcon and is in Casablanca, but not the other two.

 

[Melan]

No kidding about Waterfront Racket. I held out until I could really dedicate a full, relaxed evening to it, and it was a blast. A bit short if you only take the mission content (I was surprised it didn't go further), but it is excellent just for walking around, soaking up the detail and wondering at all the period americana you guys crammed into it. Bravo!

 

[Max_b5]

I'm downloading Waterfront Racket so I can play something tonight. I might be way too late to the party but having read the comments I'm definitely going to try it. On a side note, I've been way too busy lately and haven't got time for Thief or DromEd. Unfortunately, looking at the circumstances, I might give up the Darkstone Gem project and upload some texture files and multibrushes so that someone else can give use to them.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

After some deliberation (and a couple of beers) I think I'm better off saying this than not, but...I did not enjoy "Waterfront Racket."

The primary reason is first and foremost a personal one - while I acknowledge and recognize Film Noir, I've never learned to enjoy it. It's just not my cup of tea.

I played the FM, completed the first mission (took a short walk around the second), took my time to look around, and saw all the effort and work put into it, and I have nothing against any of that...it just didn't ring any bells for me. I did like very much the effort of making relevant characters stay in colour while "extras" remained in black and white - a brilliant decision of artistic (and gameplay-relevant) design...but that's as far as "WR" did anything for me.

There's another, slightly minor reason, and this is probably the only valid point of criticism that can be aimed at the FM, and that is the fact that in order for "WR" to work, the gameplay aspects of Thief (and the Dark Engine) needed to be scaled back dumbed down. I ran into invisible walls, I did not come across any in-game critters that seemed to care that I was stomping about beyond the plot-vital ones, and there was little to no freedom of exploration that could net me extra backstory or anything that would benefit me in general. This goes against what Thief stands for, and to use the Dark Engine to do this feels a little dirty, to be honest.

Time and time again the Dark Engine has shown itself to be a very flexible engine...and while I do commend that someone would take the time to make a project like this in an engine that's close to 20 years old, I have to ask the question...wouldn't this have been better off in a more modern engine? The Unreal engine? Or maybe the Dark Mod? Two engines that can handle lighting so much better than the Dark Engine, and would have made the Film Noir experience so much better?

"To every thing there is a season"...as the song (and book) proclaimed. This feels like the right thing in the wrong season.

 

[Yandros]

That's all a very fair position to take on WR, and we knew going in that it wouldn't be plenty of people's cup of tea. It's really a fanboi homage to noir as much as anything else, so those who don't share that aren't likely to really enjoy it. And we absolutely had to dumb down the Thief part of the gameplay to suit the context, but that was a conscious decision too. Looking back, giving Sam a gun and implementing realistic consequences for using it in all the variously justified as well as unjustified ways would have made for a more enjoyable mission gameplay-wise, and perhaps slightly more true to noir too, but that would have required more time than we were willing to give. As it is, it was begun as a contest entry that I hoped to finish in 2-3 months, and it dragged on for 10 months; by the end Tannar and I were both desperate to be done with it and move on to other projects, and I don't like feeling that way on release day.

As for why we did it in Dark, that's easy... I don't know any other engines. :D

One great side benefit of this project is that we have gained a new author: Tannar now knows enough about Dromed that he plans to begin working on his first solo mission. I'm excited about that because I know how expertly and tenaciously he approaches crafting story and gameplay, so if he can get the hang of architecture we'll have another talented author releasing missions.

 

[Melan]

I accept that Waterfront Racket falls on its face if it is reviewed as a Thief mission, and held against Thief's gameplay principles. However, Waterfront Racket does not pretend to be a Thief mission, so it should be approached on its own terms. It may be fair to say it is a tad walking simulator-y, or that it doesn't do as much with its own setting as it could. But Thief has always been used as a vehicle for odd experiments*, and it makes no sense to deny this tradition. People do it because people want to do it, and the toolset gives them a venue to express their creativity.

___________
* It is not the only one: just yesterday, I was playing a Quake level that tries to be a Braveheart-style Scottish freedom fighters vs. the English kind of deal (the English are mainly represented by death knights, knights and ogres, and you kill them with your totally Scottish super-shotgun and nailgun).

 

[JarlFrank]

I'm downloading Waterfront Racket so I can play something tonight. I might be way too late to the party but having read the comments I'm definitely going to try it. On a side note, I've been way too busy lately and haven't got time for Thief or DromEd. Unfortunately, looking at the circumstances, I might give up the Darkstone Gem project and upload some texture files and multibrushes so that someone else can give use to them.

Noooo whyyyyy

Time and time again the Dark Engine has shown itself to be a very flexible engine...and while I do commend that someone would take the time to make a project like this in an engine that's close to 20 years old, I have to ask the question...wouldn't this have been better off in a more modern engine? The Unreal engine? Or maybe the Dark Mod? Two engines that can handle lighting so much better than the Dark Engine, and would have made the Film Noir experience so much better?

"To every thing there is a season"...as the song (and book) proclaimed. This feels like the right thing in the wrong season.

I played the thing too, and I enjoyed it. Sure, it's not the usual Thief fare, but it clearly disclaims that it's not right there in the release thread and in the readme, so I was prepared for that. Ghosting around in the warehouse still felt Thiefy enough, even without loot and the typical arrows and tools. The main thing about it was the story and the atmosphere.

Fun fact: at the end of the thing, when the credits roll, it even says "A movie by Yandros and Tannar", rather than game or FM, which is a nice touch.

And I don't think it's the wrong engine, not at all. I actually think that Thief and the Dark Engine, with its older graphics and less fancy effects, is a lot better suited for this noirish experience than TDM or the modern Unreal engine would be. It captures the noir atmosphere just right, and if you love noir, you're going to enjoy Waterfront Racket. It had all the elements that make for a good noir story.

I totally get how it's entirely uninteresting to someone who's not into noir stories. But for those who are, it's a great experience.

 

[Renault]

There have been plenty of other non-Thief missions done in the dark engine, this shouldn't be any different. We've had Fables of the Penitent Thief, 2 Kill Factories, a Batman demo, and a whole bunch of space themed missions. Puzzle FMs too, like Mind Master or The Cube (and I think Wooden Box? Haven't played it yet). A Nice Game of Chess. Snowball Fight. All the Total Crap missions. And so on.

I think it's kind of fun to see authors create something non-Thief in dark. But I don't think it's a valid reason to criticize a release - I don't even know how you can consider these types of missions to be "dumbed down."

 

[Yandros]

I don't think UnkCat said the missions were dumbed down, only that (almost by definition) they require dumbing down the core Thief gameplay mechanics, since they generally intentionally don't make use of them (or go to lengths to avoid some of them, as in the case of Racket).

 

[sparq_beam]

Has anyone tried playing T2 on windows 8? I replayed through the game recently and I have a suspicion that there was something wrong with the collisions: I had more trouble than I expected vaulting and a few times guards got stuck in walls on their patrols or when walking back to their post from being alerted. I don't remember if this was always the case or some problem with modern hardware (I used the GOG version which seems to have NewDark already installed).

I tried looking at myself with the scouting orb, and it seems I'm floating when I'm crouched:

Spoiler

 

[Riskbreaker]

Nicked's new mission is looking real sweet:
https://nickdablin.wordpress.com/2016/06/26/thief-level-work-in-progress/
Loving that sunset lighting, reminds me of HipBreaker's "Resonance" and that excellent first mission from his "Breaking the Stone" campaign.

 

[Garrettt]

Melan and Bikerdude's new mission is out http://forums.thedarkmod.com/topic/...ny-dreadful-3-by-melan-and-bikerdude-20160710

I've played a little bit of it so far and it's not too shabby. It has a real claustrophobic city feel to it, plenty of areas to explore. The story is really interesting and you can complete objectives in multiple ways which is a new concept to TDM I believe.

Lots of great custom brush work and models as well, the city feels like something straight out of the old thief games.

Here's some screenshots I took:

 

[Pirata Alma Negra]

Is thief 2x any good?

 

[Melan]

It is big, and the only completed full-length campaign with fully animated briefings, etc. But I never found it outstanding. There are a few memorable missions, but most of the content is on an even, mostly goodish level. The spark of genius isn't there.

 

[HoboForEternity]

i installed t2x, but when i opened it, it said please insert thief 2 game disc.

i have steam version. help?

 

[Icewater]

You try this?

http://ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144804

 

[HoboForEternity]

I got it runnin via FMsel, but i will try. Thanks

 

[tannisroot]

I enjoyed The Rose Cottage - it felt like a real location and had a great atmosphere - so I checked out Saturnine's previous mission "The Seventh Crystal." Released during Thief 2's nascent days, it's widely regarded as a must-play by the community.

Firstly, the voice acting is HORRID. The player has to sit through 5+ minutes of it during a forced camvator sequence. Thank god it's skippable with a cheat.

Then the first thing the author has you do once he relinquishes control? Lockpicking with zero risk of discovery and it takes twice as long as any lock the OMs. Red flag.

But what really irks me is that the mission author saw fit to increase the difficulty of the mission in the most perfunctory Bethesda way: the patrols are all doubled or tripled and guards are ludicrously sensitive even on normal. The floors might as well all be marble because a guard could hear a mouse fart twenty feet away through a brick wall. Is Garrett wearing the iron boots from Ocarina of Time?

It's a tedious quicksave / blackjack fest. Shit like this is what put me off trying fan missions for so long. Is it really worth seeing through to the end or should I just play something by Melan?

 

[JarlFrank]

Personally I found Seventh Crystal to be solid but not great.

The guards' sensitivity has to be scaled up for you for some reason, they never reacted like this for me. Bug, maybe? I know they got mad when I stepped even slightly on marble, but jumping on carpet and running on stone was totally okay.

If you don't enjoy it to this point, there's no need to go on though. The mission doesn't get any different, it's basically just this mansion heist and if you don't like the mansion's design, it's pointless to go on.

 

[Renault]

There's a new contest going on, run by Dev_Anj. Check it out here:

http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146929

And a new mission by squadarofl, Watery Grave:

http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146932