KickStarter Underworld Ascendant is a disaster

[MasterLobar]

I actually think that's unlikely. The use of these funds is very likely controlled tightly and tied to specific expenditures related the game for which the publishing deal was signed.

My suspicion is the following: In the publishing deal, they promised 505 to finish UA with a given amount of funding. When due to mismanagement, they ran out of funds for UA in mid-2018, 505 refused to give more cash, but the game wasn't even half finished (Backer Beta), so they feared they would get sued by 505 if they don't fix the worst bugs.

I think that's why they raised $3.5 million in new series A stock equity in August 2018, which obviously came from the OS management/owners.

Today, they openly admit they are using own funds to pay for the updates (and also for the console version which was likely promised in their publishing deal). Why would they do that for a game that isn't selling? Because 505 would sue otherwise.

Btw, when I started to point this out on the OS forum, my posts got repeatedly deleted. Seems to be a soft spot.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

People never put up personal monies to protect incorporated company assets in the face of litigation... There is no need as liability and risk are limited to the contracted entity.

Principals inject their money into the company, but not due to possible litigation. They are investing in their company.

More likely, they have a plan to release on console and they are using some of that cash to benefit the PC version as the console release will share assets and the game needs fixes for console release.

Comments on their forum would be deleted because they (likely falsely) speculate on financial/legal matters. It can reasonably be said those types of posts are inappropriate on their forum. Some companies wouldn't care -- many ignore their forums entirely.

 

[Child of Malkav]

People never put up personal monies to protect incorporated company assets in the face of litigation... There is no need as liability and risk are limited to the contracted entity.

In my country's civil law, if you work for a company, for example, and you fuck up and the company gets sued and loses and has to pay like 100.000$, it will pay that, if it's able to and then sue you to recover that money. There are some limits as to how much they can take without throwing you on the streets but, yeah, it's really bad if something like this happens.
If what was said so far, in the last 2 months or so is real, about them having money problems, I don't see Otherside Entertainment surviving a lawsuit, but then again I don't know the legislation there.

 

[MasterLobar]

People never put up personal monies to protect incorporated company assets in the face of litigation... There is no need as liability and risk are limited to the contracted entity.

[...]

More likely, they have a plan to release on console and they are using some of that cash to benefit the PC version as the console release will share assets and the game needs fixes for console release.

I would be surprised if a publishing deal with a firm that is publishing its first game ever did not contain at least some personal liability on the part of the owners/top management of the company. In venture capital deals, it is common practice to do so. Banks also usually ask for start up owners to guarantee parts of a loan. I'd be surprised if 505 wrote them a blank check with no guarantees.

The second part above doesn't make any sense to be honest. UA won't make any money for OS, because all the money goes to 505 until they recoup their investment which is very likely at least several $100,000s and may well be more than one million. The deal was announced in August 2017 so they funded more than one year of development. The game has sold less than 20,000 copies according to SteamSpy, and from that you have to subtract Steam's part, discounts and refunds. OS won't ever see one dollar from this game (in fact they admitted it).

A console version won't make any money either. It's not suddenly going to be a big seller. For OS, it's a totally nonsensical decision to throw more good money after bad and make a console version. It must be a contractual obligation.

 

[Infinitron]

A console version won't make any money either. It's not suddenly going to be a big seller. For OS, it's a totally nonsensical decision to throw more good money after bad and make a console version. It must be a contractual obligation.

There's a contractual obligation to make a console version. This is quite common, even in games that flopped bigtime. We've seen it before.

 

[Nyast]

I wouldn't be so sure the game won't sell on consoles. Console gamers are far less informed than PC / Steam users ( especially when there's no review system in place ) and the appeal of UA is strong. Make a half decent non-representative video, a bunch of screenshots, and I'm pretty sure the game will sell decently ( aka > 50K+ ) on consoles. Also, the art style ( which was controversial for PC ) will work in their favor for consoles.

 

[LESS T_T]

Assuming this will keep the same price point in consoles, I think they will at least google this game, and most likely see the fabulous review scores and Metacritic score that Google kindly showing on the first page of results.

(Also like I posted earlier 505 Games has gone through this before with publishing Takedown: Red Sabre, another Kickstarter and development disaster, first on PC and later on console [digital only]. I guess they probably know what they're doing.)

 

[MasterLobar]

That's the point. 505 is going to limit their losses with the console version, but I am still positive that no money is ever going to reach OS. For that to happen, the game would have to earn 505's entire investment (probably plus a 20% or so margin). That's certainly north of $1 million. 50k console copies won't make a difference for OS.

That said, I agree with most of Nyast's points.

 

[Doctor Sbaitso]

If entreprenneurs were always out on a legal limb, innovation is stiffled and the economy would be very brittle. If they are smart an off shore LLC holds IP and on shore pays licensing fees.

People never put up personal monies to protect incorporated company assets in the face of litigation... There is no need as liability and risk are limited to the contracted entity.

[...]

More likely, they have a plan to release on console and they are using some of that cash to benefit the PC version as the console release will share assets and the game needs fixes for console release.

I would be surprised if a publishing deal with a firm that is publishing its first game ever did not contain at least some personal liability on the part of the owners/top management of the company. In venture capital deals, it is common practice to do so. Banks also usually ask for start up owners to guarantee parts of a loan. I'd be surprised if 505 wrote them a blank check with no guarantees.

The second part above doesn't make any sense to be honest. UA won't make any money for OS, because all the money goes to 505 until they recoup their investment which is very likely at least several $100,000s and may well be more than one million. The deal was announced in August 2017 so they funded more than one year of development. The game has sold less than 20,000 copies according to SteamSpy, and from that you have to subtract Steam's part, discounts and refunds. OS won't ever see one dollar from this game (in fact they admitted it).

A console version won't make any money either. It's not suddenly going to be a big seller. For OS, it's a totally nonsensical decision to throw more good money after bad and make a console version. It must be a contractual obligation.

Guarantees yes, via insurance or securities. There are always measures to protect personal assets and there are laws to insulate against personal risk. That does not prevent someone from filing a civil suit against an individual. A suit doesn't mean you will win but does open you up to a counter.

 

[MasterLobar]

Is it suspicious if someone posts a positive review after playing 12 minutes? Asking for a friend.

https://steamcommunity.com/id/eisberg77/recommended/692840/

Not played one more second since writing that review 2 weeks ago. Totally not planted...

 

[Metro]

Not played one more second since writing that review 2 weeks ago. Totally not planted...

Oh wow... that guy shills on the Rebel Galaxy forum supporting the developers decision to go with Epic Store exclusivity. This just confirms it -- paid shill.

 

[Wulfric Pinewood]

You are overreacting guys, game is quite good after last patch and it's close to Ultima Underworld I or II - and to be honest with nostalgy factor - UU 's both were boring and pain to play after 1st hour in their original realease time [when wow factor goes away].
But still Underworld Ascendant is quite crappy. Thats all. It's like attractive sandbox with great potential filled with dogshit, but when shit is cleared there will be reason to play longer than few hours.
It's sad for older players, but we can safetly say that LEGENDS DIED . Bioware turns into cemetery, Maxis is dead, Bullfrog star is faded away with crazy Peter, Fallout turns into pile of crap, Blizzard release Diablo clone from Korea on phones instead of glorious Diablo IV, dozen od other classic studios are dead and their creativity is DEAD.
But still i have faith in those who remain and new wave of gamedev based on experience of old dogs.
Games were and must remain great place to stay for a while !
Conclusion:
There are many inspiring cprgs around but we are getting older and gaming as a whole is teenage playground not created in its roots for adult people .
That's the MAIN PRESENT problem with gaming industry, it tries to take care with quite adult themes buts its oriented still to the teenagers , but times are different than in 80's or 90's.
Only proper way it's to deliver adult themes to adult players or teenage themes with teenage ways, kids themes with kids ways - look at success of Witcher 3 .
Everything works there, and still it's most sellable game on pc/xoxo with highest user ratings in history.
Demanding and hard to please gamers which remember times of 80's / 90's deserve to be important part of target group for Developers.
We need easy to play [ in terms of UI, MECHANICS BECOUSE WE ARE WORK & FAMILY CULTISTS AND DON'T HAVE FREAKING TIME ] but demanding and deep, great games with solid background ,no matter if it is fps / adventure / crpg / strategy etc.
And still most of AAA titles are oriented for today , mostly brainless teenagers with their heads glued to smartphones and all that shit. But Devs sould remember that actual consumers with real money are people who were teen in 90's or 80's and its time to fuckin wake up and deliver some fuckin quality.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Not played one more second since writing that review 2 weeks ago. Totally not planted...

Oh wow... that guy shills on the Rebel Galaxy forum supporting the developers decision to go with Epic Store exclusivity. This just confirms it -- paid shill.

that's a perfectly fine thing to shit on them for though

 

[Heretic]

He shills for them, not shits on them.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

We don’t know what kinky gross crap he’s into.

 

[BEvers]

 

[Viata]

 

[Steamboat Willie]

That Dewi Morgan furfag has been around sucking off the devs ever since this disaster launched. He even came to the Steam forums for a while as part of some "fact finding" mission to figure out why so many people were unhappy with the game. There's a UA wiki that I think he's written entirely on his own.

 

[BEvers]

That Dewi Morgan furfag

He's actually quite famous in certain circles:

 

[Space Nugget]

That Dewi Morgan furfag

He's actually quite famous in certain circles:

*googles "Furcadia"*

Spoiler

 

[Incendax]

He's actually quite famous in certain circles:

Having also worked at Dragon's Eye Productions, I can say that the programming team and web development team were almost all volunteers also. There was very little managing, and quite a bit of polite asking. But I will admit, it looks good on a resume.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

WTF is that?

Edit—
YouTube’s it as well as googled. No stats all imagination and “Open mind.”

 

[taxalot]

No, that's Furcadia, a furry roleplaying simulator.

I remember when I was a teen ; I had no idea what furries were and I was looking for free MMOs. And it was the only one I kept finding. I remember it fully intrigued me : no combat, no puzzle, just people looking like that interacting. I tried it a few times and failed to see the point.

Then, it all became clear, and I felt really dirty for just being on there once.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

First one I found was Wyvern. “Zombie rots a little. MORE BRAIIINNNSSSS!”

 

[Metro]

He shills for them, not shits on them.

Yes, that. He's a white knight for developers no matter what crap they pull.