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Variable Movement Speed

Serus

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Not a CRPG, but Hero Quest has random movement for heroes : monsters have a constant speed (10 for goblins, 8 for orcs, etc.), but heroes have to roll 2D6.

It's so random and unpredictable as to be a real pain in the ass. Rolling high will often be pointless anyway, because you don't want to get too far from the rest of the group (and you don't know how they will roll for movement if they act after you) ; rolling low will often prevent you from reaching a monster you really want to be attacking.
It's something that can be found in several quasi-rpg board games. Another exemple is Shadows of Brimstone, with a little more nuance.
In HQ, i think it was supposed to teach people to coordinate. Remember, very young players in board games tend to charge into enemies in co-op games "just for fun". It is infuriating but fun when you play with a 12 years old who endangers everyone in the team by doing that. Not saying that it's a well though mechanic but it works to a point.
However, in single player turn based CRPGs it doesn't make sense.
 

Serus

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Some movement penalties seem to have "random" characteristics. Especially if you move after drinking. Everything seems to fight you and moving becomes like combat! In fact drinking should be a RNG enabler. Everything becomes RNG after alcohol and what was already RNG becomes more so. No more 5 movement, it is d8 now. No more 1d10+5 damage, it's 1d20 and so on.
 

rojay

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I think movement being standardized in that way makes sense, and I'm not sure how you explain why the distance you can travel in a turn is random. You can limit movement in any number of ways in addition to limits based on size/dexterity/quickness etc. Why would you make it random?
Terrain difficulty. It usually gets abstracted as halving your movement, but more realistically the effect should be random.
Why? This can already be handled by using your dexterity score, and it is for things like "grease," where if you fail a dexterity check you fall and can't move at all. I guess you could add some complexity by making it 1/2 movement if your roll is within 10-20% of the save target but it just seems like adding a solution to something that's not a problem in the first place.
When you move, the earth beneath your feet doesn't actively try to fight you.
every surface is perfectly even now?
Terrain difficulty, as Storyfag noted, handles this. There are rules in a lot of games for "difficult terrain reducing movement speed. You could make it more granular if you add separate categories for just how difficult a specific terrain is, but again that seems like overkill.

Not to get all "meta" but there's always a tradeoff between "realism" and "fun" in games and we can disagree about where to draw the line. I mean, you could abstract all combat into a single dice roll if you wanted to but who wants to play that game?

I remember early editions of D&D had specific tables that determined the effective armor class of certain armors against certain weapons. I think in later editions it got abstracted to reduced damage from slashing, piercing and bludgeoning damage?

Granted, complexity of that sort is less of an issue in a computer game, where it's a lot easier and faster to resolve those sort of calculations than it would be if you were playing a tabletop game but from the perspective of "does this make the game more fun/interesting?" I don't think random movement speed makes a lot of sense.
 

White Grey

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I think the idea has merit. We must acknowledge that all turn-based games rely on having at least some randomness to keep things dynamic and prevent combats becoming trite solved puzzles. This is regularly done with random party/enemy placements, accuracy, damage, terrain generation, etc. So let's say we want to add another dimension to how dynamic our combats can be by forcing the player to account and compensate for variability in movement across the grid.

First things first... disrupting a pillar of tactical combat by making base movement speed random is going to create a lot of problems: it'll fuck with established design tactics and rules, meaning it'll have a much bigger overall design cost, and it'll fuck with player expectations, leading to frustrating unexpected outcomes. So instead, I suggest keeping base movespeed across the grid a fixed number between 1-5 squares per turn, depending on things like stats, class, perks, equipment, etc. For this example I'm going to use a rectangular grid, I guess.

So at base, you get to move 3 squares per turn, every turn. You also get a free "teleport" action every turn which allows you to pick any point within 12 squares of the currently selected character, and appear somewhere within 4 squares of your chosen point. We can then add in a requirement for the player to rely on additional movement options, by having huge maps or difficult (even impassable) terrain, ranged enemies that must be closed with quickly, etc. The player will naturally realize the necessity of relying on more powerful, but also more random movement options. This adds a new dynamic tactical element with a risk-benefit trade off. I will note that TOME4 has teleports of this nature, but does not really design around them.

Let's come up with a basic design around this concept. Instead of "Teleporting", you are "Tunneling". This is now a Dwarf rpg. Your party of Dwarves each pilot a different class of Mole-Mech. Each Mole-mech can only move 2-4 squares per turn (depending on class or equipment), but all of them can do a free Tunneling action to move 10 squares quickly and blindly, coming up within 3 squares of their chosen point. Mechs can tunnel once every 0.5-2 turns based on their class/perks/equipment. The player will be forced to use Tunneling in order to traverse the grid more quickly, breach difficult terrain, scout, interrupt enemy movents and formations, and so on. Some mechs create terrain or damage effects at the point of entry/exit/between, some stay underground until the end of the turn and repair before emerging, some skip the randomness and home in with exact precision to the location they want, and so on. We have achieved our goal of introducing randomness in movement without disrupting existing designs, adding a new dynamic tactical lever, more options for the player, more options for the designer. It's a great idea to build a game around.
 

Daemongar

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
Note to newfags: keep it brief. I ain't reading all that shit.

I could see a game take you base movement 10 and modify it by some variable based on character creation. Here is a bell curve of height. The mean is 5'9.5" or so. The country? America! The image? Incomplete! but I'm too lazy to find something better.

average.gif


A 10 movement would be the mean. However, shorter humans and non-humans would take smaller steps. Dwarves, women, fuzzies: they'd get smaller move bases. Taller humans, orcs, giants, big bitches - they'd get greater move bases. That does make sense. You take a large character and get a greater move base, while giving up AC, etc.
 

White Grey

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  • no touch base speed. risky
  • add new speed. random, but big power
  • big enemy, need to use new speed, but random!
  • use new big speed with random, compensate bad random with reliable weak base, or take bigger risk???
 

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